Liverpool Banter Archive November 22 2015

22 Nov 2015 21:14:29
Really wonder how we will cope without good old Lucas! All the attacking players press and Lucas holds it together in the middle, if it is Lucas and hendo, i worry they will be both inclined to close down and leave the middle exposed. Swansea will try to play football so could be suspect to the press or exploit us if we leave gaps.

22 Nov 2015 21:34:49
Can / Allen would take up that role on Sunday. Swansea are struggling in the league. The only player to trouble us is Ayew.

22 Nov 2015 23:27:51
Im not sure can would be disciplined enough and Allen have the tactical awareness to be effective!
I hope we are not worried by ayew he isn't great.

23 Nov 2015 00:39:12
Totally agree. First 30min de bruyne was rampant in making those blindside runs. After like 15min Lucas decide someone got to pick up De bruyne and Lucas does wat he does best. We need this kind of intelligent player who can make ad hoc onfield tactical changes as the game develop. Was mightily impressed.

23 Nov 2015 00:54:31
Ayes is not all that. Klopp has a plan so not too worried.

23 Nov 2015 04:26:25
I would rather Klopp gives Rossiter or Chirivella a chance at CDM against Swansea instead of Allen. Keep Can at CM and bring on Henderson for the last 15-20 mins to replace him when he tires.

23 Nov 2015 09:38:45
Klopp will not be starting with Rossiter or Chirivella vs Swansea. He will play Emre in the holding role with Milner and Coutinho ahead of him, with Firmino and Lallana behind Benteke. Also i would say Swansea have more than Ayew, Montero is brilliant when he is in form, Sigurdsson has been their best player for a couple of seasons and Shelvy is doing queit well.

22 Nov 2015 17:40:03
ok question here please what is gegenpress everyone is raving about? its normal press and counter or there is something more to it?

22 Nov 2015 19:19:32
It's basically the old, Rock and Roll full throttle football thrashing City 4-1 get the pints in mate were on our way up, kind of style.

22 Nov 2015 19:36:05
Gengen pressing a specific tactic used and is very different from just a high press and counter attacking football. My understanding of it is that when you lose possession the other team are initially positionally vulnerable, in other words they are in their defensive set up and need a few seconds to get into attacking positions in order to move to the next phase. Therefore the idea is that you attempt to take advantage of these few seconds between phases and instantly respond with a high, intense press in order to win the ball back before the opposite team settles. If this is not achieved you then take up your natural defensive set up. Pretty certain that's what it is but if the eds or anyone else thinks it's different please feel free to correct me.

22 Nov 2015 20:28:32
That makes sense to me. I also noticed that when Hart had the ball, he couldn't pass to anyone because our front three occupied the spaces btw the FBs and the CBs as in Lallana btw Kolarov n Mangala, Firmino btw Mangal n Demichelis n Couts btw Demichelis n Sagna. As a former semi pro striker, that is how we as the frontmen, stopped the opp from starting attacks which always worked as the other tean had to go long and we had a chance of regaining possession. Simple football, really. Wonder why teams don't do that these days.

23 Nov 2015 00:46:38
Redohio, team don't do it bcos tiki taka and death by football with a 180 page dossier sound more sexy.

22 Nov 2015 17:11:24
Forget the goals and the hype but on general llay I am liking the lokk of vardy.

Strong and quick.

Ings didn't dk what wr has done and look how good he is.

Is it just extreme confidence for him at the moment eds or is it his quality now he's used to the league?

{Ed002's Note - I don't understand most of the post. Liverpool of course has no interest whatsoever in Vardy.}

22 Nov 2015 18:29:42
Yeah apoliges for the code.

I'll break it down for you.

Vardy a generally gold player or is he in a good moment?

22 Nov 2015 20:16:04
He's having a purple patch, he's not top drawer but some at our club and others may well be interested because they mostly can't see past the end of their noses.

22 Nov 2015 20:35:30
Dont need him. Wait till teams figure him out and well see how good he is.

23 Nov 2015 00:06:07
He's taking advantage of garbage defences in the premier league.

No way is he ever going to be good enough to play in Europe or internationally. Average player with rockets in his boots.

23 Nov 2015 00:50:19
Vardy is 28yo, he is typical outstanding-in-midtable-team-flop-in top-team kinda player. forget it. Better choices in europe.

{Ed007's Note - Come on, fair play to Vardy, he's worked hard to get where he is and deserves some credit for what he's done, wasn't it only about 3 years ago he was playing non-league? Look at some of the strikers who've played in the EPL yet he's got a chance to set his own record, what one of you out there wouldn't give your right ball for what the lad's experiencing and good luck to him I say.
Don't you think Vardy would have been a better signing than Lambert?}

23 Nov 2015 02:16:42
no vardy wouldn't have been a better signing than lambert because BR dropped our strikers when they scored or had a good game. Most he would have scored in a row was 1. He's a decent enough player but he isn't going to improve a vast amount at his age. Better persuing with ings who has the potential to reach a higher level.

{Ed007's Note - A higher level than what, playing in the EPL and for England? I doubt Ings will reach much higher than that. All I mean is give credit where it's due, the lad's workked his way up and is living the fairytale for now, don't you think it's quite a positive story about football for a change? It gives youngsters hope that even if you have to drop down a division or two to get regular games there's always a chance of getting back up there. Guys like Vardy could teach players like Sterling a lot.}

23 Nov 2015 03:59:42
I like Vardy. he is great. He has struggled and worked very hard to reach this point. His team is now top of the league so credit has to be given. I sometime don't understand the people here.

23 Nov 2015 09:58:33
My point was noone was excited about ings and yet look how good he is, yet he didn't do anything close tk what hardy is doing. So is hardy a good player or in a good moment.

He would definatly of been a better addition that lambert, you can't say he wouldn't kf been because we didn't have a coach who could use him right and would kf dropped him if he had scored.

I just think its the British game, if he had of been Brough over from Spain and done what he's don't then we would all eb raving about hjm.

Considering all the strikers we have had in the orem and hardy is the one who is going to get the record must say something.

24 Nov 2015 13:38:11
Vardy is playing good football and working his socks off to get his goals, the man has worked his way up from non league fleetwood to the prem and being the top scorer in the prem he has broken a record or at least on level with a record that is hard to achive, if he scores in his next game then he has set a record, his hard work has paid off and i hope just for him he scores in his next game to get the record, has he deserves it for getting his head down and working hard, well done to the man i say.

22 Nov 2015 14:33:32
Fear of the red planet, to carry on our discussion yesterday, as it went off the board, before I had a chance to reply.

You've essentially ruined your own point.

You said BR didn't favour players eg Firmino, yet you then admit he was lacking fitness in the first few games, and agreed he'd broken his back from september to october.

Can I then ask how you still came to the conclusion BR didn't favour him when he wasn't even available physically, you then said he played wing back, but then agreed with me he played in the forward 3 of a 4-3-3

I'm at a complete loss as to the point you were trying to make.

You made a post, about rodgers not favouring firmino, I disagreed, you kept arguing, and then went and found points backing up what I said. genuine question

Did you get lost along the way of making your point? Because as far as I can see you ended up agreeing with me at the end?

22 Nov 2015 16:34:30
We are creatures of habit. So when a good player isn't being played during BR reign, it was most likely because he just didn't 'fancy' him. So maybe he just added firmino to that list but for the wrong reasons. Although firmino was fit last couple of games under BR and wasn't used.

22 Nov 2015 16:04:40
LOL.

I didn't "admit" that Firmino lacked fitness. In fact, my argument is that this was a BS excuse; a thinly veiled excuse for the fact that he was clueless about Firmino and preferred to play others over him.

Which was my original point. Sorry, Boba.

Firmino was a transfer committee signing. Rodgers had no idea about him, didn't rate him, benched him early, and then continued to sub him and then he got injured.

Now, under a manager with an eye for talent, Firmino is turning into a force.

Also, you've seemed to conveniently miss the part of my post that demolished your false information about Firmino's injury in the Carlisle match. You claimed, in several posts, that Firmino had an "on and off" injury for a month. Firmino fell awkwardly in the Carlisle match and was later reported to have had a broken back.

22 Nov 2015 18:29:31
Rodgers was in the committee so why would Rodgers have no idea about him?

22 Nov 2015 18:37:55
So he came in unfit, which you didn't admit to originally, then agreed with ed002 he was unfit.

You expect unfit players to play 90 minutes? and you acknowledge he's subbed on at 77 and 69 minutes, the usual when getting players to full fitness.

You say he was a transfer committee purchase, neglecting that BR was part of that committee, and even say in your own little world, that BR agreed to buy him as long as it didn't impact CB coming in.

He then starts vs Arsenal WH and MU, Doesn't play midweek as BR switches a lot of the team around for the European fixture, eg 5 at the back with toure playing rossitter getting a game, Chriviella in for toure, Ibe playing and Brannigan getting a game (Clear squad rotating going on)

Then vs Nowrich, he finally! has both our 1st team strikers ready in Benteke and Studge, who people were clamouring to play together when fit. NONE of this is even slightly indicative that BR refused to play firmino, once again, he played 5 at the back, which left only 3 midfield spots for Milner, Pipco, lallana, can, and lucas, if ANYTHING it's indicative of BR's naivety in tactics.

None of this matters, as like I said he had an injury, which you actually neglected to mention in your original post. I was the one that brought the back injury to your attention. I mentioend on off, because of the times he was expected back but wasn't read to return to full training from the pressers. Once again I i will say this, you COMPLETELY neglected the injury in your original assessment.

So tell me how any of this points to BR ostracising him and ''not liking'' firmino. You haven't taken into account any of the match circumstances or injury/fitness problems, Which you then later on admit occurred and agree with me they would have kept him out the team.

22 Nov 2015 18:40:16
precisely re twist.

22 Nov 2015 18:46:24
It's been reported that Rodgers had to be "convinced" by others on the committee to recruit Firmino. He wanted assurances that acquiring Firmino would not impact our acquiring Benteke.

Of course, he would have learned of Firmino in the committee. Rodgers doesn't scout. But he would have seen Benteke, obviously, in EPL games. But he wouldn't have seen anything of Firmino.

It seems to me almost trite to say, at this point, that Rodgers favored players that he targeted. Watching Lovren start over and over again over Sakho seems to make this point self-evident.

He had no interest in Firmino. It showed. That has always been my point, at least on that count. Not the only point I made in my original post (which was to defend Firmino from lazy media stories) .

22 Nov 2015 19:28:40
Boba, you raised Firmino's injury first? It was a part of my original post defending Firmino. that he was under-utilized and played out of position in a bad formation by Rodgers and then he was injured. My final argument was that we should judge Firmino on his post-injury work under Klopp.

I think BR gave us a wonderful year of football in 2013/14, but in recent times, we saw his tactical and personnel flaws. I think his treatment of Firmino was simply another example of his flawed approach to player decisions. You disagree, and believe BR's excuses about match fitness. I don't. Let's agree to disagree.

22 Nov 2015 19:46:33
PPS: pretty much everything you've covered in this post, I covered in my original post. Not sure why you waited until now, once my OP is offline, to respond. What is more, nothing you write is actually responsive.

I won't cover ground I've already covered in my OP. Briefly: BR's excuse for sitting Firmino in his first two fixtures was BS, in IMHO.

He was then played out of position as a wide player (not his position) against United and WHU. It was a 4-3-3 which, as I've already posted, was so negative and pointless, it was a 4-5-1, with Ings and Firmino had to play almost as wingbacks, tracking back. To repeat myself again, go re-watch the match and check heatmaps.

After being played out of position for two games as a wide player tracking back like a wingback, he is then on the bench for Norwich and subbed in late.

You can say that it's because we had Sturridge and Benteke fit, but they were just both fit for City and Firmino played. See the difference with Klopp?

He's then started against Carlisle with our second team, and he is injured. See, again, the difference between BR and Klopp?

Firmino starts against City under Klopp. Under BR, he plays in the Carling Cup against lower squads.

Again, I covered all of this in my original post. I'm not going to go back over it for a third time after this post.

Let's agree to disagree on reality.

22 Nov 2015 20:15:32
Not everything I have covered was in that original post, you've made up basically that we bought Firmino based on the TC wanting him, and BR only agreeing to it as a long as we got CB i have no idea where you got that from.

I mentioned the back injury which kept him out for a month. If rodgers favoured players he bought aspas wouldn't have gone, Allen would have started a lot more games. It's naive to think a manager only ever starts players he buys. He might have favourites yes, but not simply because he bought them. There was once again nothing to suggest Firmino was outcast.

Im not denying BR needed to go or he wasn't good enough, just that a lot of your assertions about BR not picking him due to favouritism, and a dislike of him are quite frankly unfounded. and have shown you reasons why he wasn't picked.

You can call B. S on those first 2 fixtures all you want, but it was widely reported coming into the team he needed to up his fitness.

He plays any where across the front 4 so he isn't''out of position'' wide left right, am or cf.

So I don't get your point. I don't see what BR did wrong with him. With regard to the team vs carlisle, he once again rotated the team. you don't usually rotate the whole team just part of it, youth and experience. Firmino being in that team isn't mismanagement, and you can't account for an injury like that.

22 Nov 2015 23:54:17
The "wide reporting" on Firmino's fitness at the beginning of the season was the media essentially repeating Rodgers' lame explanation.

Firmino was one of our biggest signings over the summer. Rodgers then sits him for our first two fixtures. Naturally, media ask why. Rodgers' explanation is that Firmino isn't match fit because he had played in Copa, and arrived late to Melwood. This was reported over and over.

I say it was a BS excuse. First, because Coutinho had played in Copa, likewise arrived late to Melwood (and didn't play in the asian pre-season), and yet, he started both matches.

Second, it was also BS because Benteke likewise arrived at Melwood late, as another summer transfer acquisition who had international duty in June for Belgium. And there were questions about his fitness. And yet, Benteke started his first four matches for Liverpool.

Mysteriously, Firmino sits for both of his first two fixtures, and is featured quite late in both.

You can believe BR's explanation. That is fair and fine. I don't, just as I came to disbelief a lot of the schlock he spoke in interviews near the end of his time. I believe it was a pretext to favor other players, including Benteke, without having to answer to it.

As for Firmino, he's a central attacking midfielder. For Hoffenheim he played primarily as no. 10. He's played for Brazil as both a no.10 and as a false 9.

You can play him out wide, but that's not his best position. If you play him out wide, with defensive responsibilities like a wingback, as Rodgers did, even worse.

Klopp has played Firmino in the no 10 and as False 9. Why? Because he knows those are Firmino's best positions.

See the difference, again?

We're talking past each other at this stage. So let's leave it. I'm sure we'll find plenty else to argue about on here.

23 Nov 2015 09:39:15
Gonna wade in on a slightly overblown debate. Fear, you've made a few errors in your analysis:

1. Fitness -Comparing Firmino's fitness to Benteke or Couts is erroneous. Not only are players different but Benteke didn't play a summer tournament and Coutinho was Liverpool and PL experienced. Firmino was eased into the team.

2. His position - yes he played most often centrally for Hoffenheim but he played wide regularly as well. Also he was probably the best no 10 at Hoffenheim, he's not the best No. 10 at Liverpool. Both he and Couts need to be accommodated and if you're only playing one guy central Couts gets the role.

3. Wing back stuff - That is simply nonsense. He never played wing back and had no greater defensive duties than could have been expected of a midfielder.

4. Most damningly of all - You've made Bob defend Rodgers. That alone should be enough to make you back down.

{Ed001's Note - number 4 is reason enough to carry on! It is great reading boba defend Rodgers....}

23 Nov 2015 08:11:08
Bob: re Rodgers acceding to Firmino signing. it was reported in several outlets, Paul Joyce, for example, wrote about it, that Rodgers accepted the Firmino signing so long as Benteke was signed.

Google:

"Rodgers had the final say, but he also felt under pressure to horse trade at times.

He accepted Roberto Firmino so long as it did not impact on the arrival of Christian Benteke. "

Or, google this text:

"According to various reports, Benteke was a Rodgers signing as a compromise for the infamous 'Transfer Committee' getting their way by signing Roberto Firmino. "

Or, in the further alternative, search for this text, from a story exploring Rodgers' targets vs transfer committee:

"Rodgers was the driving force behind signing the likes of Fabio Borini, Joe Allen, Adam Lallana, Dejan Lovren, Rickie Lambert, Danny Ings, James Milner and Christian Benteke, while the other members of the committee championed the suitability of players such as Daniel Sturridge, Philippe Coutinho, Sakho, Emre Can, Moreno, Luis Alberto, Iago Aspas, Lazar Markovic, Divock Origi and Roberto Firmino"

Elsewhere you'll find out that Ian Ayres and David Fallows were key in pursuing Firmino.

It's obvious there was friction on the transfer committee, and Rodgers had targets he preferred over those that were recruited by others.

23 Nov 2015 11:47:58
Fear,

There are two more points to make. The argument, as I've read it, is whether Rodgers marginalised Firmino because he was a player he didn't want? I think it's demonstrable that Rodgers did not marginalise him. There is only one occasion when Firmino was available and didn't play and that was a game where most first teamers were rested (suggesting that Firmino was very much considered a first teamer) .

The second is that you argue that Rodgers doesn't like playing committee bought players. You then list 10 players, including Firmino, 6 of which, again including Firmino, Rodgers played regularly. Your own evidence undermines your argument.

I think it would be best if you dropped this one fella.

23 Nov 2015 13:04:26
I am not used to defending BR at all. I just think what's being spouted is a load of baloney with out anything factual backing it up, just an opinion that he was fit, and that, he was played wingback. It's ludicrous. I can't be bothered carrying it on though.

23 Nov 2015 13:08:26
Quoting Paul Joyce is pretty embarrassing. We all know who his best friend was, same with the echo.

23 Nov 2015 20:40:38
This really will be my last post on this.

Bob: Sorry to see your retirement from the discussion. Admittedly it *was* getting a bit bored correcting you on facts and pointing you to sources. Seems to me your most noteworthy contribution was basically fabricating an excuse for Rodgers' decisions about Firmino by claiming Firmino had an "off and on" injury for a month, when it was widely reported, and known, that Firmino was injured in the Carlisle match. Despite all that, it still has been fun.

PS: You don't like Paul Joyce, and that's fine. Unfortunately, many other outlets and journos reported on Rodgers being convinced of Firmino being signed, and on friction between Rodgers and the committee.

Muscatred: Thanks for the post. Let me address each in turn.

1. I don't think it's "erroneous" at all to compare Firmino's fitness with Benteke and Coutinho. It's not like Firmino was arriving from the Italian fourth league. He was arriving from the Bundesliga, which is widely understood to be the most comparable to the EPL in terms of physical demands. Moreover, Firmino was arriving from the Brazilian national team and its matches in Copa-- not exactly a cake walk. Arguably, Copa meant he would arrive in better fitness and shape than Benteke.

2. Firmino has played out wide, but it's not debatable what his best positions are. He's a central attacker. So, no 10 and no 9. Klopp has used him in both, but not out wide. You may be right that Klopp goes with Coutinho as the no.10 when there is a question, but I actually think apposite: Coutinho has been excellent out wide so far, and Firmino was killer when he played no.10 (though against a weak side) . No problem being wrong about this.

3. My point was that he was played out wide, in a formation that was clearly coached negatively by Rodgers, which didn't get the best out of Firmino. A very simple point. I think Firmino's success centrally under Klopp shows this is the case.

4. I don't know Bobtron's history. He's defended Rodgers admirably, if slightly badly at times.

The two other subsequent points you noted.

A. I'm not sure it's demonstrable at all. As per my arguments in #1 above, I still think sitting Firmino in his first two matches, with only late subs, was bunk. Moreover, you made the point about Firmino being "eased" into the side, to ensure match fitness. A fair point, if it weren't for the fact Rodgers often did not do this by this stage, given his desire to win (knowing his job was likely on the line) . For example, as soon as Sturridge declared himself fit, he started immediately, for three games in a row. No easing in. Lallana injured after Bournemouth, returned and started Sept 17th. No ease in. I honestly think Firmino only started against Arsenal, United, and West Ham was because Lallana was injured.

B. The list wasn't meant to demonstrate what players Rodgers played over others. *Of course* Rodgers played committee signings, otherwise his time here would be short. But again, is there any doubt he favored players like Lovren, Lallana, Milner, and Allen over other superior options like Sakho or Lucas.

Look, I get it -- both Boba and your main arguments -- that while Rodgers *was* an idiot, there's a reasonable explanation for why Firmino was played the way he was, due to fitness concerns, etc, and that I'm taking things too far, by claiming he didn't favour Firmino and thus failed to play him appropriately.

One day, the definitive history of the Rodgers reign will be written, and we'll learn Rodgers true feelings on Firmino and other players, and I'm confident that history will show me right-- it wasn't match fitness, nor injury concerns, just Rodgers didn't know much of Firmino. And Firmino ultimately got to play under Rodgers, due to some luck-- Lallana's injury in mid August until late September. I'm done.

23 Nov 2015 20:44:14
In other words, I'm betting on Rodgers' ignorance/cluelessness, ultimately carrying the day, in history's judgment, in the end. :)

22 Nov 2015 13:13:10
its great to see that the players that looked so bad and lacked confidence under BR now look great and full of confidence under klopp, he is getting his ideas across quick and the players are responding to it, i think its because they know klopp has won a league title and knows what he is doing and there seems to be no confusion it all looks so simple, of course its not its hard work and direction, under BR we lacked any direction and the players were so confused playing out of position, well we all know what he done so

well done Mr Klopp and the players who have given me hope and belief in my team again and its a pleasure again to watch us play week in week out, even when we got beat it never felt that bad, maybe because i knew it was just a blip,

im one happy reds fan today again for a long time.

22 Nov 2015 14:42:36
I have to agree. i allways thought the players look confused last season and begining of this.

22 Nov 2015 20:51:01
One manager knows what he's doing while the other was making it up as he went on.

22 Nov 2015 12:29:14
Great performance and result, well deserved, could have been 7,sloppy goal given away but good to see us doing what I said we should have been doing under BR, closing down, playing higher up the pitch and putting tackles in, and movement off the ball, so much better under Klopp.

22 Nov 2015 12:47:32
Can you please explain "sloppy goal" What I saw was a terrific strike that no keeper in the world would have saved by one of the best strikers in the world. Give credit where credit is due.

22 Nov 2015 13:04:28
It was sloppy by Skrtyl giving the ball away, Mings could have got rid of the ball earlier but chose to pass to Clyne who was already marked, but agree it was a great finish by a great striker.

22 Nov 2015 13:05:24
Should of got to aguero quicker, other than that it was a fantastic goal! Brilliant performance overall!

22 Nov 2015 13:24:20
Great goal, yes, but maybe Lucas was turned too easily - one on one by that stage was maybe too late for anyone to stop a striker of Aguero's quality. (Why oh why did we not sign him all those years ago! ) I would have thought Gegenpress would mean there were more people around him to stop him getting that shot off but he was left in a bit too much space too close to goal.

Great result but even though it was a team of City's quality (& at The Etihad), the lads should have knocked in more of those chances - in tighter games we need to be nailing those chances every time.

I thought Benteke should have done more with the chance he had. We've seen him show good movement, but it looked like he had concrete boots on. Although he missed a few he probably should have nailed the few other chances that went wanting, Firmino was really, really good. I would like to see how he perhaps pairs up with (or just behind) an out and out striker like Sturridge. Anyhow, it was encouraging to see how he and Couts linked up - in some ways reminiscent of SAS a few seasons ago. I thought the work rate of Can and Lallana was fantastic - and they both look like they are settling in to the side at last.

Have to carry this momentum forward now. Swansea, Newcastle, West Brom, Watford; good chance to add some points to the tally - and improve the goal difference, too.

Good to see the players finding some confidence, too.

22 Nov 2015 13:59:14
Robboz

be careful on here mate you can't say lucas has made a mistake on here people will jump all over you for saying it, i agree with you about lucas but have learned people on here don't see his mistakes they tend to blame everyone else, even if lucas is closer to the player who scored, but lucas has lost a bit of pace to be fair, but i agree with the players getting confidence and playing better, onwards and upwards

we go again.

22 Nov 2015 14:03:43
I think Lucas would have taken him down but he was already on a yellow card if I remember correctly,

22 Nov 2015 14:34:00
Lucas was very good yesterday and we will miss him against Swansea, I think Aguero is very very good but hasn't reached great yet probably due to his injury problems.

22 Nov 2015 16:41:59
It was a great strike but we played ourselves into trouble by needlessly giving the ball away. We nearly gave 3 goals away yesterday by passing back to the keeper when better options were available. Lucas was superb again yesterday.

22 Nov 2015 10:46:51
Not too shabby at all there was it?

We drew away at Tottenham, Everton and Arsenal.

We won away at City and Chelsea.

We lost away at United.

They are very good results for a team pushing the others for a place in the top 4.

I do understand what some people are saying about games when teams will be looking to park the bus, but don't be fooled, West Ham and Palace did not park the bus, they both played superbly against us.

I think you can see what Klopp is trying to achieve in both a defense and attacking sense. In defense he wants us to hunt down the opposition, stop them having the time to pick out great passes and get creative.
Moving in to attack he likes to get at teams quick, don't give them the opportunity to organise before getting in behind. He also seems to allow the players a lot more creative freedom. You cannot defend against a sublime bit of innovation such as Can's back heel, the opposition simply do not have time to react, and yet if it fails and they come away with the ball then we hunt them down and narrow their range of escape.

With the other big boys all to come to a confident Anfield, which will rock with every press in defense, we are an intimidating prospect for our opposition! Really do see us getting top 4 this season.

22 Nov 2015 12:16:46
Won at Stoke aswel which is never easy.

22 Nov 2015 09:05:31
My sauces are red and they tell me we are looking big tasty under the burgermeister. we're playing ketchup but I relish the challenge ahead.
We made Citeh look like gherkins on their own patch and their defence, like nuggets, lettuce dominate.
It was a big tasty show and, although I regret the loss of Big Mac and co., I'd love to super-size whatever mayo ccur over the 28-day trial period of delicious. oh, hang on. Sorry, I'm a little peckish but can't decide what I want.!

22 Nov 2015 07:45:36
I will admit that I was one of those who did not understand and agree with the firmino signing as we already had countless attacking midfielders on our books. I couldn't have been more wrong, the boy is so amazing. I am putting my foot on the ground and saying that firmino ends our such for the next Suarez. when you look at his movement in the final third is not that different from Suarez. need I talk about his desire to get on the ball? with game time and experience he will definitely reach or even supercede Suarez. his finishing will improve after all Suarez was also not the best finisher at the age of 24. And by the way he seems a really nice and down to earth bloke which means he won't miss so many games through bans.

22 Nov 2015 09:16:32
Did we open a new competition of the most rediculus post of the month? Firmino is a nice player, he is not and will never be one tenth of Suarez. He had a good game yesterday, should have scored 2 or 3 more. At the moment he is not half as good as couts even. Suarez?

22 Nov 2015 10:00:56
Well Firminho can be as good as Suarez but not right now. after 2 seasons under Jurgen . who knows.

PS : even Suarez for that matter was not very good in his first season, he improved massively over the next seasons and right now he is is just brilliant. Yesterday was masterclass against Madrid.

22 Nov 2015 10:09:57
Fanobip, Suarez was good but not the best at 24, how many goals did he average in his first 13 premiership games? and yet he was brought when on form and at a time of a resurging Liverpool after the appointment of king Kenny? Here is a boy who came in after copa tournament, not given opportunity and playing for a lost team under br. now he is show casing his skill under klopp. Good as Suarez was, it's absurd if you think that Suarez of 5 seasons back was a world beater.

22 Nov 2015 10:46:07
One tenth of Suarez? Do you still worship Suarez in your free time?

22 Nov 2015 11:55:23
A little perspective guys, Suarez is a top-10 in the world player. Firmino has a long way to go before he can justify this comparison.

22 Nov 2015 12:18:50
Suarez wasnt top 10 when he signed for Liverpool. It took until his 3rd season before we seen the Suarez that we see today. His season and a half were ok but far from special. Its a bit unfair to compare the Firmino that has just arrived to the Suarez that left us.

22 Nov 2015 12:19:18
No mate. Firmino is a tidy little player. Suarez makes you challenge for league titles on his own, scoring goals in Champions League finals etc. World World Class.

22 Nov 2015 13:39:36
Fanobip, give firmino a bit of slack ffs he is getting used to the prem not all players can come to the prem and slot back in, i for one have said the same about linking him to suarez, the people who are doing so are looking to the future because they can see what i can see and what you can't see and that is the player will only get better and cause defences in the prem all kinds of trouble who won't like playing against him, suarez he is not suarez type of football yes all day long, if you can't see that then your not looking in the right place, is one on one with joe hart was a great save from hart not a miss by firmino, so do the lad a favour hey and give him a chance to get used to the prem and a new team a new manager and new team mates plus a new home and a new language, but all you go on about is negatives, he is doing better than some english players who have played in the prem for years, why not judge him at the end of the season maybe then you won't look like the fool you do now.

22 Nov 2015 05:42:28
Great performance yesterday but let's not get carried away. There was a same sort of optimism amongst the fans and everyone knows what happened against CP. Yeah we played great football but if we can do the same against teams that Park the bus remains to be soon.

Let's wait till we get consistency as 1 or 2 good performances do not make a season.

Good job to the team for yesterday though.

Let's get 3 more points at Swansea.

22 Nov 2015 08:33:37
Swansea is a home game for us (and annoyingly, even though it is on Sunday, for a second time in a month it is not on TV and at best we will have to rely on some poor streaming (those not going to the match) .

{Ed001's Note - there should be good streams as the game will be televised around the world.}

22 Nov 2015 09:30:27
I know but at least in my computer those streams are typically poor quality, slow, get stopped a lot. Better than nothing but not great.

22 Nov 2015 12:30:05
Download mobdro it's the best.

22 Nov 2015 17:39:20
When it wants to work lol.

22 Nov 2015 17:46:03
When it works, but it is good though.

22 Nov 2015 02:50:39
Question for ED001/Benny,

Just wondering, is there going to be another podcast anytime soon? The podcasts are great, would be awesome if you guys done another one at some point.

{Ed001's Note - yes mate, we will be doing them again. Hopefully back to normal with them this week.}

22 Nov 2015 00:51:40
Cracking performance by the whole team. Just shows what a bit of passion and self-confidence can do. Klopp certainly seems like a round peg in a round hole. The whole team seems revigorated and inspired and unshackled, and unfairly-maligned players such as Lovren and Mignolet are showing why we paid top dollar for them.
City really had no answers and even Graham Sterling spent more time checking his face on the big screen than posing a threat.
Dare I say it, that performance was outstanding.