Liverpool Banter Archive November 17 2014

17 Nov 2014 14:30:40
Following on from an earlier thread regarding the owners level of investment and Teds management.

Let's put it this way, it's clear the owners haven't the first idea about football. They don't want to spend their own money so they employ a slick salesman type (Ted), who feeds them the spin at interview and they take the bait believing he's the man to implement their supposed gilt edged strategy in buying and selling assets (players) for financial gain whilst competing for champions league spots, all part of the hedging process designed to eliminate as much risk as possible during their journey to realising the £1 billion capital value.

I'm not by any means trying to absolve Ted here of his part in this mess but I think it should be appreciated that the ownership business model stinks and to a large extent they're getting what they deserve. They seem to want to dine at the top table but want to do it at 2 for 1 prices. The transfer policy is a joke, they knew Suarez was gone in November but left it until the 11th hour during the summer to bring in another striker the polar opposite to Suarez profile, purely as they thought there was latent value in Mario at £16 mill.

That point of view depends on how much influence you think FSG has or cares to have over the club's transfers.

While I have no idea how much they do or don't get involved, given I agree they (meaning really Henry and Werner in this case) know nothing really about individual players, I would suspect that while they probably reserve the right to approve/disapprove of any individual move, even against a unanimous committee, they are probably relying on the committee to make the case for those moves and simply acting on that advice where it is feasible to do so.

OH WOW (fubar)

Yes the problem now RDL is there's no one at LFC at both coaching or executive level experienced enough to tell Ted what to do. Teds just the owners stooge, it's a marriage made in hell.

That I agree with to an extent, Ozone. They need (in my opinion) a proper, experienced DoF to run that side of things to be their proxy and probably shouldn't have bent to BR when they brought him on. I get the committee is sort of supposed to be that, but committees by their nature are ineffective and can be prone to internal power struggles if the members of it are not equals.

It amazes me how short some people's memorys are, fsg saved us from near bankruptcy and have invested a lot on new players, yes they wasted a lot on the likes of Carroll etc but there yanks they don't know football, its our so called chief executives that spend the money and do the deal's. They got made a mug of by commoli and now Ayres doing the same, I'd rather have kept commoli Ayres a muppet

You lost me at 'rather kept Commoli'.

In terms of Teds current position, ask yourself this:-

1. Would you give Ted anymore more money to spend or more to the point, do you think the owners will give him any?

2. After 2.5 years and £65mill spend on defenders plus a couple of loans, do you think he's capable of getting the defence to function?

3. Do you ever think he will get a strike partnership to yield 55 goals again considering he's spent £40mill on 4 strikers he doesn't even rate.

If the answers 'No' to those question, Teds a goner.

17 Nov 2014 22:02:52
Your last post is pretty spot on Ozone dude!

40 million of that 60 million was on 2 centre backs who have played 1 game together as well Ozone.
We did win that game as well. So they are good. We think. We paid 40 million for them so they must be.
Its like me buying a hot tub time machine and never getting in it fella!!
What's going wrong people!!
My swede is done in.

Evening Eds, I've just spoke to a mate of mine, who posts quite a bit on here under the name 'Steian'; but his posts rarely get through. Is there any reason for this?

{Ed001's Note - no, it could well be that his connection is poor, so his posts never get to us, as I am not aware of ever deleting posts from him. I haven't seen a post from him in a long time that I can recall, and it was not deleted. It might be worth him switching off his internet router for 10min or so before coming online, to see if a reboot will sort it for him.}

Who`s Ted?

'Never give a boy a man's job', that's what they say.Rodgers is and was always going to be, well out of his depth at Liverpool.Like Moyes he'll disappear off the face of the earth, hopefully sooner rather than later !!

Dusty bin fame Ohio
Google

{Ed001's Note - 3 2 1!!!}

18 Nov 2014 07:48:10
Ted is a name for rodgers Ted rogers was a comedian from 1970s Britain very cheesy type of comedian hence the pub

18 Nov 2014 09:32:37
Thought yous meant Ted from the Mark Walberg film lol guys!!!

I can't believe there are still people like you lot questioning the owners financial comitment/investment in the club? questioning rodgers spending skills i understand. accusing the owners. or should they make themselves bankrupt.

Like you, I don`t know what else to they want from these owners who credit to them, have poured millions into the club to plug debts, fund transfers and expand the ground YET they still get stick. I`m not sure if people would STILL be happy with them even if they donated a kidney.

I know a bloke we nicknamed Ted, but it's really a shortening of the name "sh*t head".

17 Nov 2014 11:20:03
Our signings. .

IMO the only proper failed is Mario. The rest have done just about OK. Not talking about what we paid for them though :-)

Our new left and right backs look good and can only improve.

Stefan is obviously lacking confidence but he was actually the one player I thought when we signed him would make a difference to our side. I think he will come good.

Markovic showed at Benfica he is a quality player, he needs time to settle and I'm sure will be a big player for us in the future.

Emre has shown also he has the qualities needed to be a top player.

For me we did overspend on them but if they come good they will seem good value in years to come.

I know some say we wasted money but let's be honest with ourselves who in the world class bracket could we have attracted. .most foreign players will opt for a london club or massive wages that we cannot afford.

Mario as said is the major flop and in all our minds we knew it was a risk and rightly proved.

Only thing I will add is are these players so much better than what we have in the academy that we have to pay so much. .

Note. I'm not talking about money paid.

I have to say that I disagree mate, I would say that many of these players are good players and some of the blame around these players performances lies with the manager and the way we are set up .

I would say that these players on the whole have not performed well. Some have done ok but if the new additions had actually improved performances or even maintained them from last season we would not be discussing their ineffectiveness. I think being a good player is irrelevant if you don't perform .

Like I said I don't want to put all the blame on the players, they have not all been fit, used properly or bought in for the right reasons. That being said to say that they have done ok is putting a somewhat optimistic view on things in my view

My take:

Mingolet: Wrong keeper for us. He can't maintain his focus in the big games. Doesn't command his area. Can't sweep behind a high line. very poor distribution.

Vigouroux: why? is he better than Ward? No. waste of time.

Manquillo: No better than Kelly, Flanagan or Wisdom. Pointless.

Ilori: great player wrongly exiled due to his age.

Toure: good cheap signing who was brought in to replace Carraghers leadership only to be exiled.

Sakho: another good player who hasn't been given enough chances and has been replaced by Lovren.

Lovren: wrong player. Everyone was wrong here. He is neither the leader we expected, nor does he read the game well enough to make up for his lack of pace. It's just Skrtel but without the errors and better passing.

Cissokho: Actually not a bad left back wrongly exiled in favour of Glen Johnson (with Flanno pushed out of position). We out grew him anyway but he would've improved us last season in the short term.

Stewart: Ditto Vigouroux. Better youth players already at the club.

Moreno: a player with good potential who actually suits us. I still wish we'd just given B.Smith a go but at least Moreno looks to have talent. Still not great defensively yet though.

Sahin: excellent player in holding role. Wrongly pushed forward to accomodate Gerrard in a deeper role. Could've and should've been great.

Can: another promising youngster like Moreno/Ilori. Let's hope he isn't Brendaned like Ilori.

Allen: right player at the wrong time. Hendo upped his game to oust him, he never got a run in his proper position, then the style changed to one that didn't suit him and now he can't break back into the side.

Alberto: Jesus christ no. Suso, Teixeira and Coutinho are all better players. Why?

Lallana: great player but not what we needed even remotely for the same reasons as Alberto. We were well stocked in his position.

Coutinho: inconsistent but still young. Needs to be played in his correct position, not on the left wing!

Markovic: Honestly can't get my head around this one. Over paid for a player nowhere near ready for Premier league football when we needed an instant impact.

Moses: never really got a sustained run of games. Didn't suit our style of play even remotely last season.

Aspas: never given a chance in his favoured position due to SAS being too good. Didn't even get a chance this season.

Borini: another who has never been given a proper chance in his preferred position. Injuries haven't helped.

Lambert: his back seems to be holding him back. Either that or it's Rodgers again not wanting to play his own purchases.

Sturridge: absolute steal. Now in the top 5 strikers in the world in my opinion. Shame about the injuries.

Balotelli: I honestly though Rodgers would tame him. Clealry, I overestimated his man management abilities. More money wasted.

Origi: Why? We needed an instant replacement for Suarez. Why blow £10m on somebody who won't even be at the club when we were in dire need of some key positions including the one Origi plays in.

That is literally 24 players and enough to make a squad out of!

Arguably only Sturridge has been a resounding success. The rest were either unnecessary, misused, too expensive etc.

17 Nov 2014 13:42:36
Totally agree there,

I think that the initial FSG strategy has been thrown out the window .

Sturridge the only clear success in the transfer strategy .

Lallana although not needed will prove a good player .

I like Sakho , he is young experienced and will improve.


Sadly apart from the many millions of waste from the long list , its the long term damage to our Academy that I think will cost us for years to come.All the promising young players that will see little chance of progressing . Not to mention the inability to sign players that see Liverpool as a club with limited opportunities for Academy players .

Not good.

17 Nov 2014 15:12:50
EMS.
Sturridge in your top 5 strikers? Have you never seen
Lewandowski
Benzema
Suarez
Falcao
Ibrahimovic
Van Persie
Aguero
Neymar
Messi
Ronaldo
Diego Costa

TR1 when fit Sturridge is as good if not better than a lot of them. Your point is?

I think the fact that you think Van Persie is better than Sturridge makes your point null and void .

not many on that list I would swap sturridge

Falcao - physically finished
Van persie - finished
Ibrahimovic - end of his career
Benzema- personal opinion is that he has peaked although a good striker.
Neymar - fantastic player but would I swap right now .no
Lewandowski - no

The rest fair play there is a debate to be had .

17 Nov 2014 16:32:03
Tr1

Lewandowski – up there
Benzema – on his day unplayable but very often he’s distinctly average very often. He’s often jeered by his own crowd (France and Real) for lack of impact and lack of effort over long runs of games)
Suarez - up there
Falcao - talented striker no doubt but not one of the best – produced most of his best work in sub-standard leagues and only spent one year challenging against the best competition, where he was fairly ineffective against the top teams.
Ibrahimovic – up there, but is in decline and doesn’t do it like he used to
Van Persie – still a decent enough player but his best years are behind him and he’s not up at the top of the world anymore.
Aguero - up there
Neymar and Ronaldo – not actually strikers, not judged in the same way. Both play off the strikers/behind them/on the wings. Otherwise why no Bale? Or Muller? Or Goetze? Same position
Messi – of course up there
Diego Costa – good finisher but very rarely produces much outstanding and most of his goals are simple finishes and tap ins from other people’s work. Not to undervalue that sort of contribution at all, but it makes him a very different type of player and not one that I can say is one of the world’s best cause I don’t think he’s be able to support an underperforming team like the others.

So we have Lewandowski, Suarez, Aguero, Messi and Sturridge. If you want to argue the toss and say Ronaldo and Neymar have played up front then I’ll give you Ronaldo as well – Neymar still has a lot to prove and has hardly set the league alight, he was great in the WC but hasn’t lived up to the hype in Barca. So Sturridge is in the top 6 ish. Not bad going, and younger than most of those above him.

My top 5:
Suarez
Ibra
Aguero
Sturridge
Costa

Messi and Ronaldo aren't strikers for a start. Neymar is over rated. Benzema, Lewandowski are not as good overall for me. Falcao and Van Persie? Aren't they retired yet?

No bias at all there boys! Lol

How are we basing all this on current form? If so you can't have sturridge i there, he's been injured for a while.

Costa is ahead of studge. Falcao is truly world class and when fit will be ahead of studge, both have been injured. But falcaos history is much better.
Current form,
Suarez, aguero, messi (he is the central in the forward 3 for barca)costa, ibra, di natale, probably lewandowski, tevez, higuain. There's probably a whole heap that aren't being rated by us as brits cus we don't watch the leagues,
for example, castaginos, yilmaz, etc &muller is doing well when deployed as the striker etc. to say simply studge is top 5 in the world seems a little biased

@EMS, agree with a good few of yours

Mignolet - agree

Vigowho? - agree as never even heard of him so will take your word for it

Manquillo - strongly agree and his signing was a terrible idea.

Ilori - don't know but I would expect you are likely overstating him. We'd hear more about him and interest in him, etc. if he was already a great player.

Toure - I like and I would start him with Sakho. He's not exactly exiled but ya he is treated poorly.

Sakho - I'm a big fan, he just looks awkward but his passing is good and this seems to be most peoples issue with him.

Lovren - I'm a huge fan, he is letting me down massively. I'd have him on the bench for Toure showing some form and I'd have him get used to RCB for long-term playing with Sakho (I know now this won't be happening but wishful thinking).

Cissokho - he's muck. I'm sorry he did give his all and I admire his effort but he's nowhere near good enough.

Stewart - as with Vigoroux

Moreno - modern day full back, he is quick, he likes to go forward, he can't seem to defend so ya that fits the criteria for a full back nowadays.

B. Smith - are you related to Brad? :)

Sahin - every defensive midfielder in the world seems to fancy himself for the CAM role, well sorry every DM apart from Sahin.

Can - really liking the look of him.

Allen - will never be more than a good squad player, good. He was unlucky with injuries but that's a long time ago now.

Alberto - strongly agree, looking a pure waste.

Lallana - well stocked yes but he is an excellent player so I'm still happy we got him.

Coutinho - agree to a degree. I don't think he's consistent enough to deserve his central role so I'm happy enough him putting in a shift on the left. He let's games slip by him by so much in the centre that the wing forces him to work at least.

Markovic - well stocked as with Lallana but I agree here and I think this is where we could easily have saved a good chunk of cash with the likes of Ibe capable of fulfilling the same role.

Moses - never got a run of games because he never deserved it. He showed very little when he got a chance. Not good enough and better off where he is now.

Aspas - thankfully he didn't get his chance. He looked terrible. He's not getting a chance for Sevilla now either.

Borini - I'd be starting him right now. He needs to get more clinical but otherwise he's a good forward and he deserves a run.

Lambert - I think he's looked massively off the pace whenever he's played. He either needs a good rest or he needs constant games. I don't know but a few mins here and there isn't suiting him or us. What was he signed for? Sturridge injured, Balo not scoring and being slated and Borini trying to be kicked out yet Lambert still has barely played, so why did we sign him?

Sturridge - biggest overstatement of all and a fair few seem to agree with you. I think he's excellent but he is not at the top level and certainly not in the top 5. Neither are RvP or Falcao though

Balotelli - a bad gamble, a bad idea. Don't think he has been bad in that he needs to be tamed it's just he hasn't been good.

Origi - strongly agree. I wanted Bony myself in terms of who seemed to be available (I mean when we ended up getting Balotelli).

@hjikle Man your opinion on some players is just werid.

Falcao produced his best work at Atletico, in La Liga, where he was nigh on unplayable. To try and diminsh his standing as a player because he plays for the mancs is pretty poor - just admit he was world class and, if he recovers from his injury, will be world class again.

Your appraisal of Diego Costa is laughable as well - he bangs in tons of goals, works tirelessly and combines with team mates excellently - he might not skin 4 players a la Messi but he is still an outstanding forward.

Don't get me wrong I think Sturridge is an excellent player too and well worth mentioning in the same breath as the others, I just think you're being overly critical and dare I say biased against players who turn out for our rivals.

18 Nov 2014 08:18:44
Whatever you say Seano. It's nothing to do with who Falcao plays for now - he had 1 outstanding season in Spain and the rest of the time he's played in the sub standard French and Portuguese leagues. He also never produces any assists - quick check shows that in his best season he got 3. It's been over a season and a half, as well as a very long injury, since he's even faced a particularly good team (aside from one PSG game) never mind about actually showed a world class standard of football. For me, he has a long way to go to reach near the top of the world strikers again - to put it in context of when he was last producing anything against top teams - people were still expecting Torres to come good and he wasn't an unmitigated flop yet!

Deigo Costa has had a very good season. But for me, he just doesn't show the individual ability and all round game to get to the top of the world strikers. One of the more dangerous certainly, but I don't rate him as one of the best. Simple as.

Call it bias at much as you want - of the five best strikers I've ever seen live, only Suarez played for us and 3 played for direct rivals (Henry, Raul, Ibrahimovic, Drogba). The only bias I have is that Torres was probably up there but I can't admit it to myself anymore. You're welcome to rate who you like

Just my opinion lads. I'm fairly sure that since Sturridge signed for Liverpool, only Robaldo and Aguero have registered better goals to minutes ratios. Yes, he scores more frequently than both Suarez and Messi. It is a shame about his injuries or I'm sure you'd all be agreeing.

17 Nov 2014 09:56:38
There are 6 players who should but don't contribute enough to the team. Those are Balo, Borini, Allen, Johnson, Enrique and Mignolet. At their age they should be solid players. They aren't youngsters so they really have no excuse. Even if they are not playing regularly they should be ready to come in and seize the opportunities they get.

Red Rum

17 Nov 2014 10:16:05
I do not see what Joe Allen has done wrong for me is an important member of the squad.

Allen is an ok player but for me doesn't have enough in his locker to succeed at a club like Liverpool.

Red Rum

17 Nov 2014 10:33:59
Joe Allen plays to the extent of his ability, tries very hard and is a great squad member. Unfortunately his price tag means people expect first team starter quality and he most certainly isn't that. He needs to learn how to finish though cause right now he's a liability when we get into shooting chances.

Everyone else in that list I agree with though, but would add Skrtel

Disagree with Allen. Our midfield looks so much better when he is there. He is not there to score and assist goals. He is there to help control the game and recycle possession so we can attack more frequently.

If Rodgers played him in his correct position he would thrive; especially in this boring metronome system Rodgers is enforcing. Sadly, it will require dropping Gerrard so Allen isn't stuck babysitting him like Henderson and Can are. Fat chance of Rodgers doing that.

17 Nov 2014 11:17:46
East Midlands Scouser - I agree that he's not there to score and assist, he's there to enable play. But as a midfielder, and not a holding midfield at that, so he will find himself in forward positions at times. In football at the level we're hoping to play, it doesn't matter who you are - every player on the field needs to have the confidence and ability to give beating the keeper or sliding it round the last defender a decent try. Look at teams like Munich, Real and even Chelsea - is there a single person in that team, no matter what position, that you wouldn't expect to try to shoot with a clear sight of goal from 12 yards out and at least hit the target? Allen's high profile misses (e.g. vs Everton last year) have affected him and he needs to be over it

17 Nov 2014 11:21:58
Allen has done ok, IMO he gives the ball away to much in important areas, he is at best a squad player. I wouldn't want him to play in the big games as he offers little going forward.

Allen scored more goals last season from open play than Gerrard. He can score goals when he is given a sustained run in the team. He proved that at Swansea. He could do with working on that side of his game but it's not fair to say he isn't adding anything to the team just because he doesn't directly influence the scoreline. Henderson doesn't score much more than him to be honest. Where is his abuse? Neither does Coutinho and they both play way more football with far more freedom to attack (or at least they did last season).

I'm not disagreeing that he needs to add goals to his game. I just think it's unfair to brand him useless because he doesn't score. Might as well call out our entire midfield in that case.

Here's a stat for you, if you don't include Gerrards penalties, Skrtel scored more goals than all of our midfielders excluding Sterling. It's a problem that runs deep in our team. Not just a whip to hit Allen with; probably the guy who gets the least game time of the lot of them.

EMS who is abusing Allen? Because from what I have read everyone seems to be in agreement that he is a good squad player. For me he is one of those players that we wouldn't miss if he was sold. You need to stop over hyping players all the time.

Red Rum

''Allen scored more goals last season from open play than Gerrard''

Where do you get these stats from EMS? Joe allen scored 1 goal last year in open play, stevie G scored 3.

Aaaah I see you're not including free kicks, even so, he still didn't score MORE then SG. He scored the same.

For me Joe Allen isn't any good at holding players off, passing forward, defending, going wide, he slows a lot of Liverpools forward play down(A la fabregas for arsenal).I can go on. In midfield he certainly needs to add to his goals and assists.

Allen scored 1 in a cup game. Gerrard scored zero. You can't include headers from corners as open play goals. In that respect they both got 1 each though. No I didn't include free kicks because I reckon I could've got 2 if I'd taken as many as Gerrard did last season.

Nobody is abusing Allen mate. I just disagree with who you think is letting down the side. Allen barely gets a chance but when he does he does a sound job.

Mingolet, Johnson, Skrtel, Lovren, Gerrard, Markovic and Balotelli on the other hand! Admittedly Markovic is used sparingly but a player of his kind should be a useful impact sub and yet he comes on and the only impact he has is making our right side ineffective going forward and completely exposed defensively.

I don't think Allen is excellent by any means. I just don't think you can point the finger at him for being totally mismanaged. So far his only extended run of first team football since signing nearly 2 and a half years ago was at defensive midfield where he doesn't even specialise and that was just to cover Gerrard and Lucas who were both injured. He won a series of Man of the match awards and then that philosophical god that is AlanShearer made a completely uneducated comment about him only passing sideways which caused everyone in the country to turn on him including half of the Liverpool fan base. Then he got injured and by the time he'd returned, Henderson and Gerrard had nailed down the midfield roles and we'd signed Coutinho and Sturridge so he never really got another chance.

I just disagree with saying he isn't doing enough when that is the fault of nobody but the managers.

I like Allen because he does not give the ball away as much as other players in our squad.
I would rather Allen or Lucas passing the ball around than most to be honest.
They are appreciated by others due to the fact that they can be trusted to play a simple pass or a one two.
Players who collect the ball from the defense and distribute it well like Allen are worth their weight in gold.
We don't have enough of them.
Our centre backs only have trust in giving it to Gerrard (no criticism of Gerrard mind but it really affects our play).
I want Allen, Gerrard, Lallana and Couthino to have the ball in midfield rather than the Centre backs.
The problem is Skertel and Lovren think they are Centre Mids and not Centre backs so they don't give a simple pass inside or sometimes just don't pass to Allen at all.
I feel sorry for the lad.
Part of our problem this season is that we keep giving the ball away. CONSTANTLY.
Moreno can pass it, Johnson can pass it. But Skertel and Lovren can't so our opposition simply wait for Skertel and Lovren to give them the ball back while cutting off all other outlets.
We need to be braver on the ball and not always look to go back and sideways and most importantly we need to be patient, especially the centre halves.
If I was picking a side at the moment I would be filling it with players who can be trusted to keep the ball.
A team of footballers. Funnily enough. Not divvies like Skertel and Lovren.

Why can't you include headers from corners as open play goals? That's exactly what they are.

18 Nov 2014 08:26:15
Generally speaking, goals from free-kicks and corners are not considered goals from open play, they are considered part of the set piece.

For me a set piece goal is only when it goes in directly from the kick, but I see your point. BTW Gerrard didn't take that many free kicks last year, Suarez was the main free kick taker.

17 Nov 2014 04:17:32
really disappointed to see so many reds on this page becoming such humourless, reactionary and, dare i say, entitled eejits. be careful what you wish for, we could end up turning worse than spurs if we go down this rodgers out road. obviously we're going through a bad patch and there are circumstances people not achieving their best. guess what. sometimes teams go through a patch of bad form. our players aren't playing well, the manager's not getting the best out of them for now, so the trannys look poor while that's happening but it only takes 2 or 3 wins or so before everyone changes their bloody tune. look at newcastle. what happened to getting behind the team and the joy of being a football fan. still in cl, still in league cup. still can get top 4, still have promising players who can make us dream again. just don't understand all the entitlement. really thought reds were better than that. YNWA

{Ed001's Note - nothing to do with entitlement. Shows how little you understand if that is what you think it is about. It is to do with having an arrogant, overly stubborn manager who is overspending and talking nonsense, while not being able to back it up with results on the pitch. Comparing it with Newcastle is just ridiculous. It is not even close to the same situation. All of the Newcastle fans know Pardew is managing with one hand tied behind his back by Ashley and that is the main issue there. A lot don't like the manager too, but the main frustration is Ashley who they can't do anything about, so Pardew was just getting the brunt of it.}

Well said, Ed! That is the issue I and many fans have w/ BR. Comparing his issues w/ Pardew`s is an ill-advised comment.

Spoon lord is one of the many blind supporters being swindled by Brendan and his fancy talks. Comparing Brendan to Pardew is simply ridiculous. Pardew has done well with the players he has and the negativity surrounding the boardroom at St. James Park. He does not get much funds in the transfer market unlike Brendan who has the habit of wasting whatever money FSG gives him. His tactics are mediocre and theoretical. He talks big, but the results on the pitch are below expectations. Not sure how much patience FSG will have with a manager who is well out of his depth at LFC, though Mr Henry has to take the blame for giving an inexperienced manager the job in the first place.

I'm not denying rodgers has an ego or talks too much or that his transfers haven't worked out YET. but we're only a quarter or so into the season and people are already calling for his head and to me that is the bleatings of entitled, knee jerk fans who were probably singing his praises and lauding his tactical acumen last season when we were doing so well. i only use newcastle to point out how fickle the narratives that get weaved around clubs are and how a few wins or performances can lighten the mood. doesn't help that we lost 3 games before an international break and everyone has too much time on their hands to get pissed off, it's crap but do we as fans really want to build a movement of negativity against the manager or do we want to support the team.? we all hoped for better results by now. it's not going to plan but i don;t think we;re at a total crisis point yet and there's still hope for improvement. fair play if we keep playing boring footy and finish 8th i'd expect rodgers to go. but i really think sacking rodgers midseason would be disastrous and risks turning us into spurs and spurs are pathetic. who we going to get realistically? de boer? i'm not so sure. probably someone like pulis! give him a chance to turn it around. get behind the manager and the team for the rest of the season, it could be more fun than this YNWA

{Ed001's Note - I am sorry but I disagree, and all the last few months of the previous season did was give him the chance to start this season as manager and show it was down to him. He has shown it wasn't down to him, and the rest of his failings were already enough to make him lucky to have the chance to even get another season.}

I'm not swindled by brendan, he's not doing well at the moment. he can be annoying. he's been a dafty he just needs to show some more balls. i acknowledge this. i just think it's beyond daft to call for his head at this stage of the season when so much in footy is about luck and momentum which is what i was refering to re: toon.

well run clubs change managers in the summer. everyone has opinions, i just think by reading this site you'd think all lfc fans are BR out and i don't think that's true at all. i think the structure and long term planning of the club could be improved a great deal and i hope FSG and BR can sort it.

Spoonlord, u talk about well run clubs changing managers only in the summer. Ever heard of a club named Chelsea? They changed managers midway through a season a number of times because the team was struggling and failing to adapt to the manager's system, and it won them the UCL and the FA cup (multiple occasions i think under Hiddink and Di Matteo). Not to forget Chelsea are a very well run club in spite of all the money they spend. Schalke are another example who have changed managers midway and actually got better. This notion of sacrificing the present for the future is absolute rubbish. Only deluded LFC fans believe in it bcoz of the excuses recent LFC managers have come up with. Brendan had his chance and blew it. Apart from Sturridge and Coutinho, the rest of his signings have either flopped or he does not rate them himself yet bought them for reasons known only to him, just shows how poor his judgement is in the transfer market. He sacrificed a winning formula for his own which had already failed previously, just shows how arrogant and deluded he is.
Also u only get luck and momentum in football if the players and manager know what they are doing, at this point of time this cannot be said about anyone at LFC. Brendan by wasting FSG's resources without giving the desired results is standing in the club's way of achieving long term financial stability. His failure to make use of a talented youth academy just shows his lack of faith in youth, Brendan giving youth a chance is a myth. Sterling and Flanno only got a chance due to lack of options in the squad. If Brendan had been given 100 million to spend in his very first season, neither Sterling or Flanno would have seen first team football in any capacity at LFC.

So sl you think it is acceptable to sell one player after finishing second, spend 8 weeks spunking £120m up the swanney on mediocrity and players we did not need. Then spend the beginning of the next season playing slow bland football, a complete dichotomy from what took you to 2nd the last season and refuse to change it to the point where you are 5 points off relegation. But we should not question this and blindly follow like lemmings straight off the cliff. Now i'm not calling for his head just yet but this entitled argument really gets my goat who are you to be judging the rest of us and to what standards. yours my friend?

The only entitlement on these pages are from fans entitled to voice their opinion.
I get lots of disagree's and some agree's when I post but I don't then come on here and call every poster this and that for not agreeing with me. .

Well I do but the Eds don't allow them through for some reason!

I do respond to people's comments but always politely (I think), and that is he way it should be.
I can handle people not agreeing with me but I can't stick personal abuse.
I don't want Rodgers sacked yet.
I have not received any criticism from anyone for having that view.
I think that's quite refreshing to be fair.
My reason for wanting him to stay is quite simple really.
He has been here for 2 and a half years or so.
1st 6 months= Awful.
Next 18 months= Absolutely brilliant.
Last 3 months= Back to crap.
We have spent more time playing well under this manager than playing poorly and for that reason I am happy for Rodgers to carry on as boss FOR NOW.

17 Nov 2014 11:26:38
So do you all think that if Suarez would have stayed and we kept the same squad we would be doing as well as we did last season.

So basically he was the only reason for our success, BR and the rest had nothing to do with it.

I'm at a loss as to the argument to say it's all BR's fault because he's stubborn.

The same argument could be put to all managers.

Well said JonnyBarnes. Whilst I disagree with your stand point on Rodgers, I accept it.

For me though he was awful for the first 6 months, good for the two after we signed Sturridge and Coutinho. Then he had a shocking summer window. Then he was awful for the first 4 months but Suarez kept us in contention. Then after his Biesla advice he was brilliant for 3 months. He then bottled it in the last month of the season. Then he had another shocker in the transfer window and has started this season absolutely awful again.

That's what, 5 months of good football? 4/5 transfer windows that were atrocious?

I can see why you want to stick by him. I only hope you also have an open mind and can accept why others want him gone.

EMS. absolutely I can understand why some people have turned.
Even I have turned from being certain he was the right man at the start of the season to not being sure now.
I have been watching the same car crash start to the season as everyone else.
In my opinion though, there are extenuating circumstances.
1. Suarez.
2. Sturridge.
3. Losing the league title ( I don't care what anyone says you have to be on a psychological downer after coming so close and playing so well.

If we had the same players that we had last year and we were sat in 12th place then I would be rioting to get him out, but that's not the case.
I said right at the start of the season that I would not judge this team for 3 months due to the issues stated above.
Well my 3 month appraisal is nearly up and at the moment were shabite but that may change over the next few weeks.
I honestly think if you watch the last 2 performances against Madrid and Chelsea without a bias for or against Rodgers and compare them to the performances against Newcastle, Basel, Villa and QPR they have shown a marked improvement.
We did not get any points, I accept that, but I think the improvement in performance is there so hopefully the result and performance we all want is not far away.
Still crapping it over Palace though:)
I would also argue that it was Sturridge not Suarez who saved Liverpool's early form last season as Luis was busy picking Ivanovic's arm out of his teeth with a steak pick whilst getting splinters in his arse for the first 2 months.

For me, while I wouldn't exactly be crying myself to sleep if BR were to go, I'm happy to have him see out the games through Boxing Day and see where we're at which I think would take us through game 19. If still nearer the bottom then the top, then at that point I'd likely be jumping wholesale on the train to Sackville.

That said, I do think the return of Sturridge will help paper over the many, many cracks a bit and it wouldn't surprise me to see us sat around 7th/8th end of the year in which case BR gets the rest of the season as well to set things right.

No CL though at the end and this summer I would get rid and put into place a proper DoF/manager combination.

I agree with that RDL.

Appreciate your thoughts all,
apologies for coming on a bit strong with "entitled" after a few ales last night. a bit of an incendiary word. surprised it slipped through the net actually!
jonnybarnes you put it better than i did.
hoping rodgers gets to the end of the season, and we turn things around. that is all. we have some good players and a good manager, think he's just a bit lost at the mo.

No apology needed Spoon.
I hope you don't mind me calling you Spoon because there is no way I am calling anyone Spoonlord without knowing what it means first?
What does it mean?
Sounds like a fetish. Or is that just me?
Your post sparked a debate. Democracy in action.
In my head though I run this site!!
Like Sammy Lee ran Liverpool:)
ha ha

16 Nov 2014 19:06:26
Ed001, what happened to Marc Pelosi? Will he be moved on? He looked pretty amazing in the reserves. He was supposed to be our 'Gareth Barry'. Not heard about him at all since he got injured.

{Ed001's Note - he has not long come back from the injury, just finding his feet again.}