Liverpool Banter Archive May 19 2016

 

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19 May 2016 22:20:09
Just got back from last night and the frustration and disappointment and heartache etc.
We could've had a couple of pens first half and gone in 2 or 3 up at half-time but . oh well, you know what happened. You know that Moreno is a really awful defender, Mignolet's a poor keeper and a few of our Superstars aren't too great when we're losing (Sturridge, Coutinho etc. )
Jurgen Klopp is a very good manager but. well, let's give him a chance to assemble his own squad.
Big thumbs-up to Kolo Toure and Emre Can but a lot of work needs doing in the Summer as regards to the entire squad.

Believable4 Unbelievable3

19 May 2016 23:32:23
My jack russel just starting playing with his Liverpool ball again so it's time I picked myself up as well, reading through the posts last couple of days tells me how much we want success here at LFC, there are differently good days ahead. Can England win the Euros, sure they can.


20 May 2016 05:08:05
Thumbs up to can for what? He was part of the reason we crumbled in midfield and was one of the players at fault for their third goal. Didn't have a good game at all.


19 May 2016 21:58:58
Eds and everyone else, what are your views on Coutinho? For me, has ability but he just doesn't do enough. Last night- and in many big games- the game just passed him by.
Maybe it's the players around him.
I mean the other two number 10's are the same and if Sturridge plays we look light in midfield.
I just can't make my mind up about him.
Cheers.

Believable2 Unbelievable2

19 May 2016 22:56:20
I'm kind of the same. He is still young but he is very one dimensional. Can only go right. he needs to improve but I believe he will.


19 May 2016 23:11:36
Agreed. 3 CAMS (number 10's) is not the best situation playing in the three roles in the 4-2-3-1 formation. I think it should consist of 1 number 10 and 2 wingers who can be inverted- the Reus type players and even the Milner type who can get up an down, invert and can add industry to midfield if the 2 holders are getting swarmed.


19 May 2016 23:26:41
I disagree. He is our best player, and has shown on plenty of times his pedigree in big games. Man Utd and Dortmund in the Europa League, Man City, Spurs and Chelsea in the PL, Man City in the League Cup Final, West Ham in the FA Cup replay are all examples of his big game contributions this season alone. This he doesn't perform on the big stage is absolute nonsense IMO, and has evidently been the difference in big games.

I agree he can still improve and be consistent, but he has shown that he has improved every season he has been here, and I think Klopp can make him go another level.


19 May 2016 23:50:20
He seems a great lad and there is no doubting he has a great talent, but we don't see that talent demonstrated as often as we need to.
To be fair wide forwards are often accused of drifting out of games, when it is more down to the ball not reaching their area very much- but
If we seriously want to challenge for a CL place, we need a left sided forward who will be a constant thorn in the side of the opposition. We need a player with a great touch, good finishing, energy, vision, good pace, a non stop battling attitude and clever fast one touch attacking play.
He has all those things (except perhaps the fighting attitude), but we just don't see them often enough.
He needs to pick up his game and soon, or I think Klopp will be trying out other players in his position, and he may end up losing his automatic starting place, as crazy as that might sound.
I would rather sacrifice some of that magic touch for more consistency and a stronger presence throughout a game.
Last night was not the first game where his contribution has been minimal- there have been a dozen games like that this season.


19 May 2016 23:54:53
I agree with both replies. I don't like playing all three of them; they all want to play centrally.
I'd have sacrificed one of them and stiffened the midfield up. Or just played one of them, gone two up top and still have the extra midfielder. We have no real wide players so why ask attacking midfielders to fill in there? I'd sooner have another striker and ask them to drift out wide. At least Sturridge and Origi offer more pace and power if not ideally suited to the role.


20 May 2016 04:44:43
Are there people having a pop at Phil?! Oh my God!


20 May 2016 06:07:24
He is a magnificent player who gets no help from others around him most of the games except Firmino. The players behind him are useless at best. We look upto him week in week out and that's a pressure on the lad.
3 years and over £300 mill spend and still the most critical player in the squad. He is having the same issues as Sanchez at Arsenal. Too much pressure and expectations.


19 May 2016 20:40:30
I'm hugely disappointed about the result last night; how we played and the fact that I believe we could have beaten them 9 times out of 10. Also being in the Champions League would have been a huge bonus.

What is done is done - time to be positive; this means we will have a minimum 40 games next season; an opportunity to get in the top 4 with time to train, implement ideas and gain rest.

Also we should be able to do this with a smaller squad meaning we can clear more of the average squad out and give opportunities to a select few youngsters.

Hopefully not too many players on loan and bring the wage bill down considerably.

Believable3 Unbelievable4

19 May 2016 22:11:20
Don't shoot me down, But I can't see us getting into top 4. All three off Chelsea, UTD and Liverpool have same number of games next season. Then there would be drastic difference between the quality of the sides next season. City wouldn't drop out as well a settled Wenger.

Very very slim chance unless we pull some top quality players.


20 May 2016 00:48:13
Kova, yes we have same games as united and chelsea, but please do not forget we will have superior fitness with 3 sessions of training in pre-season. We should be able to press as well as Spurs or better for 90min unlike united or Chelsea.


20 May 2016 02:57:01
United and Chelsea are in Europa mate.


20 May 2016 05:09:52
United are in Europa so they have more games than us, Chelsea are not on Europa so they have same amount of games as us.


19 May 2016 20:15:09
Can you see the disappointment of this season result in us buying a ton of new players for the fourth summer window in a row?
I hope to God we don't, with Grujic coming in and us being linked already with a mass amount of players it seems like there's another season of transition to come.
I'm hoping we get a top class keeper and a left back. That would be enough for me, and if we could get gotze for the reported 16-20 million then that would be a improvement on the first team replacing lallana who I like but doesn't contribute enough.
I'm waffling but please don't sign another ten players again.

Believable3 Unbelievable5

19 May 2016 20:34:35
It wouldn't be enough for me, over half of these are bang average end of.


19 May 2016 20:45:05
Well we second top scorers in league since Klopp took over, so attacking wise we aren't terrible as per usual it's the defence. Might as well just go out and get a couple of proper improvements instead of getting another ten players to replace the ones we bought last year.


19 May 2016 20:48:44
Tbh most of the overhaul should be in offloading players.

Hard to say but maybe 3-4 attention including the already agreed ones.

Trying to be more level headed and not expected instant success, just want signs of improvement.


19 May 2016 20:52:30
Frisky did you notice that gaping hole in midfield that Seville kept running through?


19 May 2016 23:40:03
Fop, that hole has been there all season. Our centre midfield is a genuine weakness.


20 May 2016 05:11:07
Yeah like grujic is going to improve us so much. As if.


19 May 2016 19:27:58
Well the season is over finally.

No more to be said about last night. Big disappointment.

However let's get a bit of perspective and optimism back before we all start looking forward to the transfer window madness.

The best things that have happened this season

First and by far the most important is that the 96 and their families friends and supporters have finally got justice.

Secondly we have got Jurgen as our manager. Basel will really hurt him and he will use it to spur him on to get things sorted. He won't forget the lessons learned and he will not rest unti we are a bloody awesome red machine,

Thirdly Ed 001 got into a bit of bother and the response to the call to help made by Benny was just brilliant and it made me proud of our community on this site. It was YNWA in action.

LFC is truly the best football club in the world.

Believable9 Unbelievable3

19 May 2016 18:13:17
I was watching Undercover Boss and the boss was named Bob. And lo and behold - he had a staff who was named . Paisley. I kid you not.

It's a sign, I tell u! We're going to dominate soon! Haa.

Believable5 Unbelievable6

19 May 2016 22:54:35
Watch one episode where boss Unai and he had staff name Moreno. didn't like it.


19 May 2016 18:05:45
Eds fellow reds, I've calmed down a bit now . But I can take losing a game as good as anyone if lfc have played well and lost . but what get my back up is all these so called super stars who only want to play when they feel like it . i would rather klopp by players for £1 million but know they will work hard for the shirt . Danny ings is a prime example.8million but will chase every ball . lallana £26 million still chasing shadows . end of season rant done . Have a great summer Eds and fellow reds . Let's see what next year bring .

Believable6 Unbelievable10

19 May 2016 19:11:38
I though Lallana closed down well in fairness. Still lacks end product but nobody can fault his work rate!


19 May 2016 20:09:15
Look we had our chances to close the game out first half but didn't take them.

Second half the early goal floored us and we got battered simple as that.

Our troubles lie in defence as they have done for the past 4 or 5 years.

Moreno has got to go its just far to easy for opposing teams to put us under pressure down the left hand side, and let's face it the lads a screw loose.

A lot of new managers start next season but klopp has had his settling in period and had a proper chance to asses the squad before the transfer window.


19 May 2016 20:24:31
Agree re Moreno - defensively he is a joke, got nutmegged for the goal when he should have just clobbered the guy - rubbish.

Lallana - why do people keep posting - 'Klopp likes him' - for the price we paid he is rubbish. Doesn't score and never stamps his authority on anything. Please please sell and buy midfielders cause he is soft as melted cheese.

2nd half we lost our shape completely - we needed changes on 60 mins as we were getting trampled.

Before we forget - Sturridge's goal was sheer brilliance :-)


19 May 2016 21:04:17
Only want to play when they feel like it? You think the players at half time decided "ok let's get dominated this half. This will be fun". I don't get that argument. No sane athlete would adopt that mentality. We lost. Someone has to.


19 May 2016 21:55:42
Price is irrelevant now, if his main strength is 'running around' we could get mo Farah on a free (well not really there will be a signing on fee ;) ) if the team press then we need quality to take chances when they come. Lallana may win the ball back more than most but if you turn it over 10 times and score 0, what's the point?


19 May 2016 22:05:59
Tjred . kingluis here . are you saying you were happy with the amount of effort Liverpool players put in last night .


19 May 2016 22:57:43
It wasn't a matter of effort? We just got outplayed. Have you ever played a sport? Never lost to a team you shouldn't have?


19 May 2016 23:43:07
No they gave up, their players were running through our midfield while our midfield just stood around watching. You can be outplayed but still make it difficult for the opposition. They threw in the towel as soon as they scored and froze like rabbits in the headlights, no mental strength whatsoever.

Some gave up before the game started ala coutinho, so yes they can be critisized for that performance. But its done now and on we go, i hope klopp will learn from his mistakes.


19 May 2016 18:04:12
Hi eds,
Do you expect Liverpool to try get some business done before the euros or is it impossible to put a time frame on things.
Regards
Ronan.

Believable0 Unbelievable4

{Ed001's Note - you mean like Matip and Grujic? The club always look to get deals done as early as possible.}

19 May 2016 18:36:29
Hopefully the club can tie up deals for Karius and a LB as soon as possible. It will give them time to bed in and adapt to the culture until the new season kicks in. The last thing we need going into 2016/ 17 is Migs and Moreno still in our first team.
Btw Ed001, any progress on transfers apart from Grujic and Matip of course?


{Ed001's Note - I am not sure, I have mostly been sick in bed the last few days with man flu.}

19 May 2016 17:38:54
Hi ed001 if your around mate couple of questions but firstly hope you got your move all sorted and your not emailing from Dubai central prison haha.
I know we don't know sakho punishment but do you think the club are going to stand by him?
We all know the teams weaknesses gk and full backs, fingers crossed flanno gets his form back so that's one problem solved, but lb I can't think of any top lb that we could get, do you know who Klopp maybe looking at or who you would consider? Thanks mate.
Up the pool.

Believable0 Unbelievable2

{Ed001's Note - don't worry not in prison and everything is pretty much sorted thanks to everyone on here and friends and family that helped me out.

The club are standing by him, from what I have been told.}

19 May 2016 21:10:07
Im so glad your all sorted ed just glad we were all able to help you out, my faith in man kind was a little restored seeing all the posts on here, you certainly deserved it though. Thanks for the reply buddy.
Up the pool.


19 May 2016 17:29:43
Anyone think not starting Allen was a mistake to attacking?

Dortmund was the same two center mids doesn't convince me in Europe.

Believable2 Unbelievable7

19 May 2016 17:48:31
I don't think it was a mistake. Allen has shown decent form while coming on as a sub in recent games, but whenever he has started, he has looked nothing but average.


19 May 2016 18:17:38
Personally I would of had can and Allen in middle with Milner on right of the 3. Then dropped firmino to bench as he was next to usless anyway.


19 May 2016 18:15:23
Not playing a third midfielder was the downfall. When you being pressed down and pegged back to your own half, you need an additional body in the middle.

We should have bought one in immediately once we conceded.


19 May 2016 18:40:11
Firmino had a good game, first half we were dominant but no way I would of started Allen, he is not good enough, we missed Henderson though, we are not as good when he is not in the side.


19 May 2016 19:37:02
Playing Allen in the centre from the start so that Milner could have played left back would have improved the team.

I would also have switched Coutinho to the right when Origi came on, where they were obviously weaker, as he was in their RB's pocket.

Ahh hindsight.


19 May 2016 20:36:46
Is that what you think a good game is?


19 May 2016 21:53:02
Playing 3 in the middle only really makes a difference if one of them can tackle, disrupt and generally protect us. We don't have those options readily available so maybe just attacking more was the main option.


20 May 2016 06:39:08
Not starting Lucas as DM was the biggest mistake. I know most Liverpool fans hate him, but he is our best DM by far.


19 May 2016 17:14:55
Are we looking .....

Believable0 Unbelievable3

{Ed002's Note - This is the Liverpool page - we don't deal with random names you come up with.}

19 May 2016 15:59:17
Eds, thanks for the work you put in. Like every true red hurting at the mo, please cheer us up with your knowledge and tells us everything's going to be alright.

Believable1 Unbelievable4

{Ed002's Note - Yes but Klopp needs to change. He wasn't won anything for years and as I have explained on multiple occasions, the system has been found out.}

19 May 2016 21:06:02
I agree with Ed002. I think the pressing system works well against teams who want to control possession. But we can't be 1 dimensional. Still very optimistic for next season though!


19 May 2016 22:36:17
To be fair Klopp has adapted and change since day 1 in bpl. Pressing and running at opposition is done with purpose but our fitness and players isn't up to it yet. Spurs been doing it all season. The point is we need leaders on field and to shore up defence. Added grit needed, just take a look at Athletico Madrid encounter with Barcelona and bayern, that's the kind of sporit5and mentality the players need to compete at highest level.


19 May 2016 17:57:59
Can Ed01 and Ed02 have a mini podcast on why one thinks the system has been found out and the other doesn't. Even answer on here if possible. I'd like to listen to both of your opinions if possible.

Cheers.


{Ed002's Note - I am not sure that the truth will help in such matters.}

19 May 2016 18:21:33
Ed002, I appreciate all of your objective insights on LFC. You mention that Klopp needs to change his system. Whose job is it at the LFC or at any football club to work with the coach and review team methods? Coaches/ People in power can get very stuck to their own ways and anyone who works under them may not question those approaches. Do third parties ever get involved with working with a coach, or will a coach look for help from colleagues if they are in doubt?

Cheers,


{Ed002's Note - I think it is a case for Klopp himaelf.}

19 May 2016 15:03:34
Hey ed002, after last night's disappointment could you cheer us all up by giving us some news? You mentioned that Ian Ayre would be working hard today, would that be on Zielinski and/ or Karius? Or someone else?
Many thanks.

Believable0 Unbelievable2

{Ed002's Note - Nothing to do with transfers.}

19 May 2016 19:06:42
Probably picking some new furniture for his new office at standard chartered haha.


19 May 2016 19:23:33
I can

I've just seen Jordi Alba and Sergio Ramos at John Lennon.


19 May 2016 21:41:12
I saw thomas Muller getting the bus to Liverpool from Manchester airport and gotze was on the Belfast to Liverpool ferry. Both said they are looking forward to European nights at Anfield next season.

Baz.


19 May 2016 18:26:43
He's got a dinner date. He's doing breaded garlic mushrooms for the starter, beef wellington with asparagus and gravy for the main course, and homemade Crème Bru Lé for the dessert.

There's a lot of work goes into impressing a lady as prestigious as Ed002. Hope the date goes well Ed. Don't you dare ride his Harley on the first date though!


19 May 2016 14:19:58
Ed002,

Are you in a position to advise what the matter ian ayre is dealing with today please?

Regards

Crooky.

Believable0 Unbelievable2

{Ed002's Note - He is dealing with the problems that caused two sets of charges to be levied at the club.}

19 May 2016 19:22:24
Anything to do with tapping up Zielinski?


{Ed002's Note - No, but I understand that yet another charge is to come.}

19 May 2016 13:31:19
Reminded me of Hatton V Mayweather. We got clocked on the chin early in the second half and folded. Game was over by the 46th minute. We are lightweight and last night showed us up as an 8th place team in a second tier cup competition getting knocked out of the park.
Think we had one shot on target in the second half.
No fighters. No men on the pitch. No McMahon, no Souness, no Hansen, no Grobelaar, no leaders. No one who would frighten anyone. We are a decent low weight team when in full flight but we had 8 or 9 glass chins on the pitch last night.
Hats off to Toure. MOTM. Why Firmino was taken off is beyond me.
Not good enough :
Lallana
Milner
Moreno
Clyne
Mignolet

And our worst player was Coutinho with Can not far behind. No midfield. Headless chickens behind them. No service to Sturridge.
Big summer ahead. A huge amount of dross to clear out otherwise we are going to be Southampton for the next few years. A nice team that will float in the 7/ 8 position with a couple of decent cup runs.

A couple of players who will eat the heads off our own ones when the chips are down would be a start. As stated elsewhere, we need to find leaders again all over the pitch. Motherf&@kers without glass chins. As good as pressing and passing are, you also need to stick the knife in when ahead and bully teams off the pot we missed out on last night. We are too nice. There was a time when we were mean and won things.

Believable11 Unbelievable11

19 May 2016 19:44:41
So we get Cattermole then? can't just bring in a hard man. Need to be able to play the game too. Not even the much talked about def. mid. would do it. DM/ CM with leadership, good passing both long and short, and solid tackling. Hmmm. sounds like someone familiar. Young Stevie G? Or the light version: Hendo.


19 May 2016 21:53:33
Gerrard was never a central midfielder. Had his best season playing behind Torres.
If you think Souness is like Cattermole, fair play to you. Henderson is light, I agree. That's the problem with him. He is as anonymous on the pitch as he is in interviews. And he is still a waste of £20million. Add that to 25 for Lallana, 18 for Balotelli, 12 for Moreno, 12.5 for Clyne, 32.5 for Benteke, 20 for Markovic. jesus wept.
Please can we get another Mascherano, a Makele, an Essien, a Busquets - someone who knows how to be the boss of the ball.

Hendo out. Lallana out. Can on the bench for a while. Milner out.


19 May 2016 23:57:12
Hendo out and can on the bench. my good god.


20 May 2016 17:16:58
Your good god knows nothing about football.


19 May 2016 13:23:26
Hey eds! Heard about oliviera lincoln of gremio? what's your opinion on him? he is younger than me!

Believable0 Unbelievable1

{Ed001's Note - don't know much about him sorry.}

19 May 2016 13:24:14
Was never fussed about goetze coming due to the amount of players in his position but we lacked the bit of class last night, the killer final ball which could of won us the game. I like lallana he works hard but I'm not sure he has the spark that a goetze could bring to the side which could be the difference between winning and not winning. yes we have Phil but how much better would the side look with him goetze firmino sturridge. Last night has left me devastated like all liverpool fans and more quality is obviously needed.

Believable6 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 13:38:08
More importantly we need a GK and a left back, scoring goals as not been a problem.


19 May 2016 14:11:38
I would have to agree with Ed 002 with a little less running around and a little more methodical, timely and focused. More precision of our movements and a little more cunning. Can you really see that with what we have right now?


19 May 2016 21:56:54
I know we need to do something to improve the level but funny how a result that had nothing to do with the goalkeeper's performance leads to more calls for his head. We have a total lack of defensive ability down the left, lack a central mid with tackling and pace/ engine and for all the talk about scoring goals we actually aren't scoring that many when it counts. We need a better feed into the front with more options, like route down wide, through middle, long, short, some options that keep the opposition guessing.


19 May 2016 13:21:12
Well, I think it is clear after last night that Toure deserves a new contract. Doing the work of 2 players at the age of 35 can't be easy and yet he was still more effective than the rest of the team combined. I'd happily keep him and even make him Vice Captain to be honest. The reason he kept going when everyone else folded is because he's an actual winner, he was part of the invincibles and his mindset is completely different to the likes of Can and Coutinho, who are undoubtedly very talented, but have never tasted success or played under real pressure. We need more players on the pitch who show the passion and desire to win no matter what, to really get in the faces of the opposition. Sadly though, they're a dying breed these days.
Obviously, a new GK and LB also very important if we're to get anywhere and a bit more steel in midfield to cover when Henderson gets injured, and to be willing to get in the faces of the opposition, concede the foul when we are getting overrun in midfield, because let's face it, Milner shouldn't be anywhere near the middle of the pitch.
My choices would be, someone like Mattia Perin or Cillessen for goal. Both would be improvements and are still young enough to improve. For left back, it's tough, but it is clear we need someone more 'positionally aware' let's say. Don't really know who would be suitable for his position but I've heard Djibril Sidibe is supposedly a good up and coming defender. Although I've personally never seen him play so don't know where his strengths and weaknesses lie. Bertrand is also very good and would improve our team. Midfield is another difficult one. All the top midfielders would most probably be unattainable for a club who finished 8th in the league, so I would probably try and start one of Lucas or Stewart in midfield most games next season and then hopefully Stewart would kick on into a decent player for us. And be first choice ahead of Lucas by the end of next season. Obviously everything give said in this post is purely opinion and I don't expect any of it to happen, just thought I'd share my thoughts on where we could improve and how I would do it. All counter opinions are welcome lol, sorry for the long post.

Believable4 Unbelievable3

19 May 2016 12:59:39
My thoughts are as follows, so disappointed in the loss last night.

I feel we need a more mobile defensive midfielder. Someone who can break up play and put out fire throughout the pitch. while starting off play when the ball is won.

I see a lot of posts about lack of leadership in the team and this was paramount. Kolo give a rallying cry and clap of the hands now and again. Milner similar. What we need is more of this. Players who aren't afraid of being disliked just to be winners. Last night we needed someone to give people home truths and grabbed by the scruff in order to step up and be counted in the 2nd half.

Believable2 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 13:09:44
My thoughts exactly, Sevilla showed their experience lat night while we showed our youth and naivete, especially in the second half. There`s a lot of blame to go around including for Klopp (who did not react quick enough tactically when they went to a 3-5-2) BUT we need leaders in that team. Even at Dortmund, Klopp had old heads like Kehl, Weidenfeller, Dede and the like to tell the hard truths. That is what we need now. Klopp also has to adapt his tactics as we have seen how tired the players are in the second half of games after dispensing so much energy in the first half, something that has been shown to cost us points and games like last night, Southampton, Newcastle.


19 May 2016 13:19:36
We need a Lothar Mathaues kinda leader or Oliver Kahn or even Diego Simone . These players had fiery winning eyes that the players surrounding them know they better not be up to some monkey biz like Moreno ytd. Eds, are there any Lothar Matheaus type around these day? I can't seem to spot any around anymore.


{Ed001's Note - I can't think of any. Man Utd thought they were getting one with Schweinsteiger but it didn't work out.}

19 May 2016 13:35:59
Thanks Eds once again.


19 May 2016 13:41:25
Mascherano, Vidal, Hart and Suarez. They are really aggressive leaders. If you are not pulling your weight in a team alongside them, then you will get a grilling!


19 May 2016 13:42:10
We definitely need a leader or two on the pitch. That was sorely missing and has been all season. Can you imagine Steven Gerrards reaction to Moreno for the first goal if he was on the pitch? He would be putting a rocket up him. Same with Carra. The players last night just seemed to shrug their shoulders, accept it and lay down after the first goal. Hopefully Klopp will bring in someone to lead the team in those situations.


19 May 2016 15:29:54
I would love to see Flannagan given a shot playing DM in pre-season. Put him in the middle of the park and let everyone around him know exactly what playing for the club should mean.

He may not be able to adapt, but it's worth a shot. He'd be learning from one of the best in Lucas.


19 May 2016 15:46:00
Sorry another reply on this one, but you don't buy leaders, you build them.

Terry moved to Chelsea at 15
Roy Keane to United at 22
Vieira to Arsenal at 22
Kompany to City at 22
Maldini all his life at Milan
Gerrard all his life at Liverpool
Robson to United at 24
Tony Adams all his career at Arsenal
Francesco Totti all his career at Roma
Carles Puyol all his career at Barca
Franco Baresi all his career at Milan
Franz Beckenbauer all his career at Bayern (before the New York nonsense)

You can't buy great leaders, you buy people with the right attitude, or build that attitude through the youth ranks and develop them into leaders on the pitch.


19 May 2016 16:25:47
Excellent post.


19 May 2016 17:51:50
IMO, Flanagan is simply not good enough to play for Liverpool.


19 May 2016 19:12:33
I agree, he is not good enough, but I wish you got bottle his passion for the club and inject into some of the shysters that wore the shirt last night.


19 May 2016 19:55:30
A healthy Henderson would have made a world of difference. A ref with a spine too, but that's besides the point. Concidering our squad, injury history and managerial changes during the season it was a real achievement to reach two finals. But Klopp needs to think a bit on how he sets up his teams in finals. What's his stats in title games? 1 in 6? 1 in 7?


19 May 2016 12:46:42
again moreno was at fault, made many errors and done nothing really, why he keeps getting games i don't know, but the game last night should show klopp that he needs to go or drop down in the pecking order,

i noticed the same thing last night as waht happened in our other final and that is we don't have the experience throughout the team for finals and for me that what it boils down to, all we had to do in the 2nd half was to defend well and we would have won it, but the lack of experience of being in finals for a lot of the players shone through like it did agains man city

i hope klopp gets a few players in the transfer window who will bring that experience, let's not forget the team we played last night have done this final 3 times now and they never lost their heads when they went a goal down where as we lost ours when they scored a lot of our players ran around like headless chickens but they just played their game and won the final, we need players with big game experience and a couple of leaders who won't let the team drop their heads and keep the other players playing the right way, chelsea and man utd had leaders when they were winning things, it won't be easy to find the right players but i trust klopp to get it right.

Believable4 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 13:14:49
Spot on, Mbrock. Our players got unraveled after they equalized with Moreno`s umpteenth mistake since he`s been here and we just dissolved into headless chickens with no positioning nor tactical nous. The game wasn`t over at that time but they played like it was and got desperate with just 44 minutes to go in the second half. Their second goal was as great a team goal as the passiveness and lack of positioning of the midfield and defence were. As for Moreno, I am at my wits end and have been since he got here. If flanno had been there, he would have cleaned mariano out and never allowed him to cut inside as easily because unlike Moreno who pulls out of tackles, Flanno does not. We have NO LB at the club right now as one is too young and naïve while the other is well, Moreno. This needs addressing, ASAP.


19 May 2016 12:26:18
Second post because I think there's an important point to make, how would you be reacting if we'd won? If we'd got one of the penalty decisions we'd probably have been two up at half time and would have likely gone on to win the match. If that had happened everyone would be waxing lyrical about how wonderful the players are. Last night's result isn't the difference between whether our squad is brilliant or awful, you have to look at the season overall. This squad got us to two finals and, while our league form was worse than we would have liked, if we hadn't focused on the EL we almost certainly would have finished higher. We've also suffered significant injuries which has kneecapped our season. People are saying we're mentally weak, were we mentally weak against Dortmund, Norwich or Arsenal? We've spent half the season talking about how mentally strong we are now we have Klopp, one match doesn't change that.

There is nothing inherently wrong with the squad, some areas are weaker than others and they will be addressed but wholesale change is not required. People calling for a new spine or a clearout of first team players are well wide of the mark.

Believable12 Unbelievable2

19 May 2016 13:18:29
For once or twice, I agree with you Muscat. Let us not throw the baby out with the bath water just because we lost a game which had decisions gone our way and a bit of luck, we should have been out of sight at half time, we were that dominant. But to start making knee jerk reactions is just unproductive and typical of some LFC fans. We are all frustrated BUT let us not forget what this "average" squad achieved in Europe and thanks to them and Klopp, LFC is relevant again in Europe even tho, the haters think otherwise. We know where our issues are and they will be addressed just like the GK situation is being addressed right now.


19 May 2016 13:20:00
Great point, muscat. The negativity on all Liverpool sites has been overwhelming since the loss - and it's only natural, I guess, fans will be fans. We always knew that this is not a perfect squad, that there are many weaknesses. In the cup competitions we OVERPERFORMED by reaching the finals, but did not show enough in the psychological department to push it to the end. The league has shown that there is much inconsistency in the players, lack of balance within the team (this is more of a problem than individuals), and things to learn even for Klopp himself, though he remains our shining light.
As individuals, I like those players - though, sadly, some of them will have to go, or step down to the bench (M&M, mainly) . All of them have their weaknesses - but their strengths also. We should continue to support them with the hope that they would grow into better footballers, but if the manager decides that they won't - then all the best, move on.


19 May 2016 14:10:45
If we had won, and after the initial euphoria, I think Klopp would still have gone about his planned changes for the summer. There is nothing we saw in last night's game that we hadn't seen before or known about. Weaknesses in certain positions, inconsistency, lack of on field leadership and mental/ emotional strength were all concerns that had been voiced before. I just think that all the negativity is from the high expectations that were created after reaching the Final in the League Cup and then once again reaching the Final of the Europa League. We all thought that we would win it (and why not? This is after all Liverpool FC) . Too many people think of Klopp as a magician that always has a rabbit to pull out of the hat for each game, while papering over the cracks or the glaring weaknesses. It was just a completely mixed up season in all the ways possible. We both underachieved (EPL) and overachieved (Europa League) . I think the Gotzes and other rumoured purchases are more interested in LFC, as a team, and playing for Klopp, rather than any CL or EL involvement next season.


19 May 2016 14:13:37
Sorry Musc but that is naive. The spine of the team is weak, we have decent creative/ luxury players however we do not convert enough chances and again we cannot keep clean sheets.

Two cup finals does not paper over that we were 8th and even if we hadn't sacrificed the last few league games we would only have been 6th at best.

Arsenal, City, Chelsea and Man Utd were all poor this season, it will not be the case next year.

Our squad is mediocre and that's why the charlatan that is Brendan Rodgers got sacked. Wake up to reality and stop deluding yourselves.


19 May 2016 16:16:23
musc the difference between last night and the games you spoke about is it was the final, no 2nd leg to play for, with the lack of experience in finals that our players have it shows that the other team had that experience and never fell apart when they went 1-0 down they knew they had the 2nd half to get a goal, so when they scored they went on and won it where as our players fell apart, no leaders in the team to pick the team up and because of the lack of experience they thought it was game over and fell apart instead of saying to themselves there's another 44 minutes to go to get another goal, we can all see that once they scored our team fell apart, players went missing or was not even in the game, we made it to 2 finals and never won one so that should tell you something look at the players we had in stanbul to the players we had last night, the standard of the players are miles apart, gerrard, alonso and hamman would lift any team add the leadership of them 3 and the experience and there's your answer, we don't have anyone in our squad anywhere near as good as them 3, for us to get back up there they are the type of players klopp needs to buy.


19 May 2016 16:41:16
I woukd go with both points of view. We had a goal disallowed 1 of the handballs shouldve been given. Could easily have been 3-0. But on the other hand- all the space down their left in the first half llanna shoudce exploited far more. We don't seem to have a player like banega who dictates the play. Left back - nightmare but he was before we signed him. Gk? . 4 needed in my opinion . and with sakho out maybe 5.


19 May 2016 16:44:04
Alexi, I like your post, it sounds dramatic and purposeful, shame it's a load of tosh.

We don't score enough? Are you kidding me? We've scored more league goals than any other team this year, 42 in 19 games, that rate is more than enough to challenge for the title let alone improve on 8th. In Europe we put 2 passed United, 3 passed Villarreal and 4 past Dortmund. When it comes to criticizing our attack, you're talking nonsense.

Of course we've conceded too much this season but if you look at the factors affecting that you'd realise we can massively improve next season even before we change any playing staff. Klopp's been forced to play 8 different CB pairings thanks to injuries, Sakho's ban and the amount of games we've had, next season we will have a settled pairing and that brings stability. The same goes for our midfield, we've only played our first choice 13 times this season, with an easier schedule we can expect a settled team and our defence will improve.

Couple the above with a new LB and I guarantee we will score enough and concede few enough for top 4. If we get a new GK we'll do even better. This team does not need a do over, it just needs a couple of tweaks.


19 May 2016 17:27:16
I think we can strengthen, but agree Muscat if we'd had Hendo, Sakho and Origi in there we would have had a much stronger spine (as sublime as Sturridge is, he doesn't provide the physical outlet Origi does which can be critical in tight games where you're losing the midfield battle.


19 May 2016 19:17:43
I agree Sturridge struts around like a superstar. Origi works so much harder and is much better at holding on to the ball. Sturridge should be named Tefal because nothing sticks.


19 May 2016 20:23:01
Musc you need to reflect on how many chances we need to create to score those goals and upon the fact that in many, many games this season when we have lost or drawn we have squandered 4 or 5 guilt edge chances before then conceding the crucial goals that cost us.
Southampton (a) Man U (H) Spurs (H) Newcastle (H) West Ham (FA Cup) Sunderland (H) Arsenal (H) Norwich (a got away with it) Newcastle (a - that's relegated Newcastle) Crystal Palace (H) Southampton (H) Spurs (a -battered them 0-0) Norwich (H) Man U (a) that's just the 14 games we didn't win because we missed a hatfull of chances then.
QED
Case rested.


19 May 2016 12:17:03
Just a bit of general discussion, and not I hope an excuse to hate on players: we can't change lots of positions in one window, as we have done a couple of times since 2011.
The team won't have a chance of gelling or performing well if we introduce 7 new first team starters, and yet a case could be made for at least six changes.
So there has to be a balance between the urgency of the need to change, and the damage that increasing amount of change will do, at least for the first half a season.
So what starting players would you change, and where would the replacement come from?
For me, gk cb and lb are the top priority, and then DM and forward players to replace the likes of lallana, and to push coutinho and see if he can improve his consistency a bit.

Believable1 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 12:54:12
I just want a new LB, that's all.


19 May 2016 13:19:15
Spot on, Haizan. because we currently don't have one at the club right now.


19 May 2016 15:02:03
Best way of curing the left back problem is to swap Clyne over to the left and put Flannagan on the right for next season. A couple of times we have done this throughout the season and we looked a lot more secure at the back. I know we couldn't have done this last night. We could then have Smith as cover as well as Gomez. Would sell off Moreno and try to get in a LB in this or the January window. Personally think we need a GK, LB, a proper defensive mid, and Gotse. I also thought Can had his worst game for us in a long time at fault for the 2nd goal. The squad definitely needs trimming with no european football next season which I think is a good think as long as it is only for one season.


19 May 2016 12:47:24
Out of 6 we have already bought 2 and 2 are on the pipe line.
My summer plans would be

1. A GK who is vocal and doesn't flapp

2. A LB who could defend and attack when needed.

3. A DM who sit there and protect the backline. Good in tackling, read the game well.

4. A wide player who has pace and trickery and goals in him.

5. A classy CM who has an eye for pass and scores occasionally, Good distribution skills and has the intelligence to split the defense.

This would be enough IMO.


19 May 2016 12:16:43
Hi Ed002. Just wondering if there's any update on Rafa Silva? Thanks.

Believable0 Unbelievable1

{Ed002's Note - No nothing has changed. The Liverpool staff were busy yesterday and Mr Ayre has another pressing matter to deal with today.}

19 May 2016 12:35:33
Is that the charges from UEFA ed2?


{Ed002's Note - Yes.}

19 May 2016 12:46:53
What is this pressing matter ed002?


{Ed002's Note - The UEFA charges.}

19 May 2016 13:04:45
Are we allowed a little hint as to what this pressing matter is Ed002? Pretty pretty please.


19 May 2016 13:10:04
Do tell what the pressing matter is 002. If you'd be so kind.


19 May 2016 13:30:15
What is Mr Ayre dealing with today ed?

Thanks.


19 May 2016 13:35:13
Thanks Ed. One more question- is that matter Karius or Zielinski?


{Ed002's Note - Of course not.}

19 May 2016 13:37:45
Ed, excuse my ignorance but what is Ayre pressing matter today?


19 May 2016 11:52:35
Ive read about some swap deal ed with Balo and Ilicic? I take it its BS?

Believable0 Unbelievable1

{Ed002's Note - Why not, another attacking midfield player. Just what the club needs.}

19 May 2016 13:10:47
Well the current ones are not good enough, as proven :)


19 May 2016 13:55:42
Expect us to be linked with a bucket-load of left-footed forwards in the coming weeks.


19 May 2016 11:38:10
Do you think kolo toure will be offered a short term contract. He was excellent last night and had been playing well recently, also he is happy to sit on bench and play when needed, unlike a lot of players,

Believable0 Unbelievable1

{Ed002's Note - It has looked like Liverpool were intending to do that - which is a surprise to me.}

19 May 2016 11:58:27
Why a surprise ed? Do you not expect others like Skrtel Sakho to leave meaning we need to retain Kolo as back up to Matip abd Lovren?

Do you still think Matip will be back up to another arrival?


{Ed002's Note - It takes up a place in a vastly bloated squad for someone as cover for a handful of games a year. May as well push out all of the youngsters..}

19 May 2016 13:11:53
After yesterday, and the whole season tbf, kolo should be a starter. His pace is still ridiculously quick.


19 May 2016 14:02:01
We got beat conceding 3 goals and you want to keep a 35yr old defender. I have been saying for a while now Defensively we are so poor. And that's down to the players and Mr Rodgers who bought them. I am with Eds on this one. Kolo played best of a bad bunch, but to keep him as cover when we have young players like Gomez Jones and Masterson doesn't make sense to me.


{Ed001's Note - we need to keep his experience. What makes no sense is to let him go.}

19 May 2016 14:52:22
Personally I'd offer him a coaching role like arteta at city. We need to be aiming for higher quality.


19 May 2016 17:29:15
He's the perfect candidate to provide cover at CB with Sakho out, and adds experience in the dressing room. He was almost the only one to stand up and be counted last night.


19 May 2016 18:01:17
He must be great to have around the place throughout the season. Unless there is a youngster who is pushing for a first team place, perhaps Gomez, give Kolo another year.


18 May 2016 22:25:30
Moreno gone. Sturridge gone. Benteke gone. Mignolet gone.

New center mid. Lb. And gk.

Where was coutinho btw? Wants champions league football, wants the big team. You have to earn it in games like today. He just couldn't be assed.

Sturridge just either can't stay fit or when he is on he doesn't move.

Moreno well. I'll leave it there.

Migs has to make atleasr one of those 3 goals a save. Definatly the 3rd. Everyone will disagree but wouldn't doubt for a second that de gea saves 2 of them. He has to go. Cabt start another season with him.

Henderson had to play. You play him at the weekend, he has to come on next to can to soldifiy the middle.

I just can't see firmini and sturridge in same line up if we want to win more and finish higher in the keaguem

Its one or the other behind origi for next season.

Rant over better season than I hoped for but we need to turn into the efficrient team and not the moment team if were to achieve what we want.

Bring on next season and unlucky boys. Cracking support by the fans all season aswel.

Enjoy the summer eds, let's hope we have our business done and dusted nice and early and we can get set for the new season.

Believable0 Unbelievable10

19 May 2016 11:50:34
Sturridge gone?


19 May 2016 12:04:39
Studge scores a worldie and still gets abused.
Despite looking well short of fitness since he's been backed he's still had a brilliant scoring record.


19 May 2016 12:33:10
Sturridge gone? What the hell game were you watching? He was dropping deep trying to get the ball because it was just being kicked long to him constantly in the second half and he couldn't do anything with the ball. Sturridge and Kolo for me were the only players to actually turn up last night for me.


19 May 2016 12:43:11
I really don't get people saying we should sell Sturridge, only a handful of players in world football could have scored that goal last night.
I know we hate stats on this site but his goals per game record since joining us is 0.65 there are only 4 players in the history of the premier league with a better record whilst at 1 club.
Also since returning from injury he has looked stronger mentally and physically, so hopefully he can remain fit for a full season. It would be ridiculous to sell him and who realistically would replace him.


19 May 2016 13:13:11
To be fair to the OP there were a few times last night where he looked like he would be first to a ball but never seemed to get out of second gear. I presume he is worried that if he puts the sprints in he will get injured again.


19 May 2016 13:20:35
Paulo, read your post to yourself again and let me know if you understand what you posted because no one else does.


19 May 2016 13:59:42
I'm not Mignolet's biggest fan but you say he should have saved 1 of the 3 goals - let's not forget that world class save he made at 1-1 earlier on.

I don't see why we have to point and blame players all the time. We are supporters of a club and this is quite frankly when the club needs our support and confidence. It's always says to support a team that is winning, but staying with them without destroying confidence when they are losing shows true class.

Changes will inevitably be made by people with a lot more insight than most of us on the players so let's just trust that the club knows what they are doing, and get behind them for what should be an exciting season next year!

rant over.


{Ed001's Note - which world class save was this? The shot that was hit straight at him you mean? What is world class about that?}

19 May 2016 14:09:44
Sell him now, because mark my words he will come back from the Euro's injured and will then take 18mths to get fit again, just in time for the 2018 World up. He scores a great goal and then attempts to knock in a goal bound header from an offside position. He's a ball greedy T***. I would take any offer tomorrow and move on.


{Ed001's Note - you are a fool then.}

19 May 2016 14:11:03
He was still in the right position and it was a good save - ok maybe not world class but still a save.

My point is, not that Mignolet should stay and is never blameless, but is more that we need (this is not aimed at everyone of course) to stop just finger pointing and aggressively slating our own players, but just trust the club will replace as necessary.

I accept everyone is entitled to their own opinion and this is merely just mine. Not on here to argue etc.

I think over the last 7 or so months we have made some real positive steps to build on next year.

I'm looking forward to next season.


19 May 2016 14:38:24
All u that think Sturridge should be sold are idiots. He is our only world class player. When he plays he scores. It sickens me to come on here everyday and see Liverpool fans constantly on his back. If you think he should be sold u either are really stupid or haven't a clue what u are watching.


19 May 2016 17:33:11
Agree, Sturridges problem yesterday was we lost the midfield battle, went aerial (not his strength) and Coutinho was anonymous with Firmino and Lllalana ordinary at best. We needed more from those behind him and someone that could really take the game by the scruff of the neck.


19 May 2016 14:15:50
Thanks for stating that ed as it was my next post.

Crap effort by gamiero straight at him. The 3rd he crumbled should of been huge but dived to the left before the shot was taken and just well it was awful keeping. De gea saves that end of. Your clutching at straws if you think he wouldn't have.

Ny point is sturridge and firmino can't be in the same team, sturridge staying fit stops him being quick and therefore stops him actually being a proper threat, he is doing the Same job as firmino and you can't have 2 players jogging around up top you need one running in behind and one coming short not both. So one has to go. If sturridge is still getting classed as just back from injury now then people need to give there heads a wobble, he's well back now and last night showed to stay fit he can't sprint as much as he is capable of, hence pulling up all the time into runs and not sprinting in behind.

Sturridge isn't world class that's for sure and I'm more than confident with firmino and origi leading the attack next season and whilst Daniel has proved his fitness we might actually be able yo get a good couple of quid for him.

Origi, ings, firmino is more than enough for one role up top.

Coutinho, lallana, hendo, Milner, ibe, ojo, grujic, can, lucas, matip, markovic, canos

That's without any signings next summer. It ain't a bad team. Just over bloated with to. many similar players.


19 May 2016 15:43:06
Sturridge was on the way to becoming absolutely world class but injuries have robbed him. If we want him fit then he doesn't run or press only looks like he is. Watch him really closely and he always goes to run and then pulls up either in a sprint forwards or backwards. So to make up foe the lack of running he comes deep to find the ball and does the same jib as firmino, lallana and coytjnho and thus gives us nothing ip top. My point is someone has to go between sturridge and firmino and one should be behind origi and I would prefer firmino who is coming into his prime with us and has a remensous injury record when he's not breaking his back lol

Cash in on sturridge and have coutinho, firmino, origi and x player out of lallana, Marko or maybe a newbie.

That's a fabulous front line.


19 May 2016 11:27:41
I posted fairly recently about how we go to bits when we concede, last night was a perfect example.
Klopp needs to sort this out as a priority, a lot of talk about Liverpool lacking mental strength and I completely agree, last nights final reminded me of the last final, we look great leading up to it then we lose bottle and buckle.
I think the whole team knows just how bad our defence is, so if we concede or even just go through a bit of pressure the whole team then goes into a panic and everything just goes to pot.
Hopefully sorting out some decent defenders in the summer might help but it wouldn't be the worst idea in the world to bring in someone to help with mentality again, the fella Rodgers brought in seemed to do wonders for some of the players.
Well done for getting to the final anyway Liverpool, it was a great run and well done to Sevilla for winning it again.
Gutted for the loss but let's look on the bright side, we have a clean run at the league next season and euro football would have been just a distraction (tongue in cheek) ;)

Believable3 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 11:50:23
We didn't fold when Dortmund scored or Utd or panic when we were -1 against Villarreal.

Why we decided to lay down and die last night is a mystery, we got battered for 45 mins.


19 May 2016 12:26:41
Exceptions to the rule them though mate, we have given far too many points away from winning positions in the league this year.


19 May 2016 12:31:07
to be fair klopp has sorted this out to some extent, that's why we have gone behind in games but managed a win or a draw,


19 May 2016 13:24:52
We just have to be more consistent at being resilient. The more pressing issue for me is that we lead the PL in conceding from the first shot on target as well as throwing away the most amount of points from winning positions (19 points) . These are two areas that need to be fixed. the first stat I put out was confirmed last night as Sevilla scored on their very first shot on target albeit, a sitter assisted by again, Moreno`s umpteenth mistake since he signed here but you get my point. These are what we need to change and it comes from experience and most importantly, mental strength and bottle. Klopp has improved this but we are not there yet so we need to keep going.


19 May 2016 10:43:50
Hi ed001,

Having a leader to spur players on is essential as seen and not something you can just buy in my opinion. Would you agree our best bet is building confidence of someone we have to be this leader? Personally I think we need Can to become more vocal and i'm hoping flanno can become a voice for the team.

Believable1 Unbelievable1

{Ed001's Note - our best bet would be to buy players who are leaders and mould them from within. In the old days, our players were all leaders in their own rights, so we never relied on one man to bail us out, unlike the Gerrard days. That is why we fell away, because we stopped doing that. We stopped buying leaders.}

19 May 2016 11:32:43
Ah i see ed001. We do need a team of leaders rather than one. I think of the days not to long ago when we also had hyppia, carra and agger who could lead the team. Pepe reina too could inspire confidence even though his performances tailed off a bit.


{Ed001's Note - exactly. In the old days everyone would be on everyone else's case. If you had a bad game, you would answer to the ten other players on your team first, then the coaching staff.}

19 May 2016 13:00:59
Ed001

completely agree.

1991-92 season Steve McMahon left.

previous to this we had Souness, McMahon or the ilk in the centre.

1992-93 season our midfield hard man was Mike Marsh

arguably who has been an inspirational, get the troops round you leader since then?


{Ed001's Note - I honestly can't think of one.}

19 May 2016 13:27:34
Then we need to buy leaders then because even while Dortmund was hailed for their free flowing style under Klopp, he still had old heads like Weidenfeller, the captain Kehl, Dede and the likes who were there to restore order when things got out of hand or to tell hard truths when required. We need those types of players now.


19 May 2016 14:13:40
If you could buy a real leader right now ed001 then who?


{Ed001's Note - Kante. Not sure he is a leader, but he has the never say die attitude to never give up and roll over like we did last night.}

19 May 2016 14:27:04
The good old days hey, We did have a lot of winners, Spitters and biters, but them type of players have been taken from the game. How many Souness Case Mcmahon tackles would be allowed these days. I can see what Ed means about leaders on the pitch. Yeats Smith Hughes Thompson Souness Neal Hansen Whelan all followed each other as Club Captain and at times we had most of them on the pitch together. Souness change that by buying Mark Wright a ready made Captain who had just taken Derby down.


{Ed001's Note - it is not about the tackles, it is about players taking responsibility for their performances and those of their team mates.}

19 May 2016 15:01:36
Kante is a good one indeed. i'm hoping Ings can be one too. He seems to have he attitude of giving it his all and has experience of trying to lead by example when its all going wrong during burnleys last stint in the league.


19 May 2016 09:03:44
Ed001

There's been some criticism that Klopp may be tactically naive and only one style, and doesn't know what to do when teams exploit the weaknesses of his gung-ho, and that English teams will have it figured out next season.

What's your opinion on all of this?

Believable1 Unbelievable3

{Ed001's Note - it is nonsense mate, he has evolved his style constantly, even after arriving here. We do not gegenpress like Dortmund did and it was never 'found out' like media morons like to claim. In fact he made a change to the style of play which proved not to be as successful and it was a return to gegenpress which saw Dortmund climb back up the league.}

19 May 2016 11:51:26
But we weren't gung Ho last night, quite the opposite.


19 May 2016 14:09:45
Yeah I know we weren't gung-ho. We were quite opposite, we sat back in the first 20 minutes and just cleared the ball and let them have possession, so I don't really follow what ed002 is talking about there. I Just wanted ed001's thoughts on it, because I think it's nonsense too. Hindsight is such a convenient and often wonky tool of scrutiny. If Liverpool took their chances in the first half and won those penalties, we wouldn't even be talking about Liverpool being 'found out with their gung-ho'.


19 May 2016 11:18:14
My only opinion on the game last night is that it was crying out for Lucas to play centre mid and break there play up with Milner playing centre and running around like the headless chicken he is Lucas with game intelligence would have coped better. Just an opinion but onwards and upwards next year
Up the pool.

Believable4 Unbelievable4

19 May 2016 11:30:42
I was thinking the same mate. He would have been the first sub I would have made to be honest, no point having 3 strikers on the pitch if the ball isn't getting to them because the midfield is completely lost.


19 May 2016 11:51:32
I agree but don't think it was just the second half, they had us figured out the first 20mins too. they played aerially over the high press into Zonzi and we lacked control of midfield with Can isolated and we lost too many second balls. Then when we had possession they formed a wall between Defence and out attacking mids and waited for us to pump it up (which we duly did) and then cleaned up.

It was only for the last 25mins of the first half where we came back into it once we kept the ball on the turf and nearly carved them apart. I was hoping we'd learnt our lesson for the second half but once they hit us in the gut with the sucker punch, our players looked exhausted, both physically and mentally.

Easy in hindsight, but Milner should have gone to LB to strengthen there, Hendo could have come in to strengthen midfield and Origi could have come on for Coutinho or Llalana to boost the team upfront and add a physical presence to hold it up if necessary.


19 May 2016 12:56:50
I wanted hendo on.


19 May 2016 13:03:22
Allen should of come on after there first goal we couldn't keep the ball.


19 May 2016 17:36:40
Allen was not the right option. The bullied us in midfield and he's hardly the player to put into a dogfight like that. We needed Hendo or Lucas.


19 May 2016 10:43:58
I try to avoid posting immediately after a big loss, emotions are flying all over the place, people are angry, you find yourself looking for someone to blame. Sleeping on it helps to rationalise what happened and what happened is that we lost a game, that's it, it was our 14th loss of a 63 game season. The squad of players we have this morning are the same squad of players as we had at 19:45 last night and at 19:45 last night we were pretty happy with them. We knew some could do with replacing but in general we knew we had the nucleus of a great squad and those players are still here this morning.

Don't forget this is the team that swatted Utd and Villareal aside and came back to beat Dortmund 4:3. It's the team that did the double over City, scored 6 at Saints, 3 at Chelsea 6 at Villa and humiliated Everton 4:0.

We have excellent players. Remember Can, he's only 22 and played 49 games for us this season, next season he's going to be better. We have Hendo who's only been on the pitch for a 1/ 3 of this season, we took 28 points from his 15 League starts, if we had managed that over the season we would have finished third. We have Couts who's just 23, isn't it incredible that we have a player so young who scores 12 goals from midfield, just think how good he'll be when he peaks. What about Firmino, in his first season at the club, a year where he missed pre-season, he scored or assisted 22 goals, think how good he can be next year now he's settled. We have Origi, a player who looks to be on the verge of becoming something special. Then there's Studge, a guy who's come back from a devastating injury and carried on scoring like he's never been away. He's scored 13 goals this season from 19 starts, even better he scoring at a faster rate than Kane or Vardy. Next season not only will he be fit but he'll be coming back into form, I get dizzy thinking about the awesome things he's going to do.

We put all our eggs into one basket this year and we just fell short but next season's going to be something special. I'm gutted we're not in Europe but the silver lining is that less games means less stress on the squad. With a full pre-season, better rest and more time on the training pitch we're going to be blowing teams away. Even if we don't sign a single player this summer I'm confident we'll make the top four. If we fix a couple of our problem positions and maybe sign another match winner then I won't be shocked if we challenge for the title.

You had last night to mope and be angry, get over it, move on, because Klopp and the players are already looking ahead to next year and next year's going to be amazing.

Believable13 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 11:30:43
Misc there's great optimism in your post however you overlook some stark facts that are not so positive. We cannot keep clean sheets. The players who are lacking all play in key positions, goalkeeper, centre back, centre midfield, full backs.

We have some good players but we lack 2-3 world class players who are leaders. If we had the calibre of DeGea, Alderweireld, Kante, Bellerin, Fuchs, Debruyne then I'd share your optimism about the others. We have Mignolet, Clyne, Moreno, Lovren, Lallana and Milner. With Allen, Skrtel, Benteke as back up?

If you analyse the Dortmund, Villarreal games you will see we played the same way and made the same mistakes in those games but got away with it over two legs. We battered Man Utd but again our inability to score enough in relation to chances created meant the 2nd leg was difficult when it should have been all over.

The manager will be cut some slack as he has got a poor squad to two finals. Unless he addresses the weaknessess with transfers then we will not challenge at all. If Mignolet stays in goal, Milner as first choice plus Moreno and Clyne then we have real problems.

Sahko has made a centre back a priority as Lovren without a leader goes missing. Last night as soon as he got booked for that stupid foul when the ball was already out, he was terrified to tackle and crumbled mentally.

The young players, Coutinho, Firminio, Can bottled it and there was no one on the pitch to help them.

Watch in the summer how poor Clyne is for England against quality players.

We need a whole new spine and then the promising kids can express themselves. Klopps job is enormous, top 4 is not going to be easy even with less games. You forget the year we blew it without European distraction we had one Luis Suarez, he is unique so we need 4 big players to replace what his ability gave to the whole team.

I hope Klopp gets it right, Ranieri has shown it can be done without paying hundreds of millions, just sign players with character and determination then sprinkle a few gems in for good measure.

Biggest summer in our history in my opinion, c'mon Jugern sign the right players and get us back where we belong.


19 May 2016 11:05:19
Well said. Was angry last night but tbf but even with refs decisions we can't deny the better team won. No problem with the teams overall quality but the mentality is fragile. Need some more winners in the team. Kolo should stay, Hendo was missed massivley, and if we don't buy a DM I think Lucas should be the first name on the team sheet.

No way him and hendo would have let us capitulate like that. Sorry, last little moan! 2 finals with a squad that Klopp hasn't signed a single player in is a good sign. Decent window and a preseason and onwards to next season!


19 May 2016 11:09:50
We surrendered the league cup final to city and we thought Klopp would learn. We sacrificed the league for EL and we thought Klopp would learn. We lost to Sevilla who did their job well. They don't have A class players like us. From 7th to 8th doesn't appeal to outside world.
We were pressed and dominated by Sevilla in the second half, our midfield were cut 9 times in the match and Klopp learned nothing, Did nothing.

You have to give a massive shout to the man (Ed02) below giving a perfect Summary, we are still after players who RUN a lot.

At times Klopp just leave the game to Crowd to turn it on their own.

I can't sit at my work place, If you couldn't beat a Sevilla we wouldn't beat any Barcelona or Real.


19 May 2016 11:38:26
I agree that we have good players but a really unbalanced team imo. Have some very strong links and some very weak links, but are strong links don't really work together.

Our best XI for me do not work, too many players either don't suit the role they play or don't seem to have a defined role I can think of.

besides the obvious (lb, gk, and CB - have two great Cbs but injuries etc) think a midfielder is vital this summer. Think Lucas could do it but if manager disagrees need a player who reads the game and is better at controlling possession, alonso has shown through out his career how vital this is (2 CL, la liga title, German title, World Cup, 2 euros etc) .

Also think the can, Milner and hendo is a problem. All really good players but want to play midfield, which even with Lucas wouldn't work. Would like to see a DM (Lucas or new player) can or hendo with coutinho as our midfield. Is balanced and think couts would be more consistent deeper as benefits his game better.


19 May 2016 10:43:50
Hi ed001,

Having a leader to spur players on is essential as seen and not something you can just buy in my opinion. Would you agree our best bet is building confidence of someone we have to be this leader? Personally I think we need Can to become more vocal and i'm hoping flanno can become a voice for the team.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

19 May 2016 10:24:14
My ritual after a painful loss is to avoid this page straight after the game and then to log on and fast forward to the Ed's assessment.

A couple of questions for the Eds.

1. You clearly have a trained eye to watch football that I don't. I just get emotionally wrapped up in the game. Would you consider your observations obvious to a decent coach or are they just your personal opinion? In other words, do you think Klopp and his team will come to a similar conclusion about quite a few of our players.

2. If so, we have considerable changes to implement which means we have the dreaded transition period to consider yet again. Are any of the players you have under rated capable of improving or have you given up on them.

Believable1 Unbelievable0

{Ed002's Note - 1. Klopp so far has failed to understand his own shortcomings even when it is clear that his approach to the game is not working - and it hasn't done for soem years. Unless he changes I would expect that he will continue to buy players based on how fast they can run. 2. I don't understand the question G1dgo.}

19 May 2016 10:59:00
klopp should build the team around sturridge but is instead an after thought. sturridge spends most the game pretending to press wasting energy trying to please klopp. its clear if klopp won't adapt, sturridge won't be in his plans. just like benteke, he will be shut out next season and leave in summer. in my opinion there are so many more problems with other players than sturridges inability to run all day. even so, i think klopp will do well next season when he either gets to play his own way with his own players or he adapts with what he's got.


19 May 2016 10:05:55
Eds with the failure to get European football do you think klopp will have to look at alternative transfer targets? Also do you see Moreno leaving? He is good going forward but defensively he has cost us quite regularly?

Believable0 Unbelievable0

{Ed002's Note - RTP.}

19 May 2016 10:05:14
Hi Ed001/ Ed002,

I was wondering who you thought Liverpool should be going for to fill the LB slot that so clearly needs filling.

Not necessarily who we are targeting, but more who we should target.

Personally I think that Chilwell or Creswell would be good options. They are home grown players, both have had good seasons and both offer more defensively than Moreno does. Also both still young enough to improve.

Would love to hear your thoughts.

Cheers.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

{Ed002's Note - Please RTP and use the search engine - we are beinga sked the same questions over and over.}

19 May 2016 10:26:12
I only ask because you say that the LB you would've chosen was Gaya, who is apparently no longer available.

Cheers in advance.


{Ed002's Note - Valencia don't want to sell him but interest remains in the player from four sides - including two from the EPL.}

19 May 2016 08:16:21
Morning chaps. feeling your pain this morning.

Question for the eds. i found your assessments a good read.

Was just wondering if you were klopp who do you sell and who do you buy this summer.

Thanks
Keep on trucking
Tom.

Believable1 Unbelievable1

{Ed002's Note - The players I previously suggested - all were available but that is no longer the case: Begovic (G), Gaya (LB), Sule (CB), Diawara (DM), Riechedly Bazoer (M), Ousmane Dembele (W).}

19 May 2016 10:24:19
Is Gaya still available, has he been linked with Liverpool?


{Ed002's Note - I am not saying these players have been linked to Liver.}

19 May 2016 09:49:35
Its awful that we missed such a fantastic opportunity, and especially after such a long campaign, and against such an ordinary team- but there are at least a few small positives.

1. A win might have papered over the cracks a bit- e. g. moreno has not come on enough, and in my view he will never be disciplined enough for a CL team, despite his attacking flsir and pace. I think we will make a new LB a higher priority, and his costly mistakes will not spoil our next league season.

2. Likewise the inconsistency of Coutinho has been highlighted more clearly.
His occasional flashes of brilliance cloud the fact that he can disappear from a game for 20 mins at a time, and there is a reason he has not held down a consistent starting spot with Brazil. People were appalled when I questioned Sterling's end product two years ago, but he has actually gone backwards recently, and I think Coutinho is another player who is clearly very talented, but who attracts a lot of media hype and ultimately does not deliver enough end product for a team who want to win a CL place.

3. The attitude of too many players was poor last night, especially considering it was the biggest game of the last 12 months. I simply can't understand what went wrong with so many of them given how huge an opportunity this game was for them.

Klopp has now seen these players perform (or not) in a wide variety of situations, and last night will have been a wake up call in terms of fragile the mentality still is of some players.

4. At least we got to the final. That at least is positive progress. There are too many basic errors and weak links and fragile minds in this squad to win a CL spot or a cup final against determined opposition, but at least Klopp now knows who the most unreliable players are, and he can take action in the summer with any remaining blinkers off and a clear idea how these guys perform on a high stage.

Believable6 Unbelievable2

19 May 2016 10:05:37
Ye we weren't up to much before klopp came on the scene so for me we've achieved a great deal considering. I just think we never recovered from the shock of conceding such an early goal, that against the impetus it gave them and we couldn't get back into it. Thing is with moreno he doesn't een have attacking flair. he makes plenty of straight runs but barely puts in a good cross.


19 May 2016 10:09:13
Think that's a tad harsh. I know ifs and buts but two/ three penalties that for me were at the least 50/ 50. The problem last night was not putting the game to bed in the first half and not keeping a clean sheet for the first 10 minutes or so of the second half. If we're 3/ 4 up which we should of been the games done, I don't think any player in particular was to blame here however I'd put it more down to a bit of luck.
Their first goal you can certainly look at Moreno all round doesn't do himself justice and after that it was a mental thing more than anything.
So arguably in one sense those players could have had one of the easiest wins in a European final and from another point I agree Moreno certainly isn't good enough at the moment, needs to be pushed / replaced but I don't think last night makes any difference to the fact with a bit of work and couple of additions we could achieve a lot. Certainly don't need to overreact now and try change the whole team.


19 May 2016 08:16:21
Morning chaps. feeling your pain this morning.

Question for the eds. i found your assessments a good read.

Was just wondering if you were klopp who do you sell and who do you buy this summer.

Thanks
Keep on trucking
Tom.

Believable0 Unbelievable1

{Ed002's Note - It has been covered a lot Tom but the players I previously suggested - all were available but that is no longer the case: Begovic (G), Gaya (LB), Sule (CB), Diawara (DM), Riechedly Bazoer (M), Ousmane Dembele (W).}

19 May 2016 09:40:09
Aresenal Finished second in god knows how long, Spurs have had there best season in a centary, Man city scraped top four, Chelsea and man utd never even made top four, Everton did there usual absolutely nothing, While LIVERPOOL made two cup finals with a new manager who has only been with us seven months and yet to bring in his own players or have a full season, So yes there are positives we had a better season than most and have a world class manager who can compete with any in Europe and owners willing to invest. It may fall flat on its face but we have everything to succeed for a long time.

Well done Sevilla you beat the mighty LFC that's something to celebrate.

Believable3 Unbelievable3

19 May 2016 10:25:30
"Man City have scraped top 4" - forgot to mention won the cup you made the final of, ft to a semi final of the CL
"Man United didn't even make top 4" - correct, by forgot to mention finished 6 points ahead of Liverpool with our worst ever premier league side, also likely to win the FA Cup,
"Everyon did their usual, nothing " - what have you achieved or won this season in comparison? Both no European football next year, not trophies for either.
"Klopps world class who can compete with anyone in Europe" - based on what? Yes he's won a few titles years ago, but he also ha shortcomings. 5 consecutive cup final defeats. Yes he's a good manager but wouldn't say one of the best in the world. Tactically poor at times for me.

My point is your belittling the other teams in the league and making out as if you've had a great season. When the reality is you have gone another year without silverware, another year without getting close to CL qualification, and a year without European football will hinder you potential transfer targets without a doubt.


19 May 2016 11:12:59
stand united I was not belittling other teams I was making positives out of negatives, but yes city won the final but as the best squad in the league together for a number of years that's hardly un-surprising, yes utd finished six points clear and you are not certain to win the fa cup but worst team in years is abit much, yes you have a young team you need patience but wouldn't call it there worst, everton litteraly have had nothing to remember this season but we have two finals to remember, klopp is flawed but so is every top manager, pep hasn't built anything, jose has proven nothing other that the ability to defend for two years then leave a club before the players get sick of his tactics. not being negative, just pointing out positives.


19 May 2016 09:34:02
Morning reds and eds,
Obviously last night was devastating and still hurts, not just that we lost but that we didn't show anywhere near the level the odd can be capable of at their best, if they had played well and lost it would be a lot easier to take as this was we are all left with a wonder of what if.
That said, I think it will actually be beneficial to the long term development to be clear of Europe next year. If we had made champions league there would have had to be a large clear out and replacing lots of the players who left, but with only a domestic season to cope with it gives us an opportunity to really clear out and trim the massive squad and just bring in one or two real quality as oppose to looking at four or five areas that we might have needed covering if we had Europe. This way we can just get one or two to improve the starting 11 as think if we do that we already have adequate coverin most position for a domestic season.
Looking forward to next year, YNWA.

Believable1 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 10:04:07
Yes. this defeat hurts a lot. But in a few weeks, we'll all be looking forward to seeing our new signings in pre- season training and the pre-season tournament .
Then, we'll go again.
YNWA.


{Ed002's Note - The summer is the busiest ever with the Euros, the U21 Toulon tournament, the Copa America and the Olypics. Most clubs will be carefully managing their squads.}

19 May 2016 09:22:37
Two finals in one season is a good achievement for a new manager. Even if we lost both it's not the end of the world. We will bounce back stronger the next season for sure.

Believable4 Unbelievable3

19 May 2016 09:12:38
Do the eds see the failure to gain European football next season as meaning liverpool will have to look at different targets, than the ones they originally were looking at?
Can't see any big name players wanting to join without it. Unless we.

Believable0 Unbelievable2

{Ed002's Note - I don't see it changing targets at all.}

19 May 2016 08:50:13
Eds reds was it just me or were our 3 behind studge dissapointing? They didn't get into it fir me lots if questions to be answered. Mignolet- if he come out of his 6yard box gets a nise bleed! He doesn't go for anything one gre as t save though. Moreno why is anyone surprised? He was exactly the same at sevilla! Ed02 said at the time why didn't we go for Bertrand? ( hope i'm right ed) . Klopps got sorting to do.

Believable3 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 09:10:38
One thing we haven't mentioned is the Sevilla coach's brilliance. He obviously saw some weaknesses and tweaked their tactics to exploit those - and it worked like a charm.

I love Klopp but I did feel he was slow to counter tactically.

Anyway, well played to them. They were the better team.

Now onwards to our domestic treble next season. :)

Believable1 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 08:22:27
if only if sakho was playing, he would of had coke in his back pocket, ha.

Believable9 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 08:35:25
I don't know whether to laugh or cry.


19 May 2016 09:27:15
The man in the left pocket and the powder in his right 😂.


19 May 2016 09:32:35
Laugh MK laugh😁.


19 May 2016 09:39:50
Lol cheered me up a bit!


19 May 2016 08:02:07
Still smarting from the game yesterday.
I think the club has a big problem with the full backs. Sevilla's left back was poor in the first half yesterday and considering that Clyne's "strength" is in his forward play because he's really lacking defensively, he couldn't really take advantage. For Moreno, there really is nothing to say that hasn't been said. It's shocking that a professional footballer can be that appalling.
Kolo was tremendous yesterday. The run and block when he ran past Can to stop Gameiro at 1-1 was top class. Moreno didn't help him by playing out of position everytime though.
Milner/ Can clearly won't work against top teams. We really missed Henderson. At 1-1 and playing the way we were, he would've gotten into everyone's faces and made them step up.
And Lallana has got to go. I've been a big supporter due to his pressing, but he's the worst player I've seen when transitioning from defense to attack. I watched Dortmund a lot under Klopp, and they had the best transitioning team in Europe (to me anyway) . Lallana is the antithesis of that.
Hope we can get a left back that knows how to defend, Mario Gotze and a goalkeeper that isn't afraid to come out of his or use his legs.
And finally, not a criticism of Klopp, but we need to learn how to slow down the game. Play at a really calm tempo, try to control the game. A bit of Bayern, Barca. Let the players relax and the ball do the movement. We can't gegenpress for 90 minutes.

Believable3 Unbelievable2

19 May 2016 09:25:53
He'll have toadapt somehow. But its difficult to do that with players that aren't technically proficient and intelligent to do that.


19 May 2016 08:01:00
This team will be a bit different next season, it is clear, " said Klopp. "We will do something with transfers.
Nuff said. let the clear out commence. and in my book nobody is safe.

Believable7 Unbelievable0

19 May 2016 09:13:56
Where did you hear that Richie? Wasnt the post match interview.


19 May 2016 09:17:54
I guess he's been wanting to say that all season, but for obvious reasons couldn't, wouldn't want to alienate players, not that that matters now. LB concerns me though, it'd be nice to get some top quality for hat position, easier said than done though. :/.


19 May 2016 11:43:19
Hey Zeddicus. its what the bbc had reported this morning, he's clearly had enough of some obvious candidates if he's said that buddy.


19 May 2016 15:26:15
Fair play, just read the same. Couldn't bring myself to watch the highlights programme on ITV after the game, and he was probably interviewed separately on that, as I don't remember him saying it immediately after the game to the BT Sports interviewer.

I'm glad he's not defending the players and saying it was bad luck. Its ridiculous that and important aspect of a manager that fans believe in is that he tells the truth, but in the past we have not had that, so its a step forward!


19 May 2016 07:57:58
Liverpool against newcastle was the same thing
Maybe the Southampton game as well
Liverpool have an issue with crumbling or getting nervous or feeling sorry for themselves . Something like that

That's really one big issue to sort out so arsenal seem to have that problem aswell but it terms of "you have to win this game" they always crumble against anyone

So I don't feel sad about this game because it's happened so many times this season. As if it's a lack of leaders problem or actually I just don't know how u could sort that out
Any ideas eds or fans . It's like if lfc concede a goal then they stop playing.

Believable2 Unbelievable2

19 May 2016 08:05:07
Lots of ideas, Lobster, just read the posts further down the page (and on the other 4 pages)


19 May 2016 08:07:16
You don't feel sad about losing a European cup final? Wow.


19 May 2016 08:09:51
I feel the same. I was actually worried when Sturridge scored first goal, I would be more relaxed if Sevilla scored first. When Benitez was manager I was so confident when we spent ahead in a game but now it's reversed. Obviously some problem there.


19 May 2016 08:18:20
Lack of someone to lead on the pitch - to ginger the players.


19 May 2016 09:37:13
You need to buy proven quality. When you don't buy proven quality, you effectively don't buy winners. It's not wholesale changes but it's 3 or 4 very important areas in the team that needs top class quality. We've spent mass amounts of cash on average players so why can't we spend that sort of money of higher calibre players. To change that mentality we need to buy confident players, not players we want to make confident. Or players with potential. You look at that squad and that's a result of poor recruitment. So you build with the better players within the team and go get players that are better, not the same or worse. It's actually very simple. We just don't seem to get it.


19 May 2016 09:39:38
"to ginger the players" - not sure Riise is the answer, legend tho he still is!


19 May 2016 07:55:00
what time does the open top bus parade start.

Believable1 Unbelievable2

19 May 2016 08:38:56
I don't know what you're on about mate? You haven't won a trophy in over 2 decades, and i thought you blue noses only had a parade when you finished above us anyway?

If you want to celebrate Lukaku coming in the top 10 in the race for Golden boot though, then by all means get yourself a bus.


19 May 2016 08:53:55
Roberto's the main man? Clearly not anymore.


19 May 2016 07:40:31
Good thing is if we had won, fsg may have not thought we needed more investment. As it happens it's plain to see there are plenty that are not good enough.

Believable2 Unbelievable5

19 May 2016 07:48:31
I'm all for grabbing positives from a bad situation, but I think this is stretching it!


19 May 2016 07:54:14
I think if we won we would have made more changes because we would need a stronger squad to compete in the CL and prem. I think we will get less players in now.


19 May 2016 08:10:41
The only positive we can take from last night is that we didn't get any major injuries.
The other by-product is it keeps expectations in check a bit.


19 May 2016 09:39:58
Yes it better keep expectations in check. People need to wake up a little bit now and stop thinking klopp will have is challenging or something next season. We will improve but much will depend on fitness and recruitment. If we don't get those spot on its another 5-8th place finish.


19 May 2016 07:25:02
Just me or anyone else thought Coutinho was a complete passenger last night?
I have felt this way about him for a while now - especially when Couts and Firmino start together. Any body with any statistical data to prove or disprove this - on how we perform when both Coutinho and Firmino start? Especially with Sturridge up top.

Believable7 Unbelievable0

19 May 2016 07:31:27
We are better with origi and no sturridge, don't know when people will realise this.


{Ed001's Note - maybe when it is actually true?}

19 May 2016 07:34:59
Are you serious or is this a wind up?


19 May 2016 07:49:08
Must be a wind up, see his other comment above.

I didn't think half term was until next week?!


19 May 2016 08:03:30
Every time the ball went up to sturridge it bounced off him and came straight back, when origi gets the ball he holds onto it. It's it my fault some of you just don't know much about football? (Ed not included)


{Ed001's Note - but that is not his game, it just means we have to stop lumping it up to him.}

19 May 2016 08:12:01
After he came back from injury Firmino didn't play so well except Villareal game.


19 May 2016 08:49:52
Ja Kurtz, your suggesting that we should of started with Origi? A young player who was only just declared fit after suffering a relatively serious injury, who probably only had a good 20 mins in him, has only recently started to show his potential (and that's what it is, potential), should of started ahead of a fit and proven striker like Sturridge in a European final. Your the one who knows nothing about football.


19 May 2016 10:03:12
When will we class sturridge as not just back from injury? Surely he should be showing more signs of sharpness by now.

He's lost his super pace that's for sure or his confidence in it. One thing we all knew is that with his explosiveness he was always liable to muscle injury's, he doesn't have that any more now to me its either because he wants to protect himself and he doesn't push as hard now or he's pulled an owen/ torres and the injurys have caught up with him.

He was someone who only played at 100%, I think he's someone who is willing to play at 70/ 80% now. For me its either him or firmino in the team behind origi.

I personally would sell sturridge and try and rince west ham out of that 25 million.


19 May 2016 07:22:59
Wow, feel pretty flat today, threw it away after a first half where it could of been 3-0. Not going to start slamming individuals, (although there were a few questionable performances) as it won't change anything. After a result like that I try to remind myself that no player deliberately sets out to have a bad game, I'm sure they will feel bad enough already.

Believable8 Unbelievable0

19 May 2016 07:03:57
Feel numb still, but there are enough posts about last night and the performances.

My question is does anyone have insight into the relationship off-field between Lovren and Can and Mignolet?

I see the flaps and not coming for balls that Ed001 spots every game from Migs, I also see how Lovren and Can shout at him, the looks they give him. I wonder if they would like to see him sold as well as most of us? I don't think Lovren rates him at all.

Also think one of Can or Lovren should replace Milner as vice captain.

Believable3 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 07:01:46
That was embarrassing.

We need an overhaul of the team, and we need better tactics.

Kolo Toure was our best player on the pitch last night. That says it all.

The full backs who started are simply not good at defending. Not really an acceptable situation for a club of this stature.

The goalkeeper is nowhere near good enough. Does not organize or command the defence, the goal area, kick or distribute with intelligence, or inspire any confidence.

With our defenders and goalkeepers giving up soft goals, it destroys the team psychologically.

Klopp has to fix the back five situation or we will get nowhere.

Our midfielders run around a lot, but have little idea how to counter opposition tactics, slow down the game, maintain possession, or demonstrate much footballing intelligence. Just running a lot does not work at this level.

Forward players: we spent so much of the game being overrun in midfield, they could not link up properly with rest of team. But the manner in which Coutinho was so easily marked out of the game was alarming. Sturridge is a game-winning striker. We need to keep him at all costs.

As others have noted, Klopp's style and tactics have been found out. Emery easily outwitted Klopp last night. Used the long ball to overcome the press in the first half, and then moved to possession football in the second half as we tired, and took control of the midfield. The substitutions yesterday little sense - but by then the team was shellshocked anyway.

In home and away ties, our deficiencies can be disguised by Anfield and the crowd, which puts the opposition on the back foot.

At neutral venues, we get found out.

We need better, more intelligent, technical players, and better game management and tactics, if we are to win things.

Believable1 Unbelievable4

{Ed001's Note - sorry but his tactics were not found out, it is just easier to sit down and change things at half time to counter a tactic that is winning than it is to change it after that. That is why you are better to lose the first half than the second. There is not a lot you can do at half time when you are winning but hope the other team does not figure out how to counter your plan.}

19 May 2016 07:25:35
Was a post I completely agreed with up till you saying klopp was out thought. That's complete nonsense. The players should have been 2/ 3 up by half time, but come the second half they, and they alone choked. Soon as they scored can got deeper and deeper, the back line was so far south it could have been in Italy. We looked like we wanted them to score the second and third and to get home to our mummy's.


19 May 2016 07:44:30
100% agree with ed there. People always say "well that will be a easy team talk" I think it's really hard if you've well beaten a team but only 1 up. All it takes it them to change it and it's hard going.

Having said that, for me the players just bottled it.


19 May 2016 08:00:14
Ed01. we are getting pegged back, and sometimes collapsing (Southampton, yesterday) after first taking command or looking comfortable.

How to explain this?

Explanation 1 The opposition believes/ knows we cannot sustain a high-tempo press for 90 minutes, that we are predictable, and plans accordingly. Or,

Explanation 2. The team just needs a proper pre-season and Klopp needs to bring in better, fitter players. Or,

Explanation 3. The team is soft psychologically, and lacks the ruthlessness or self belief to win matches when we are not playing at Anfield.

I hope you are right, and that #2 will fix things. But I am concerned.


{Ed001's Note - no 3 is more of the problem, 2 will improve matters but it can't fix the players completely. We need players more suited. That is down to bad recruitment in the past by a lazy bunch of people working in the transfer committee. Luckily the main culprit has left and that area has, hopefully, been much improved.}

19 May 2016 08:20:50
I do agree with Ed01 there. I remember Beckenbauer saying Bayern need a player like Jeremies after Bayern folded in Europe for a couple of seasons. Someone that would kick opponents even before the match starts.
I believe that's what Liverpool lack or should I say the one person I've seen do that is Henderson. even when Stevie was captain.
Of course, it isn't just about that. It's also the fact that he would've gotten the attention of opponents. We wouldn't have been easily overrun yesterday.
I think what contributed to Chelsea's ressurrection/ dominance years ago was that they had so many captain materials - Terry, Lampard, Ballack, Drogba, Cech, Makelele etc. Players with the right frame of mind and are able to lead. That is what Liverpool needs. Leaders.


19 May 2016 08:41:47
I hope people watching the powderpuff performance from our front line now realise the necessity of bringing in real quality and not just in the physical sense but people with mental strength. Coutinho had the look of a beaten man before he took to the field and his performance both offensively and defensively was woeful and he did it in the carling final too. Firmino tried his best as did sturridge but lallana only seems to run a lot but not contribute much offensively.

We don't need another massive overhaul but clearly we need better quality moving forward. Left back and keeper are priorities and if the karius rumours are true i will be disappointed.

I would take goetze in a heartbeat, experienced big game player who if we can get him back on form would be 10 times more useful than lallana or coutinho in presurrised situations.

Can showed his inexperience but he will be the heart of our midfield for a few years. While i am disappointed by them throwing away another final i don't think we need open heart surgery to kick on but we do need to be shrewd with the players we bring in from now ensuring we target mentally strong players.


19 May 2016 11:37:47
Honestly, from the starting whistle something was not right. We were belting the ball high and long from defence and midfield in the hope that someone would get on it. We just gave possession back most of the time and let them start again with their forwards already and middies already in a dangerous position.

Nerves? Due to the importance 'all or nothing ' nature of the game? Knowing that all our eggs were in the Europa basket.

However, that's the point that I thought Klopp would make at half time. Calm down, stop hoofing it, play your natural game. We were easy to play against in the second half because all we did was long ball.


19 May 2016 11:54:45
Agree redroo, and with Coutinho, Firmino, Llalana and no Origi it just made no sense.


19 May 2016 06:52:11
I had to wait until this morning to write what I'm going to, because after the dissapointment and a bottle of red wine, I thought maybe I was being too harsh, but having read Ed1's comments I agree with,

I was shocked and disgusted at how easy they folded last night, 2nd half really was toothless. After growing into the game and starting to dominate the first half. Kolo only player to walk out with any real credit, and Studge if only for that goal, but Kolo the only player to keep fighting.

My son kept asking why I had my head in my hands anytime Moreno was near the ball.

For all the good work liverpool can do, players like him are always going to cancel it out. All he had to do for the first goal was stick a toe out, could have been a different game from then.

Suppose it summed up our season in one game, some good stuff, a little very good stuff followed by utter crap.

Believable6 Unbelievable0

19 May 2016 06:27:04
Ed1, I have to ask about Moreno.

He's never been the best player and whilst he has shown some miniature improvement under Klopp he has always been regarded as one of the players most in need if replacing.

My question is, do you agree that he clearly wasn't anywhere near the right mind to play that final? He clearly couldn't handle going against his old club and as a result he was terrible.

I know he isn't great anyway but I'd be interested to hear your opinion.

Thanks.

Believable5 Unbelievable0

{Ed001's Note - I saw nothing last night that suggested it was anything other than him being utterly hopeless defensively. He plays like that every game.}

19 May 2016 06:51:34
I am bit shallow. I put 100% blame on Moreno.

Whenever we were attacking, he'll be there up. Whenever we lost the ball, he was like a dummy didn't even bother to fall back to his position. Then usually it will ended up Toure occupying his, and created acres of space between Toure and Lovren.

Whenever he was actually at the back, he bothered himself more to be in the middle, then charged very late when there was someone overlapping. Stupid.

The left area being left with huge and acres of space, with or without him.

Rants over.


19 May 2016 09:44:12
It wasn't 100% Moreno, he was maybe 50%. The other problems were

1) No Hendo to control midfield alongside Can, we missed him badly
2) We gave away way too much possession between Coutinho, Firmino and Llalana who went missing for much of the game except 30mins of the first half
3) When it was punted upfield Sturridge didn't manage to hold it up to relieve pressure. we needed to keep the ball on the ground to him
4) Moreno was awful, simply awful.


19 May 2016 05:10:01
Ed001, do you blame the second half more on tactics or bottle? For me, it's bottle. The first goal had NOTHING to do with tactics. Emery's revised tactics didn't influence us to ball-watch en-masse and let them score a goal. After that, we froze. Could he have brought on Allen earlier? Perhaps, but if his team didn't bottle it he wouldn't have had to do have done that in the first place.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

{Ed001's Note - why would you want to bring on Allen? He offers nothing and was the wrong substitution. Tactics were a big problem, Emery changed his and it worked, though luck and a team of officials who favoured them helped.

I mean 3 handballs in the box, 2 clearly deliberate and within full view of officials and one that was clear, though accidental, but the ref pretended not to see so gave them a goal kick rather than a corner, like it should have been.

Then there was the 'advantages' the ref was playing. At one point one of our players was fouled deep in their half, a great place for a dangerous free kick to us, the ball broke from the foul back 30 yards or so into our own half, yet the ref threw his arms forward to indicate he was playing the advantage. I am sorry, but what advantage is gained by keeping the ball in your own half over having a free kick within ten yards of the opposition box? The changing decisions every time their players disputed them etc, the refereeing team were appalling.

That for me was why we bottled it, which is why I would agree with you that it is mainly bottle, but it was the combination of all those things together. We lost the tactical battle in the second half, poor subs (why bring on Allen when our best midfielder is there on the bench? Allen should not even make the bench, he is hopeless and I am sick of the love in for a player who offers nothing), officiating, all contributed to the feeling we had lost it. The players just seemed to lose heart. That is unforgivable to me.

The likes of Milner, Clyne, Allen, Lallana, that run around a lot but offer absolutely f all else, they have to go. I am not even going to get into Mignolet and Moreno, who are little short of embarrassing. At least Toure turned up and kept going, last night showed we need to keep him, he was one of the few with the right attitude, chasing back to run past Can to throw himself into a block. That is what we needed more of. Shame he was almost alone in his attitude.}

19 May 2016 05:31:56
You've said it perfect Ed, sums up my thoughts on it exactly.


{Ed001's Note - I would like to point out, I am not blaming the officials for us folding or losing, I am saying the players bottled it and that contributed to it in a major way. Top players use those times as a push, something to make them work harder, a stick to drive them on. Last night our players did exactly the opposite. It reminded me of the way the Man Utd players reacted to their team bus being attacked, the way they failed to seize upon it to drive them on and instead lost focus due to it. That is exactly what was wrong last night and, as captain in the game, Milner has to accept the blame in a large part. He is a highly experienced player, yet who was he screaming at to pull their finger out? Who was in the face of forcing the play? No one. Not geeing up our players or trying to get at theirs. He is simply not a captain, or good enough for Liverpool.}

19 May 2016 05:40:18
Ed I agree wholeheartedly with your post but for your criticism of mings who I believe must go ASAP but last night I found him blameless for any of the goals. Did I miss something that you felt contributed to us losing the game.


{Ed001's Note - seriously? He dithered and dallied and nearly cost us more a couple of times last night. Sorry but to suggest he is blameless, when he gives the whole team the jitters every game, is ridiculous. How many times is that now that the first shot on target the opposition have is nestling in the back of our net? Worst first choice keeper we have had in my lifetime. In fact, many of our numbers 2 choice keepers have been far better than him. He is utterly and completely hopeless. Oh and what kind of moron keeps lumping it long to Sturridge against two defenders that are dominating him in the air? Oh yes, that would be Mignolet. His kicking is appalling and showing no signs of improving.}

19 May 2016 05:50:22
He brought on Allen because he was changing it To bring on two frontmen and wanted Allens composure on the ball and his ability to retain possession with his passing. We were being run over in the midfield and we were giving the ball away too easily.

Firmino had a shocker, gave away the ball that much. Coutinho was ineffective. Worst by far was Moreno who can't defend to save himself. Lallana ran a lot but didn't do anything.


{Ed001's Note - but Allen has no composure on the ball, hence why he scores so few, and he does nothing to cover defensively. He was a terrible sub, that was a mistake, much as I love Klopp, it was a clear error to choose Allen when Hendo is available. Allen offers nothing.

Couts had a poor game, worse than Firmino, who at least kept their defence working, he should have been given the hook. Lallana did everything he does every week. Ran a lot but did nothing bar spoil promising attacks with pretty turns and hanging on to the ball far too long.}

19 May 2016 06:05:47
To be fair to Milner ed, he's been our most productive player this season in getting assists, so that IMO warrants him at least a place in the squad. But no, he's not a leader. He may lead by example with work rate but he's got no battlefield voice. The only player you can genuinely call a leader is Toure. I know Lucas is a leader off the field but like Milner, doesn't have the battlefield voice.

Yeah I agreee Henderson should have come on instead, but I guess what I mean is that if you were to bring Allen on, it should have been earlier. The Allen love-in does have me a bit perplexed. All he's done is just come on against tired bodies and run around like a mad man.

If Liverpool held their bottle, they still could have won despite the tactics. I blame it maybe 80% on bottle and 20% on tactics. If the players didn't choke, perhaps a midfield change wouldn't have even been necessary anyway. I think our loss of nerve just made their tactic changes look a lot better than they actually were. I can't even remember what they did tactics-wise. But I just didn't see Sevilla as a particularly great side, we were just awful.

I'm hating the doom and gloom from some though. We lose a final and all of a sudden it's so much harder next season? I tell you what, I think Gotze is coming regardless of UCL or not.

And yes, Migs should be criticised. Distribution woeful. Keeping for the third goal especially woeful, it's like he dived out of the way.

It's just so bitter. We beat Man United, Dortmund, Villareal, and when you realise all of that emotion and excitement built up over the 3 ties has amounted to nothing, it's hard to digest. I almost convinced we were destined for champions league next year. 'Sevilla aren't even great, we should beat them' I thought. : (


{Ed001's Note - Milner has been our most productive player because most of our team is not good enough, not because he is worthy of a place. Milner is utter dross in the centre and barely average out wide. He is little more than a fringe back up player, the kind of player you put on the bench just to cover for injuries.

I just don't see the point in Allen, I mean in even having him on the bench. I don't get it.

I am with you on the fact we should have won, but our team let us down in the second half. Winners stand up and fight for victory, they just meekly surrendered.}

19 May 2016 06:17:11
Yep still in complete agreement with Ed. In relation to your comments Ed (about us lacking fight and Milner not being good enough), as either a captain or player) I can only concur. We rolled over in that game. I know we harp on about it but you look at Istanbul, and the players reactions in the 2nd half, we had the likes of Carragher, Gerrard, Hamann and even lesser players like Smicer and Traore all leaving everything they had out on the pitch. There was a noticeable absent of that fight, of that drive and of any sort of inspiration from within the team to really change events last night.

Milner is a poor player, in my opinion, and if it were me he'd play on the wing only and even then be a rotation option at best (I know his wages mean that is not feasible) but the lad just doesn't have what it takes. The game was screaming out for a Henderson, not an Allen. If we talk about mentality and look at the players in the squad there is a handful, at best, who have the mental fortitude required: Henderson, Toure, maybe Lovren (? ), Lucas. Everyone else is lacking. I still don't understand why Lucas wasn't starting in central midfield - he is 10 times the defensive midfielder Can is. I think players buckled under the weight of the occasion and that says everything about what Rafa would term the "winning mentality" - we don't have enough players with it, maybe the summer will amend this?

P. s Having said that no quantity of a winning mentality can help a team who play Clyne, Moreno and Mignolet week in week out - it's been said a thousand times but you play those players and you run the risk of conceding sloppy goals and changing results. I can imagine a far more productive season without these 3.

p. p. s Sorry to chat your head off ed, but I remember Flanagan doing very well at left-back before his injury - is he worth putting back in that position? Or would you give it to Smith to try and make his own?


{Ed001's Note - I would buy one and let Smith challenge him for the left back slot. We need Flanno to step up and replace Clyne.}

19 May 2016 06:20:25
don't think its milner's fault that the rest of the team is dross. He getting his.


{Ed001's Note - what did he do as captain on the night that absolved him of any blame?}

19 May 2016 06:25:10
See this is why I don't see the hesitation about signing someone like Gotze. The guy is just a winner, he wouldn't have gone missing in a game like this. How many people in the world can say that they rose up to the occasion and won their country the world cup at less than 25 years of age? He's very talented and is a clear upgrade on, IMO, all of our attacking midfielders. And Bayern are letting him go for a relatively cheap price. Hopefully Klopp learned a lot of lessons about our team's personality. He was probably fooled, like most of us, by the Dortmund game.


19 May 2016 07:28:51
Nick, I agree with you, and most of the comments here, esp ED01's.

Goetze is a winner and would be an upgrade certainly on Lallana, imo, and on yesterday's showing, on both Couts and Firmino too (although they did have bad games) .

Also, he won the world cup aged 22, and is only just about to turn 24, so younger than you think.


19 May 2016 07:48:55
Ed001 the lack of leadership thing is something that you see in pretty much every team these days. Is it just me or do players not care as much as they used to. When the ball is in the air you don't see players fighting to win the header like they used to. That intensity isn't there anymore.

It feels like i'm watching a different sport these days. Where are the Keanes, Vieiras, Gerrards etc?


{Ed001's Note - young players come through academies with everything put on a plate for them, they no longer have to fight for it. That is what Leicester did differently, they put together a team that has had to fight for it and they used that fight to win the title.}

19 May 2016 07:48:58
Thing is Nick is Goetze cannot help an inept GK and rancid fullbacks and they have been the biggest source of conceded goals/ mistakes this season. If we are going to flash the cash we should be doing it in area's that need the most attention, not in positions were we are already well stocked.


19 May 2016 08:04:07
Seano, I get where your coming from, mate, but I still believe that if we can get a winner in a position where he will be an improvement on what we've already got, and he's happy to come to use without UCL, and Klopp knows him, we should go for it.

I believe we will have a bit more money than people think, and we will (if Lallana goes, for example) get back a chunk of the Goetze money for that sale. So the (I'm making up numbers here, sorry Ed002!) £5m or so additional outlay on Goetze over keeping Lallana is worth it.

Completely agree we need to look at our fullbacks, and Ed002 did a good round up of LB targets further down the page. I think Flanno will stake a claim to the RB slot next season, and I have slightly more faith in Clyne learning to defend than Moreno.

From a keeper point of view, if Karius is coming, and based on Ed002 repeatedly stating that we are looking for a Bogdan replacement who can push Mignolet, not a Mignolet replacement, I think Karius is it, at a relatively cheap price and with good potential. I'm happy with that.


19 May 2016 08:49:35
Mate Goetze won't come cheap (agents fees, transfer fee, salary, etc etc) and it is in a position we already have a number of players. I know the allure of a "big name" is strong but we honestly have far more pressing area's of the squad that must be sorted out. If we fail to recruit a good goalkeeper and at least 1 fullback then we will have the same problems next season. How is a team supposed to string together consistent results when, at any given moment, the GK or the defender are liable to make a hash of something and gift an opponent goal. It has happened so many times this season I mean just take the 2 games at home vs the Tyne/ Wear side clubs - both of them 2-0 up, both of them get a draw due to awful defending and the drop in confidence that brings. That 4 points dropped and there have been at least another 10! We'd be in the CL without this nonsense. The defence is an absolute priority for me - Goetze is a luxury signing and is one that I wouldn't see having a huge effect on our performances next season - if we can sort out our defence we will not only pick up point but we will be consistent week in, week out - this must be the priority.


19 May 2016 10:09:48
You said his numbers aren't that impressive because the rest of the team is dross. My point is that ain't his problem. and further his numbers are perfect to compliment other stars who should be delivering more than him. He is a complimentary player.

About tonight ye, he could have yelled at someoe or something. Barely seen stevie lead that way but milnercould have donesummin like that especially as he ain't cracking in 30 yarders!


19 May 2016 03:20:37
what a disappointing way to end the season! 1-0 feeling good and then a KO punch early in the 2nd half had us reeling for the rest of the game and we never recovered. We had them on the ropes in the first half and unfortunately couldn't put them away.
But I don't think it is fair to criticize the team's resolve etc when it was all of those qualities that got us to the final in the first place.
Some of the hyperbole about specific players and the team's deficiencies is getting ridiculous. These are well known and are going to be addressed in the summer and moving forward no matter what happened in this game. At least that is what I believe anyways.

Believable1 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 08:51:43
Why can't you critisise them throwing the towel in with 40 plus minutes to go? It was dreadful and to am man except toure they should hold their heads in shame.


19 May 2016 02:48:30
Eds, now that we did not secure champions or europa how do you envision this impacting the squad next year? You have consistently said that the squad needs trimmed but wonder how you envision things now that we will have less games per se.

Thanks
Pete not feeling so rocky Mountain high.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

{Ed001's Note - I wouldn't worry mate, it will not make a major impact, not this season. If we failed again next season it would, but we got to two major finals and there are clear signs of a rebirth under Klopp.}

19 May 2016 05:17:26
He's already said he doesn't want a player that only wants to play in the champions league. Kinda with him on that.


19 May 2016 02:32:34
Very disappointing but they were the better side for much of the match, and a few lessons learned. We pick ourselves up and go again

1) silver lining is we have a clear run without European Football next season. As disappointing as that is, it'll avoid the mayhem we saw this season with so many games and will really allow Klopp to establish the team and integrate any new recruits properly. It could be just what we need to instill the "Klopp way" in the players for years to come and for a run at top 4 or better next season

2) Sevilla showed that it's possible to bypass the gegenpress through aerial route (into Zonzi) - we really missed Hendo alongside Can to control he midfield once it got past the AMs. We need to learn how to deal with this or we just tire ourselves out (like we did vs Chelsea)

3) Likewise when we played it the aerial rote ourselves, we lost too much possession. As brilliant as Sturridge was for the goal, it really showed how valuable Origi can be as a release. Sevilla just blocked up he passing channels into Coutinho and co. knowing a punt upfield would just concede possession. Our best 25 mins was when we learnt to be patient and keep it on the floor working the gaps.

4) Toure was as immense as Moreno was dire. Moreno really needs to see some competition next season, please please please bring in someone who can defend at LB.

At the end of the day its not the end of the world lads. very dissapointing yes, but we had two finals and some magical moments this season and there are more to come. With a couple more key recruits, a good pre-season, and a week between games I think we'll be a real force to be reckoned with in the PL next season. Up the Reds!

Believable2 Unbelievable0

19 May 2016 07:30:30
Thanks zimbo, I needed that post to put things into perspective, and talk me down off the ledge!


19 May 2016 02:30:27
Few more drinks to reflect on the game. First half robbed of 3 goals. Second half we didn't even show up. We did not show any passion or desire to get back into the match which was hugely disappointing. I think changes from the bench came too late too. And there was no leadership in the midfield. For their first goal it should of been a case of don't conced as soon as possible. A simple foul would of shut the play down with several oppertunites to so. Absolutely gutted reds.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

{Ed001's Note - the player who would have the sense to give away that foul, Lucas, would get slaughtered for doing so. But that is why he does it and why he is light years ahead of any other player in our squad as a defensive midfielder.}

19 May 2016 02:25:56
So the game just showed us a few things we already knew.
First is that our forwards are class and can be lethal when given any space, even if only one of them was performing.
Second is that a 63 game season takes it out of your players, they looked knackered in the second half and didn't have the fitness to cope with the higher tempo.
Third that Moreno, for all that he can be good going forward, is positionally suspect (3rd goal) and has a tendency to dive into challenges (1st goal)
Fourth, Milner isn't a centre mid. He did some great work when we were on top and he was in the attacking third but he goes missing when teams try to pass in our midfield, leaving can by himsellf. Furthermore he just is too easy to run past, their second goal should have been stopped by Milner.
Fifth, that Clyne needs to be a little more decisive. I thought he was good going forward and when isolated out wide with a winger. But he needs to learn when to just play a bit more like flanaghan and put his heart out there and just go for the ball. The third goal could have been stopped if he'd just committed to winning that ball first.
But there are positives from the game and the season. We made 2 cup finals and had some great performance. If things had gone a little more our way we would be talking about a season when we won 2 cups. Next season will be a good one for us, we have Klopp to attract players, a new TV rights deal to finance them and without European football we can focus on the tearing the Premier League to shreds. It's not the end of the world.

Believable2 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 00:42:53
A bridge too far. Too many players either over-awed or just didn't show up (Coutinho, Firmino come to mind) and a few were just exposed for what where they are weak (Moreno, Can) . Was a good run, but hard to accept the missed opportunity.

YNWA

Coop.

Believable2 Unbelievable2

19 May 2016 01:50:44
We burned out. There are teams you chase and teams you just let have the ball. Goal killed us but all this talk about klopp; i don't care its the same as under kenny and br. We have had plenty of time to do anything we wanted this season. I trust in klopp buti go back to kenny i can't remember a season we were so unlucky in results. This season a failure. If you add the 2 points we DROPPED under newcastle and sunderland and the 3 against southampton. All near end of season where would we be with them 7 points.


19 May 2016 00:29:35
Day know what, it was nice to have hope finally as a Liverpool fan after so many mediocre seasons. Two finals in one season and Klopp has given us that. As he said let's use this pain to kick on and go out next season and learn from it. We won't have a problem attracting players to play under Klopp as some think. The squad needs thinning as we all know but a few quality additions and we'll be up there.

"If you can't support us when we lose or draw, don't support us when we win"

YNWA, chin up and we move on.

Believable1 Unbelievable2

19 May 2016 01:32:42
I have to disagree regarding the quote from past era. We as loyal fans of Liverpool will definitely NOT support Liverpool if they keep losing. Liverpool is a winning club and we will not reward poor performance with our support.


{Ed001's Note - you really are the most clueless person I have ever met.}

19 May 2016 04:01:57
I agree with the above post, ins and outs now, next season will be better .


19 May 2016 04:42:37
That's all well and true, but we have said this a lot in the past and it's getting tiresome. The only way we can actually improve and start to 'believe' is if the recruitment is right in the summer. None of these players with potential, or players that shine in lower level clubs, we need players that will clearly improve the first team. We've seemed to have no problem spending large amounts of cash on players that are average, why can't we spend that same money on players that will actually improve us for once. I'm not talking about marquee names either. I know it's not as easy as I make it out to be but our scouting has been terrible thus far and everyone knows our transfers have been abysmal so how can we not improve on that.

We will only start to believe when we see better things in front of us. now we seemingly have a better oppertunity to yet we go and get Grujic, zielinski and matip. Yes we will improve ten folds next season won't we. Not trying to slate players that have never played for us but I'm saying these aren't the players that will take us to the next level.


19 May 2016 05:15:16
Lol Ed.


19 May 2016 07:34:13
The king is dead, long live the king.

Just as Harry (Kova, EG, etc etc) starts talking a bit of sense (and I think Ed001 and Benny rubbed off on him, ooer), we get a new young pretender in Lee.

Unless, of course, Lee is another Harry alter ego that Harry uses to spout out the old nonsense he's been bottling up?!


19 May 2016 00:26:04
Very proud of the team to get to the final; you'd have to imagine the players will be extremely disappointed with their efforts in the second half. People are pointing the finger at Moreno and he was poor but where were the leaders on the pitch? the organisers? the players to calm the situation and grab the game back? even break it up for 10 minutes to allow a regroup. That for me was the most disappointing thing. We needed a Souness in there after the goal; get on the ball; slow it down; foul if necessary to stop their momentum but we just don't seem to have that belief or composure type player.

Believable2 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 00:15:37
Well that didn't quite go as planned, it was all there for the taking. Half time arrived and the whole supporters group I watched the game with were on such a high we were left dumbstruck by the way they got their first after the break, then followed by the next 2 it's left us feeling numb more than anything, I'm sure the anger and disappointment will set in soon.

The main talking points after the game all centred around our full backs and keeper, with the general consensus being that we knew they weren't great but we didn't think them as woeful as what they showed. Most of us agreed that not only did we see their lack of talent and intelligence we also witnessed how poor they are mentally, they are just not big game players, think that goes for more than just the 3 mentioned though.

Until tonight I believed that Klopp could get a decent level of performance out of our full backs and keeper that if we did get replacements they would still offer us something ie: competition for the place, maybe they would work harder, train harder and lift their skill level but now I have to be honest and agree with a lot of posters here and also Ed01, they need to be shown the door. I don't like writing players off or going on epic rants about how bad a player was, but I just can't see any positives in them remaining. We can attack and score goals, and defend from the front but as soon as Moreno Clyne and migs are put under real pressure or asked to defend they are just not capable. Apart from Lovren, Toure and depending how long he gets banned for, Sakho I think we need a complete overhaul of our defensive unit, as apart from 2 defenders and a couple of the kids their just simply no where near good enough.

From the look on Klopps face and the faces of his assistants and even players on the bench they seem to feel the same way. Let's just hope that we get the right players in and Klopp and co can get them playing together at a decent standard in time for the start of next season. At least 1 very minor positive is that he will have lots of time between games to work with them, we witnessed Rodgers take us to 2nd without any euro games, here's hoping Klopp can work his magic and increase that by 1 position, so to next season we look and start dreaming of winning the league.

I don't know how but still in this moment I Believe.

Believable1 Unbelievable1

19 May 2016 01:54:30
It was Suarez and Sturridge that took us to 2nd place in that season - not going to give any credit to Rodgers - all he did was put them on the pitch.

Totally agree with your post - Lovren and Toure were admirable tonight having to basically operate as a 4 man defence between them. Clyne was poor, Moreno should have signed his transfer away with that performance - totally at fault for 2 of the goals and luckily Migs was there to stop Gameiro scoring at point blank range which was again, totally Moreno's fault for losing him.

I think we have a good first team bar those two, we played with 8 outfield players tonight and Sevilla were just excellent at exploiting them and moving us around to create space.


 
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