Liverpool Banter Archive March 22 2017

 

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22 Mar 2017 21:16:11
Am I the only one that expected more from Brandt than that? :/.

Believable5 Unbelievable15

22 Mar 2017 22:19:22
Shouldn't expect anything from them games really.


23 Mar 2017 09:39:54
If you are expecting a lot from players during int'l games especially friendlies that are forever meaningless, then you will be forever disappointed hence, I propose you have NO expectations on player performances during such tedious games.


23 Mar 2017 13:18:17
On last nights showing we should sign Joe Hart, Delle Alli cannot hit a barn door, and Weigl is worse than Livermore.

So let's not judge anyone on an international friendly!


22 Mar 2017 20:48:40
Scouting report for JK, Germany-England, first half:
Werner: Nowhere to be seen. Pass.
Brandt: Tried a little, no end product. Doesn't look LFC-material.
Rüdiger: Reminds me of a young Martin Skrtl, but with less sense of position and not as good passing.

But that England chap in no 11 shirt we should grab before Barcelona and Real come calling. Great feet, excellent workrate. MOTM so far.

The grass is not greener on the other side.

Believable4 Unbelievable19

22 Mar 2017 21:09:19
You're basing this all on one half of international football? A friendly that counts for nothing, and that the Germans are notorious for not trying that hard at? No wonder we get fans laying into our players after one bad game.


22 Mar 2017 21:18:52
I'm glad you spent a lot of time scouting them, 45 minutes is plenty to decide. You're so clever.


22 Mar 2017 21:19:21
Always thought that about Brandt.
Basically I don't think his signing justifies blocking Ojo/ Wilson.


22 Mar 2017 21:11:11
Rudiger looks rather lumpen to say the least.


22 Mar 2017 21:50:21
And I thought Englishmen had a sense of humor and Germans were the square ones.

Fine, boring version then for you: Lallana is bloody good. Has taken several steps under JK.

Werner and Brandt are young lads with potential, but still very inconsistent. Especially Werner looked out of his league- as a debutant a little enthusiasm can be expected.

Even if this is Rüdigers absolute low I truly do not want him in a red shirt. Might look good in the slow Serie A, and with someone telling him what to do, but when England put some pressure on him he struggled badly.


23 Mar 2017 01:29:01
Chaps . go easy on Andy. This is what banter is all about . At least we talk on here, for any of you that want to know what I am on about pop over to the Man City banter page . I went on there over the weekend to guage the mood of their supporters before the game . Only thing missing was the sound of crickets in the background . Andy was speaking in jest, some of you guys are more sensitive than my missus.


23 Mar 2017 01:31:44
I've seen a lot of Rudiger. He's already a decent defender, still young and with good potential. I've never actually heard him linked with us (and it's probably not true) but I don't think he'd be a bad signing if there is any substance to it.

Don't judge the guy one appearance in a meaningless game.


23 Mar 2017 08:22:41
Andy you may need to attach a sarcasm and not being totally serious warning on your posts going fwd.

*50% sarcasm applies to above post
** 90% tongue in cheek
*** a tinge of underlying seriousness can be applied.


23 Mar 2017 09:46:07
Ruddiger rejected stupid money from Chelsea last summer so good luck with expecting him to sign for us cos the fee would be astronomic. As for Brandt, Ojo is not in his class as Brandt is much further along than him (German int'l, played at the U20 and Rio Olympics) even tho he is only 20 and inconsistent. If we get him, I will support him as he is supremely talented. By the way, if you are judging players based on pathetic, meaningless friendlies then don't be upset if many on here dismiss your player ratings as bogus cos you learn nothing about players in such games.


23 Mar 2017 20:49:10
Thought the comparison with Skrtls passing and sense of position would be enough to give away the irony, if the 45 min scouting report didn't quite do it.

Trust JK a lot. Has a great track record when it comes to transfers, aswell as developing young talent. Should Brandt or Werner come he will have a plan for them. The Rüdiger links are less solid, heard his name somwhere in regards to LFC. Probably due to us needing a CD than anything else.

The area I'm really worried about are GKs. At BVB he never got a great keeper on the team, and Karius have not been a hit so far.


22 Mar 2017 19:21:08
It bad I'm more excited to see Brandt play than England? Obviously if he doesn't score a hat trick he is a waste of money and shows FSg lack ambition. unless he signs for Chelsea in that case he is the next messi and shows FSG refuse to invest the money and are just looking for a quick buck.

Believable14 Unbelievable3

22 Mar 2017 19:54:45
I didn't know Ali and lallana play in those positions
For their clubs
But for England it's make do all over again

It's just idiotic.


22 Mar 2017 18:57:38
ed002 even though we still have 2 months of the season left we are already hearing of players agreeing personal terms on perspective moves for next season, is this just agents sounding out clubs or clubs encouraging interest? what is the normal protocol that avoids accusations of tapping up?

Believable1 Unbelievable1

{Ed002's Note - If a club speaks directly with a player without the permission of his club then that is "tapping up". Agents and clubs meet and talk regularly and clubs will enquire if a player might be interested in a move, what sort of deal he would want etc..

Clubs will typically informally ask an agent (a) if the player is going to be available, and (b) would the player consider a move to the club. There may be some broad discussion on the sort of deal that would be offered. If the answer is yes, it is then necessary for the club to approach the player's club to ask if they would be willing to sell and if they would grant permission to speak formally to a player's agent and possibly even the player about actually making a move. This will typically involve either broadly (through an offer) or actually agreeing a fee and responsibility for any significant costs (agents fees etc.). Once this has happened the club will be able to speak to the club, the player's agent and perhaps the player himself to look at the fee and the package that will be involved. Many players are looked at and discussed at a high-level with agents and clubs; a subset of those have an offer placed; a subset of those involve discussions with the player's club; a subset of those involve discussions over terms, and; a subset of those go ahead.}

22 Mar 2017 19:15:02
thanks for clearing that up ed002, appreciate it.


23 Mar 2017 21:41:27
"Tapping up" rules are completely obsolete in the modern game with practically every player having an agent who can "indicate" the level (expected wage) of a players interest.


22 Mar 2017 17:26:51
Hi Eds, I know ................

Believable0 Unbelievable1

{Ed002's Note - Random name - try the appropriate page.}

22 Mar 2017 15:28:00
Would like to hear the Eds views on Jan Molbys comments the other day. saying we should drive a minibus to monaco and try and get as many of their players as possible. is there anyone might be good for us or are any marked for big moves? Not a bad idea in my opinion!

Believable1 Unbelievable1

{Ed002's Note - It was a throwaway comment, no more than that. Liverpool looked at Bakayoko but there is no expectation that they will follow that up and the remaining players, for sale or not, do not interest Liverpool.}

23 Mar 2017 18:18:19
Craigu - listen to the sharkopod, all the info you need is there.


22 Mar 2017 13:43:23
I would just like to pay tribute to Ronnie Moran, his contribution to Liverpool fc is incaluable a true LEGEND has passed away but his dna runs right through the football club and he will never be forgotten, thank you for all you did for Liverpool, Ronnie Moran a true gentleman in every sense of the word.

Believable20 Unbelievable0

22 Mar 2017 14:33:52
He was a lovely man, he always took the time to talk to me.


22 Mar 2017 15:04:14
Part of the fabric of Liverpool FC. We wouldn't be the club we are without Ronnie.
YNWA 😥.


22 Mar 2017 17:46:48
A great man. Could use more like him.

YNWA Ronnie.


22 Mar 2017 18:33:01
how fitting that our next match is the derby, I trust the kop will pay a fitting tribute to the great man.


22 Mar 2017 22:14:26
Thank you Ronnie.

RIP.


22 Mar 2017 12:22:44
Perisic link seems to be picking up momentum, if we can go ahead and pinch him from interested, he will prove a quality asset. Still think it's unnerving we are not being linked with decent CBs.

Believable3 Unbelievable1

22 Mar 2017 18:39:16
perhaps klopp does not think we need any he does have 4 centre backs on his books, looks like a left back and goalkeeper will be bought first, we do need a left winger
so the perisic link makes sense, however I have not given up on signing brandt, we want quality we need top 4.


{Ed002's Note - Well I would not hold your breath over Perisic.}

22 Mar 2017 19:08:36
thanks for the advice ed002.


22 Mar 2017 11:35:26
The reason being captain of Liverpool Football Club is such a huge honour is because legendary figures like Ronnie Moran held it before I did.

I wasn't lucky enough to work with Ronnie but I had the great fortune of being in his company on the occasions when he came to Melwood to walk around the training pitch and although we all regarded him as a true great, he was as humble and down to earth as anyone you could ever come across.

I know I speak for all of the current players when I say that we are all deeply saddened by Ronnie's passing and the greatest tribute we can pay to him is to give everything we've got for Liverpool Football Club just as he did each and every single day during the 49 years he spent here. YNWA

Fitting tribute to the great man from our captain.

Believable27 Unbelievable0

22 Mar 2017 12:00:18
May his soul rest in peace!


22 Mar 2017 12:49:15
Ronnie moran liverpool fc legend godbless redman.


22 Mar 2017 11:07:30
RIP. Ronnie Moran
A true Liverpool legend and will forever be part of Liverpool's rich history.
Condolences to his family.
YNWA.

Believable19 Unbelievable0

22 Mar 2017 10:10:14
one of the true greats gone. Rip ronnie.

Believable12 Unbelievable0

{Ed025's Note - yes mate, great coach and a big loss to the city and liverpool fc in particular R.I.P ron..

22 Mar 2017 10:20:59
Very sad news, RIP Ronnie
Thoughts to his family.


22 Mar 2017 10:31:41
So so sad about Ronnie Morgan. The word legend doesn't seem enough to describe him. RIP Bugs.


22 Mar 2017 12:43:30
Mr Liverpool. Thanks for everything Ronnie.


22 Mar 2017 09:34:57
Hey ed01, I caught a fairly intiguing discussion between ed007 and united fans on their page (while browsing for ed02's gospel) - it was about youth players, how rarely they make it in big clubs, and that usually this is due to them not being of the necessary level.
It saddened me a little, because my sincere hope is that Liverpool will manage to integrate some of the academy graduates into the squad - and not only in the short term. However, reality does seem to point that most youth players from big clubs need to make a move to less sunny pastures to make progress as regulars, and then and only then SOME of them might make it in a bigger club.

With that in mind, would care to make a prognosis - an objective one, without the rose tint of fan glasses - about which of our youth players we will be seeing in Liverpool colors in 3 or 4 years time?
Of course, this is with the view that A LOT of things will change as they develop, so let us base it on the current level they are showing.

Sadly, I have a suspicion that the cold realities of football will push a lot of the kids out of the door - in most cases for their own good. If I have to be realistic, it is only TAA that I see as having a shot of taking a starting or rotational role in the long term.
Of course, I do hope that I would be wrong, because I am already a fan of Ben Woodburn, and do hope that Ojo OR Wilson will also manage to claim a rotation role (sadly, I do not see both of them making it) . Joe Gomez, also huge hopes he will make it, though CB is one of the most merciless positions in terms of youth chances - at least at the top levels.

Believable1 Unbelievable0

{Ed001's Note - it is nothing to do with ability, he was quite simply massively wide of the mark. Ability is never the key factor, there has always been hundreds of players with more than enough ability spread around club academies. The issue is that ability is not the main factor.

You have attitude. Most players fall down here, they give up because they don't see a route into the first team and they have had everything too easy up to then. The first hurdle will often kill off a player who just hasn't got the right fire. Sometimes it can be the opposite, that they waltz into the first team too easily and strut around thinking they have made it, so they stop working as hard, without even realising it most of the time. Attitude is the most cruicial thing though.

There is physique as well. We still have the idiotic notion in some places about size of players being more important than ability. So big lumps with no ability or lightning fast players with a terrible first touch get into the team ahead of a player with genuine touch and skill but little pace or size.

Then there is the problem of short-termism. Every manager knows they are only as good as their last result, so do not want to take a risk on developing a youth team player when they will not reap the benefits. They would rather put in a readymade player. Which also goes hand in hand with luck. Young players need luck, a forced sale or injury crisis, to get a proper chance to show what they can do. That often does not come along for them.

The academies themselves are a big part of the problem, in my opinion, as they hand everything on a plate to youngsters. That is why so many fall at the first hurdle, they have no idea how to cope with setbacks or having to earn something.}

22 Mar 2017 10:26:36
I really like the sound of Pepjin Linders though.

He has recently praised Woodburn and Arnold even referencing how much emphasis is put on size nowadays, but that these 2 debunk the myth that stature matters.

I am not sure how much Linders had to do with it but I also like that our academy lads are being made to take referee courses. Put the shoe on the other foot for them when they are the one getting hounded for decisions. I think we have some excellent players in the academy with the perfect attitude.

Gomez and Stewart for me are the 2 who have proven they can over come set backs and not let it phase them. Gomez's career was devastated by injury but he has come back fighting. Got himself a new long term contract and made a real impression with Klopp.

Stewart though has some real character; rejected by Tottenham, sent on loan by us as a wide/ defensive player, and then at 22/ 23 I think it was Beale put him in midfield and asked him to start the whole development process again, and he just accepted it, got on with it, and now works hard every day to learn this new role so he can make it at the top.

Restarting that development trail has probably set him back 3 years in terms of earning potential and first team readiness. Just listen to his interviews though. He is so determined to make it at the top that he would literally give up a good career at a West Brom to try and make a great career at the top.

It reminds me of the fighting mentality Henderson and Lucas have. He earned his new 4 year contract and I really hope he makes it at LFC long term.

We can only pray Arnold, Woodburn and Brewster bounce back from their first set backs as well.


22 Mar 2017 12:21:06
Great analysis, Ed. The more important issue for me is focusing more on a player's physical size and athleticism over raw skill and a great first touch. This is a fool's errand. This is how many academies not just in England fail. France has failed miserably in this regard since the 1998 World Cup, won by players who where physical monsters like Desailly, Blanc, Karembeau, Thuram and the like except Zidane who was technically gifted but still no slouch physically.

They started focusing more on physical specimens instead of raw skill and talent. This is how Griezmann was rejected by every French academy cos he was too frail and too small for them even tho, he was technically gifted and had the desire to become a professional football, to Ed's point regarding attitude. He then goes to Spain where they focus more on touch, skill, movement and now he is worth 100m.

The Dutch do the same thing which is why Dutch players have been known for their technical quality because like the Spanish, they know that they are not physical beasts naturally BUT can counter this "flaw" by being technically gifted which they are and their academies focus on that as well hence, the technically gifted players that have come out of Holland over the decades. Until academies in England learn this, they will continue to fail.


22 Mar 2017 15:30:22
Totally agree, look at Crewe a club with minuscule financial resources who give youth a chance and many of their young players have careers at a higher level - their managers are encouraged to give young players time and opportunities. I wish clubs would focus more on player development but it seems that managers are either unwilling or afraid to give young players a chance. Fans also play their part imo too, they expect 18 year olds to be fantastic on their debuts or being as consistent as 28 year olds. It's sad that young talents continue to disappear.


22 Mar 2017 16:00:20
It is a beautiful picture Thomo. sadly, I do not see it happening in the coming years. The fanbase is growing rather "toxic", as the eds say. They will be up in arms if the club is perceived to be underachieving due to giving youth a chance. However, some sort of balance should be achievable for Liverpool FC. Not all of the youth talents will break through, or even get a fair chance, but here is to hoping that in five years time, we will be singing songs for Woodburn and Trent and Joe :>.


22 Mar 2017 17:22:24
I agree with Ed on this, seems less to do with ability but more to do with
1) mental aptitude and ability to stay humble and work hard as they enter the spotlight
2) limited opportunities/ pitch time to be able to adapt to the higher level and prove yourself (especially tough ask considering how long it takes for even world class players to get back to form after time out)
3) limited appetite from PL managers to risk their careers by playing an unproven youngster on a regular basis instead of just dipping into the transfer market for a proven player
4) simple Maths. dozens of youngsters coming through each year but very very few first team spots for them to realistically challenge for

I also don't think it's helped by the notable difference in level between u23 and the PL. hard to step up without playing professional league elsewhere first, but loans are notoriously hit and miss

Eg. I personally can see Ojo, Wilson, Woodburn all having the ability to be very good PL standard forwards if they get playing time to develop properly, it's just very hard to see how you get enough pitch time for all of them when you probably only have a few games a year where Klopp is prepared to drop his regular front 3 (never mind Origi, Ings etc. also wanting to play) . how can he possibly develop all 3 without loans?

It's a tough game,


22 Mar 2017 23:10:54
Ed's points are all correct but realism has to be considered. Over the last 50 years how many great Liverpool players have come through the academy? 10, 15 maybe? Yet every year we look at the latest graduates and anoint them as future stars, we say they have to be better than player X but the reality is they don't, the worst Liverpool player is still a brilliant footballer and most graduates won't reach that level.

Every few years we can expect one or two to make the grade and we should be content with that. The sadness is the last one who was good enough thought he was bigger than the club and forced his way out. There's a chance that someone from the current crop will make it but I'll remain sceptical of that until they're in the first team.


22 Mar 2017 09:28:04
RIP Ronnie Moran, did a hell of a lot for our club!

Believable12 Unbelievable0

22 Mar 2017 09:44:13
Lfc through and through. 83, not a bad innings. Rip.


22 Mar 2017 10:04:52
Lovely bloke
Heart and soul of LFC.


{Ed001's Note - a big loss. One of the all-time greats of football.}

22 Mar 2017 11:25:57
True great RIP RONNIE.


22 Mar 2017 12:21:19
May he rest in peace.


22 Mar 2017 09:21:37
In about 1995, away at Blackburn, Leonhardsen scored for us, we where driving out that silly car park when some bloke ran out the bushes after having a wazz. it was Ronnie moran. just shouted sorry boys and legged it in the opposite direction. legend. rip.

Believable7 Unbelievable0

22 Mar 2017 09:15:55
RIP Ronnie Moran - A true Liverpool legend.

Believable6 Unbelievable0

22 Mar 2017 09:35:51
Absolutely, a true gent and a true legend not just of our club but of football in general. RIP Ronnie and thanks for the memories. YNWA.


22 Mar 2017 11:52:57
A legend on and off the pitch.


22 Mar 2017 09:13:35
Ronnie Moran RIP absolute legend of a man.

Believable6 Unbelievable0

22 Mar 2017 09:10:12
News just in that LFC legend Ronnie Moran has died.
All the very best to the family and people who were close to Ronnie, im sure the club will provide a very fitting tribute
R. I. P Ronnie Moran YNWA.

Believable7 Unbelievable0

22 Mar 2017 09:09:20
Ronnie Moran; legend

RIP

YNWA.

Believable6 Unbelievable0

22 Mar 2017 08:29:40
Hi Folks
I am visiting England in May from Asia, and am hoping to get to the home game on the 6th. I know it is a tad late now, but would you be able to help with any reliable leads to get tickets? I am ok to get the regular tickets or even pay a bit of a premium for hospitality tickets (i am desperate to get to the game) .
Any leads will be much appreciated!

Believable1 Unbelievable0

22 Mar 2017 09:01:22
Try eec travel. on twitter. If u are on twitter let me have your id and I'll add u and send u the details. He may not have any tickets left but he may know someone. They are face value too. Cheers.


22 Mar 2017 10:21:16
Go hospitality mate. It sounds like it is once in a lifetime for you.


24 Mar 2017 02:38:36
Thanks for the responses folks. Yes, given this is my first trip to UK - very keen to get to a game. I went to the LFC website and the hospitality options seem to be mostly sold out as well. Any thoughts on how to source them?

@lfcdiamond - will get in touch with eec on twitter - thanks!


24 Mar 2017 02:48:37
By the way, is stubhub reliable to buy match tickets?


22 Mar 2017 07:18:29
Hi all,

Not sure why people keep following up on reports in the gossip columns. Ed2 has only just done a sharkopod detailing all the players he is aware of that we've had a sustained interest in.

Listen to it and stop throwing random names out there.

Believable2 Unbelievable1

22 Mar 2017 09:13:41
But it is FUN and we are BORED! Spring is here, the Ayres are singing in the trees, it is the time for shaking off the January lethargy, gathering the warchests, monitoring the players from random bushes, and preparing for the swoops, and the launches, and all the nice moves!


22 Mar 2017 09:41:16
It's a transfer banter page, that's what the page is about and why there is a separate transfer rumour page.


22 Mar 2017 10:03:46
Banter isn't asking if we have interest in every tom dick and Harry. Just saying what's the point when ed2 spent his time with the sharkopod of people are going to completely disregard it?


22 Mar 2017 02:13:19
Ed02 can you give any indication ...........

Believable1 Unbelievable0

{Ed002's Note - No sorry.}

22 Mar 2017 17:38:59
Haha ok thanks anyways.


 
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