Liverpool Banter Archive January 06 2016

 

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06 Jan 2016 23:51:46
Just a pointer for anyone coming down to Exeter on Friday who may not have been before. There are trains straight to St James Park from both Central and St David's stations. Its on the Exmouth line. That's your best bet for getting there if you are not staying nearby.

Gutted I couldn't get tickets for the match, have a great evening :-)

Believable5 Unbelievable0

06 Jan 2016 23:30:18
So glad we finally have a manager who is happy to put a rocket up players who under-perform or lack effort. I couldn't imagine Rogers or Hodgson ever really raising their voice, not sure about Kenny, and Rafa always seemed too controlled and aloof to fly off the handle.
Like him or not, Fergie knew how to chop down prima donnas and diminish dressing-room egos and if you didn't like it you were gone. It's great to see that Klopp has a bit of that in him too.

Believable2 Unbelievable1

06 Jan 2016 23:07:37
Really shocked by our interest in Ranocchia. Although he does bring leadership in terms of his personality (former Inter Captain) he isn't exactly the sort to marshal a defensive line.

He is great in the tackle, relatively quick, great in the air, good on the ball and a threat from set pieces. However he is like David Luiz. He just goes on little adventures and leaves gaps at the back. He just gets sucked into attacks when he steps out of defence. When he is in position he reads the game well but he is just so keen to get forward at every opportunity. Undoubted ability, but probably over confident and reckless.

Still, Klopp must see something in him. He is better than Matip although Matip is younger and he's probably a bit behind Subotic athough far more reliable in terms of fitness.

Believable0 Unbelievable0

07 Jan 2016 01:49:13
Hes really good, but not very good at all! I like him, but don't really like him ;) .


06 Jan 2016 21:40:53
Looking forward to Tonight's LFC legends game in Sydney, my last reds game was in Brisbane last year and I'm proud to say I was part of the best ever YNWA in Melbourne in 2013. Hoping for a good game tonight with some fun and laughs thrown in, 70-80 thousand fans expected in Sydney!

Believable4 Unbelievable1

06 Jan 2016 20:44:23
Do you guys reckon that tickets to the semi final second leg will go to general sale? Fingers crossed.

Believable1 Unbelievable2

06 Jan 2016 21:50:51
I doubt it will get past the members sale to be honest.


06 Jan 2016 20:39:33
I have a question for any and all. Regarding transfers I've been following LFC like my religion for a long time now. Other than a few around 2006 or so why is it that LFC are spending millions of dollars and not getting good return on the pitch for that money. Is it down to needing a better General Manager? Is the club not attractive? Or is it simply throwing a bunch of cap at the wall to see what sticks?
I've said it before here I'm originally from Pittsburgh. The Steelers have arguably the best franchise in the NFL. They have had 3 head coaches in my life (36 years) They have had 2 GMs. My point is there is something to continuity from the top down. Is that something the club is missing? Can it be fixed?

Believable4 Unbelievable1

06 Jan 2016 23:46:57
From where I'm sitting there are a number of things. Firstly, lack of stability within the squad regarding transfers. Bringing in far too many players and it taking longer than it should for them to learn about how to play together. In my humble opinion it is better to bring in a few players that will really make a difference than a large handful who are of similar standard to what we already had. That way if a player needs time to adapt, they still have a solid team around them who know what they are doing to carry them during this period. Secondly, there have been some notable issues with players not replicating form they have shown at previous clubs. We're not the easiest bunch of supporters to please, maybe they are not up for stepping up to the plate? Or maybe they have not been scouted effectively enough for the manager to realise that they perform a certain way due to a different role, or a different style of play at their previous club. Over the last few years particularly it seems that we have prioritised quantity over quality, and even then still managed to overpay on far too many of our transfers. We must keep in mind as well that the club is not an attractive prospect to a potential player who wants to be challenging for the EPL and CL every season. This baffles me a little, as I'd hope that a player confident of their ability would know that they could make the difference and change us from a team that could challenge into a team that will challenge consistently. I also guess that we probably don't have a great reputation regarding our treatment of young players, which will hopefully change very soon with Mr Klopp at the healm. I think there is a lot of stabilising that needs to take place, regarding many different aspects of the club, including our finances. Our owners throwing millions upon millions at transfers will not solve this without an effective strategy in place, and certainly not in the short term at all.

Just a few thoughts, I'm no expert mind.


07 Jan 2016 02:32:41
Interesting question 420. I grew up in PA but choose the other team sadly. I do though think it is an interesting question because like you said in the NFL and some other american sports consistency in mgmt, coaching, vision and identity often lead to success. Seems like in this game though it more often than not is about money and putting together a talent squad to win now versus building a team from the ground up and giving coaches ample time to impliment their system.


07 Jan 2016 02:41:19
Sorry 420.didn't finish before I press send. Guess the point was more about the NFL having the salary cap which pretty much makes putting together winning team a 3 year process of good drafts and vets. to stay consistent like the stillers they have a strong GM and coaches who stay with the vision and keep addimg to a strong core team. Seems in this game the too teams can simply ditch their coach, splash the cash and turn the sqaud around in a transfer or two. I thing FSG finally has the right coach. He Wil create the vision and hopefully he and the transfer team can bring in guys who meet that vision. I do see them giving him Yeats to do it and if so I am pretty confident it will reap rewards. We simply can't spend like others so we have to rely on klopp building a strong foundation like he did at dortmund to slaughter the mighty goliaths!


06 Jan 2016 19:59:23
Ed01, would you like to see Ilori back and secondly would you start him against Exeter.

Believable2 Unbelievable0

{Ed001's Note - we need centre halves, so yes I would like to see him back to see what he can do. Yes, that would mean against Exeter to start with.}

06 Jan 2016 20:58:36
Don't think he could play against Exeter, could he? Thought he had to be registered the Friday prior to the game and since it's a Friday game that's not possible now. If we were playing Saturday, I think he could be registered.


06 Jan 2016 23:29:20
Seen as he is only on loan would he still not officially be registered as an LFC player until Villa bought him outright?


{Ed002's Note - No. He registration is transferred for the length of the loan.}

06 Jan 2016 20:03:19
Liverpool are set to recall 18 year-old Sheyi Ojo from his loan spell at Wolves. The winger could be in the squad to face Exeter on Friday.

Believable2 Unbelievable2

06 Jan 2016 21:53:39
Smithy, the same rule applies, he has to be registered the Friday before the game so as the game is on Friday he had to be registered last Friday.


06 Jan 2016 23:30:35
Do loaned players have to be registered? Are they not already LFC players? I'm not sure how it works.


{Ed002's Note - Of course they do.}

06 Jan 2016 19:26:00
Heard a funny rumour on Talk Sport this afternoon.

Suarez to Chelsea, Ed 002 must be delighted 😜.

Believable1 Unbelievable0

{Ed002's Note - A "done deal" no doubt. Actually I did give a hint on these pages a couple of weeks ago to where his next destination might be.}

06 Jan 2016 19:47:45
It's man utd :)


06 Jan 2016 20:17:42
Do Barcelona want rid of the Toothed One then?


{Ed002's Note - They will be open to offers and need the money to rebuild.}

06 Jan 2016 20:19:19
Ed002- I used the search function on several pages but I can't find the update on Suarez. I was just wondering if you could post the hint on where you think he might be off to next, hopefully not back to England if it's not for Liverpool.


{Ed002's Note - Do not be surprised if he were to turn up back in England Alex. It is wrapped up in some other stuff but it is far from out of the question that Manchester City will turn to him.}

06 Jan 2016 20:28:20
Done deal - spot on again Ed 002 - haha.
Didn't see that post re the hint on Suarez's next destination, any more hints?!?


{Ed002's Note - RTP.}

06 Jan 2016 20:29:22
Cheers for the response Ed002. No shocks there then all the lies about hating English media etc.


{Ed002's Note - Many, many people have a problem with the English media - including the Liverpool manager.}

06 Jan 2016 20:47:58
Why don't Citeh just change their strip to all red and have done with it?

Maybe they will bid for Sturridge when he is back playing and link him with Sterling and Suarez.

Pep wants Suarez apparently or will Citeh pull a blinder and bring in Brendan as their new boss. That would be totally insane.


06 Jan 2016 20:47:32
Are Barcelona skint ed002?


{Ed002's Note - I have no idea what you mean.}

06 Jan 2016 21:06:10
Barca registered 77 new players this week after their transfer (cough) ban was lifted.

Funny they got 77 deals negotiated so swiftly, good to see punishment taken seriously.

Maybe they have no room for Luis?


{Ed002's Note - You can negotiate at any time and they have continued to have negotiations over sales and purchases whilst banned. There were only two first team players in the list - the rest were 7 year olds etc..}

06 Jan 2016 21:26:19
If pep goes to city will they look to Suarez.


{Ed002's Note - See above please.}

06 Jan 2016 21:51:13
Such a shame that he said at Gerrards testimonial that if he was to return to England he could only ever play for Liverpool after the reception we gave him on his return.


06 Jan 2016 22:35:57
He also told KK that he would shake hands with Evra.


06 Jan 2016 22:42:22
I'm praying to god Bayern or someone comes in for him, as much as i love the MSN combination i'm starting to wish Madrid had just made their move earlier and then we most likely wouldn't be facing the problem of him possibly joining City.


06 Jan 2016 22:52:04
Peps brother is Suarez agent, so I think Ed02 will be proved correct once again.


06 Jan 2016 22:52:04
Peps brother is Suarez agent, so I think Ed02 will be proved correct once again.


06 Jan 2016 18:57:06
I photoshopped klopps head on the hulk after someones request. don't think my link worked before.

Believable1 Unbelievable0

{Ed033's Note - i used the Liverpool image uploader. Link below of Jurgen Klopp as Incredible Hulk with the quote "You won't like me when I'm angry", requested by Numpty.


Klopp as Hulk

06 Jan 2016 19:08:12
Question for the eds please? I've seen ilori play several times for Granada I think and Bordeaux but was especially impressed with him in the u21 euros where Portugal didn't concede a goal until he was injured (including a 5-0 victory over Germany) . what's your opinion of his talent and should he be given a chance if we can recall him? thank you!

Believable3 Unbelievable2

{Ed002's Note - He has only played a handful of games in the last two and a half years (none at all for Liverpool). He has been on loan at bottom of the table Aston Villa and is deemed not acceptable for them (unable to get any games there). He did indeed play a few games for Bordeaux and Grenada - but not many of course. In the summer Real Sociedad were interested in Ilori on a permanent deal - but dropped their interest. Aston Villa, Sunderland, Celtic and Hull declared an interest in a loan.

Many Liverpool fans see him as the Messiah - for reasons I don't understand.}

06 Jan 2016 19:31:45
No fans deem him the messiah! We simply want to see a talented, quick, young centre back who is very confident on the to be given a fair chance. We all know he has potential and its doesn't matter about all these loan moves as it was mostly injuries and brain dead managers that cost him game time.
Thanks.


06 Jan 2016 20:16:14
Ed002 only calls him the Messiah just to get a reaction from us. Ed002 likes toying with his prey before being dismembered piece by piece.


06 Jan 2016 21:49:59
Thanks for the reply eds. i for one think he should be given a chance if villa let us have him back and it's not as if we are flush with fit cbs.


06 Jan 2016 22:01:43
KLOPPO. So all these managers who's job relies on them getting results are brain dead. But you are right even though he hasn't kicked a ball for Liverpool. No wonder Ed2 is mystified.


06 Jan 2016 16:33:11
Not sure how true this is but apparently we are willing to sell on Markovic for just 7.3 million. I really hope this isn't true I would rather see him given a chance for us I. His natural position.

We paid 20 million for him only a 18-19 months ago baffling.

Believable7 Unbelievable0

{Ed002's Note - The damage to his career has already been done - he needs to move on.}

06 Jan 2016 16:46:42
I would rather keep him than sell for that stupid amount. Selling a young player with a lot of potential for a third of what we paid for him 18 months ago is very bad business.
But the again, its is upto the player. If he wants out, not much LFC can do about it. I just hope the club holds out for more than 7 million.


{Ed002's Note - Liverpool have made a real mess of the situation with Markovic - he needs to get away.}

06 Jan 2016 16:56:12
But Ed surely the main culprit namely Rodgers is now gone so under Klopp things could have been different?


{Ed002's Note - He will look to be moving on Chris - he has a two year bite out of his career because of Liverpool - not because of Brendan Rodgers.}

06 Jan 2016 17:12:20
There has been some appalling business done.

I was heavily criticised for calling Benteke a donkey. Mainly because of the price tag of £32million. Although he has scored some vital goals he has missed a few. His movement is not that great. OK as an addition but not for £32 million?

Is £7 million Markovic's true value? Another player messed about.

Agreed we have been unfortunate with injuries. Sturridge is great but seems to be permanently injured.

Perhaps Juergen's training regime is too fierce, but so was Bill Shankly's!

£200 + million spent. A couple of good players and many loaned out.
What a way to run a railway!


06 Jan 2016 17:18:02
Don't blame him at all if he wants to stay in Turkey after how he was treated.

If so, wish him the best. Those Istanbul derbies are crazy.


06 Jan 2016 17:24:44
7.3 why not 7.4?


06 Jan 2016 17:30:28
wiseryan - because his value is in euro so it will fluctuate in sterling dependent on exchange rates. He is €10M - so his sterling value is whatever the exchange rate is.


06 Jan 2016 17:56:27
He should never have been bought and BR just made a mockery of his career as he did Ilori.


06 Jan 2016 17:53:47
You'll have to explain how that's Liverpool at fault and not Rodgers Ed I'm afraid.


{Ed002's Note - The purchases were made by the club after consideration by the transfer committee - Markovic was a player BR wanted - but the move for him was agreed by all. The club over paid for a player who wasn't ready for the EPL - Benfica and Chelsea were both more than happy of course. I explained at the time he wasn't ready - he should have been allowed to stay - some of my previous notes about Markovic:

14-Jul-2014: Markovic is a player that Chelsea were looking to leave in Benfica for another year to mature as a person and a player. A lot is expected of him in the longer term but they could have paid Benfica €7.5M for him this summer and chose not to.
22-Jul-2014: I fear to some extent that it has been a bit of a kid in a candy store with his pocket money. There are a couple of risky purchases, Markovic for example. Whilst much is expected of him Liverpool has spent €25M plus some very high agent fees on him (in addition to all of the other costs) when Chelsea were looking to leave him to learn to train better and hone his skills for another year in Portugal - and decided against taking him for €7.5M this summer. The deal with Liverpool suits Chelsea financially but I think it may be tough to get an immediate return.
04-May-2015: A lot of money for a player who simply was not ready – he will stay but his value will now be less than half what Liverpool paid. The money could have been spent better elsewhere. Liverpool perhaps should have considered the rationale behind Chelsea stepping away.

Liverpool were to blame - not Rodgers Chris.}

06 Jan 2016 18:11:16
Doesn't matter to me who is to blame, what is the point in holding on to and paying the wages of a player who doesn't want to play for the club?

He's never going to bust a gut and go the extra mile for the team after all that has happened.

You have to move things forward. If Liverpool sell, they receive some funds, the player leaves contented and the reputational damage to Liverpool is minimised.

Let's stop making things worse for ourselves, sometimes you have to cut your losses.


06 Jan 2016 18:24:41
I hope he fulfills his undoubted potential. Dreadful way to treat a young player.


06 Jan 2016 18:46:04
Ron, Liverpool are always cutting their losses. Aspas, Alberto, Mario, Markovich, Carroll, i'm sure I've missed a dozen.


06 Jan 2016 18:59:57
There's no point in keeping Markovic to avoid the bad business of selling him at a big loss if any of the following are true:

1) He doesn't really want to play for us for any reason.

2) He isn't going to get in the team regularly and will just continue to stagnate, lose value and damage his career if he stays.

3) The manager and coaching staff plain and simple don't think he's good enough to be a Liverpool player at this point in his career.

I'd say any of the above have a good chance of being true, and possibly more than one of them, so he's probably going to leave.


06 Jan 2016 20:01:34
I honestly don't no of any other prem team who are as bad as Liverpool at jumping in and buying players and cocking there careers up and wasting money FSG must be steaming mad behind the scenes.


06 Jan 2016 20:48:17
The club could have done better but Rodgers got his man and then wasted him.
I'm quite pleased that Liverpool didn't step away simply because Chelsea had. In this instance it may have been the right thing to do but it's no way to run your transfers, to take notice of what other clubs opinions are.


06 Jan 2016 20:56:54
I'm inclined to agree with the posters here. Sure, we took the player a little early perhaps, the club however were not at fault for simply not playing him in the right position, or not even at all for long periods of time. The club okayed the transfer, but with respect to footballing matters the buck stops with Rodgers. It is as simple as that.


{Ed002's Note - So are you now taking the opportunity to turn on Klopp because of all of the injuries? Or are you giving Klopp the benefit of doubt and blaming Zeljko Buvac?}

06 Jan 2016 22:38:25
BR wanted him. It was his call to get him here. It's his fault, end of.


06 Jan 2016 22:12:51
Ease up Ed, what's that got to do with Rodgers and Markovic?

As for all these injuries, most of us, including ed001, blame how relatively unfit the players already are.


{Ed002's Note - The players are far from unfit.}

06 Jan 2016 22:12:51
Ease up Ed, what's that got to do with Rodgers and Markovic?

As for all these injuries, most of us, including ed001, blame how relatively unfit the players already are.


{Ed002's Note - The players are far from unfit.}

07 Jan 2016 04:41:34
They are not. Some football teams are more fit than other teams, and Liverpool are not fit enough for Klopp's style. Spurs had the same problem last season.


06 Jan 2016 16:28:18
Nice touch from Exeter printing a 96 page programme in tribute to our brothers an sisters for Friday nights game, jft96 YNWA.

Believable17 Unbelievable0

06 Jan 2016 16:28:18
Nice touch from Exeter printing a 96 page programme in tribute to our brothers an sisters for Friday nights game, jft96 YNWA.

Believable8 Unbelievable0

06 Jan 2016 15:05:26
Hi eds,

Can you please confirm whether ilori will have his loan cut short or not?

Thanks.

Believable3 Unbelievable1

{Ed002's Note - If Liverpool can agree a figure with Aston Villa then they might have the pleasure of his company.}

06 Jan 2016 15:56:18
The "privilege" surely?


06 Jan 2016 16:18:51
I wonder if this is now under serious consideration given last nights injury crisis with the centre halves?

I say why not finally he can have a chance at proving himself, he's a player I believe Klopp was interested in before he signed for us and we desperately need a centre back in two days time to play in cup.


06 Jan 2016 16:49:24
Regardless of what happens with Ilori, the club will definitely sign a CB imo. Would be happy with either Subotic or Matip.


06 Jan 2016 16:57:46
Indian Buzzer- surely signing another a long with Ilori returning would just be stupid, what happens when Sakho, Skrtel, Lovren, Toure, Ilori and Matip/ Subotic are all fit? That's ruling out all youth and reserve centre backs.


06 Jan 2016 15:44:03
Did we receive a significant loan fee ed? If they are expecting a significant cancellation fee in return do you expect us to dip our toes into the transfer market?


{Ed001's Note - it was about a mill, far less than would be needed to sign someone else.}

06 Jan 2016 17:32:18
Would they not be looking to cut their losses as well and save on his wages they are paying him between now and the end of the season? It doesn't look like they are going to use him, and yes I know that says a lot again about how good he is because it is 2 managers have seen him there at Villa and neither of them have taken a fancy to him.


{Ed002's Note - I am sure they would but that does not need to detract from Liverpool coming up with a figure that Aston Villa are happy with.}

06 Jan 2016 13:50:20
G'day Jaxman. I am based in Australia and there's no such time difference. Anyhoo my source, Sheila, tells me Jurgen Klopp will be announced as manager of LFC.

Believable8 Unbelievable0

06 Jan 2016 13:55:14
Very clever ;)


06 Jan 2016 12:11:26
Reading a lot of places report we are trying to cancel Ilori loan deal with Villa. No where has clairifed if a. Possible or b. Cost. Does it work as half a season pay back half the loan fee or is it total negotiation?

Now for me, if Ilori had stayed I would have been busting to see him in the squad and play games. Now that he couldn't even get near the Villa team under two different managers both having shocking results, I'm now thinking the opposite. Isn't there anyone else in our youth squad Lloyd Jones pour un?

Believable0 Unbelievable1

{Ed001's Note - Jones is injured. He came back from Blackpool due to a serious long term injury.}

06 Jan 2016 13:44:47
Thanks Ed. I thought that was someone else.

So what about the other bits in my post? You heard anything about Ilori returning, how the loan fee gets dealt with and finally his actual playing time/ talent.

Have you had any thoughts before the Villa loan and during about his quality?

If he comes back and plays, obviously I'd love it if he becomes the player we've hyped, he has had some impressive loan games and against some quality forwards . but the Villa thing, just can't work that out but it has challenged my opinion, rightly or wrongly.


{Ed001's Note - Ilori returning is a possibility, a deal is under negotiation.}

06 Jan 2016 14:37:45
Rumour that Ilori pulled his hamstring while sitting down to talk with his manager about ending his loan.


06 Jan 2016 16:37:13
Another hammy? Klopp Out!


06 Jan 2016 15:03:22
A side question ed, you have mentioned before about how we lack significant CB cover for the first team in the academy. So i was wondering if the club has been looking at bringing in any for the u21's?
It seems ridiculous to me that we are having to try and recall players from loans because we have no cover in this area and seems like we haven't for some time.
Cheers.


{Ed001's Note - the club is always looking for them.}

06 Jan 2016 12:05:28
Looks like ilori coming back. Can't wait for the banter from Ed002.

Believable7 Unbelievable6

06 Jan 2016 13:50:49
Ilori 1.9m good height for cb. But he definitely need to bulk up in gym and his diet.


06 Jan 2016 12:40:58
ed002 doesn't do banter though, he rips people another tentafere.


06 Jan 2016 17:05:28
Haha i googled that and it came back with ed02 's fadget with batteries response and made me lol on the bus. Fadgets with batteries and a tentaferes hmmmm, sounds like a fun evening. Lol.


06 Jan 2016 11:35:55
I'm off to the LFC Legends vs AUS Legends tomorrow with my two boys If there are any others out there going, I hope you have a great time The three of us are buzzing and can't wait.

Believable4 Unbelievable0

06 Jan 2016 11:30:30
Grujic deal is taking a long time isn't it.

I thought his medical was on Monday this week.

Has anyone got any news about it?

Believable0 Unbelievable6

06 Jan 2016 12:12:45
He's hurt his hamstring.
Also eds have said before our medicals take a few days.


06 Jan 2016 12:34:07
Window has just opened? What is the rush!?


06 Jan 2016 14:41:58
It's on LFC website that the lad as signed going back to Red Star.


06 Jan 2016 15:01:25
He signed earlier today.


06 Jan 2016 11:17:44
Random question, 2001 when we won't the uefa cup, curling cup and fa cup, is that the most amount of games played in one season?

Believable0 Unbelievable0

06 Jan 2016 19:27:40
63 games we played that season, at least that's how many I counted from Wikipedia.


06 Jan 2016 10:49:33
Toure just had cramp and I don't think Sakho is seriously hurt either. It looked more like he was being rested. If it comes down to it, we can just play Can and Lucas at the back against Exeter. Chile won the Copa America with a midfielder from Middlesborough in their defence alongside Medel who is also a CM. No offence to Exeter but they aren't Brazil, Uruguay or Argentina. If they turn up with Messi, Suarez or Neymar then personally I'd ask to see their registration details ;) I'm positive Toure and Sakho will be back for the Arsenal game at least.

Believable3 Unbelievable6

06 Jan 2016 11:16:23
Exeter will turn up with "we've got nothing to lose" attitude and that beats messi surez and neymar. Liverpool is facing potential banana skin on thiz one.


06 Jan 2016 11:22:49
Would you risk both against Exeter? i'd rather see toure and Lucas again, make sure sakho is fot for Arsenal. Pitch won't be perfect, and if we can't beat Exeter with them two back there we don't deserve to go through.


06 Jan 2016 12:06:23
I'm sure we could manage on Friday but klopp was looking to replace toure in the summer.

If we can someone in now it would be the best solution if it's the same targets not just someone to fill in.

There's a few reports the loan of Llori being cancelled which I would love to see and given a chance under Klopp.


06 Jan 2016 12:16:20
Agree Fencey as long as Toure is definitely up to playing against Exeter and Arsenal. Leekuwnyew are you serious? I don't care how up for it they are, they are not going to turn up and play like Barcelona jist because they've got nothing to lose. We should be able to beat them with the players we have available. Because whether you like it or not, we're probably not going to sign q centre back by Friday. Matip may be pushed through early but I doubt he'll even be brought in in time for the Arsenal game.


06 Jan 2016 12:36:52
Ems, you must be the perfect wife/ girlfriend! Gorgeous, loves football and knows a fair bit about the game! 😅😅😉 just saying!


06 Jan 2016 12:39:14
If ilori is recalled its a great chance for him
To show if he has what it takes. Everytime he's mentioned on here people either think he's rubbish or they take the p*** out of people for suggesting he should be given him a run ( by suggest that everyone thinks he's the second messiah) . I've alway been one to say give him a few games and let's see what he can do. I hope he does come back and proves himself. We certainly need him now!


06 Jan 2016 13:00:16
Oh stop it you ;) I wouldn't say perfect. Probably a solid 9.8/ 10 though!


06 Jan 2016 13:40:37
Hello EMS, Exeter do not have to play like Barcelona to beat us or draw to get another match at Anfield, they just need to play like Newcastle Palace Westham WBA.


06 Jan 2016 13:45:24
EMS well well now you are a girl after my own heart. Klopp should be looking at you as his right hand man.


06 Jan 2016 14:59:30
i thought ems was a dude . _. don't ask why.


06 Jan 2016 17:14:10
I didn't know you were a ladette ems i always thought the pic on your profile was kim kardashian!


06 Jan 2016 17:36:00
I'd rather lose to Exeter than risk more injuries to first team players before two tough matches against Arsenal and United.

They could play Enrique. Heh, heh. Or if the Reds need a loyal fan to sub-in at CB on Friday, I'm waiting by the phone. They know my number.


06 Jan 2016 18:33:45
Ha ha. no, ems has always been gorgeous! P. s ru single or is the a very lucky man behind u?! 😂😂.


06 Jan 2016 09:21:49
First time properly using the live chat last night. It was a great laugh and made watching the game on my own much more entertaining! Cheers eds for getting the feature up and running.

Believable5 Unbelievable0

06 Jan 2016 10:40:09
Yeah it's a good craic.

If I'm not at the game I'm on there from now on. 😃
Nice one Eds.


06 Jan 2016 09:11:23
Perfect time to try and get subotic in, we are really in trouble at the back right now.

Believable6 Unbelievable3

06 Jan 2016 10:19:18
Subotic is a real possibility. Though Hummels preferred.


06 Jan 2016 10:45:02
What about getting illori back from Villa surely him rotting in their reserves is a waste when we can give him game time and then deem him good enough or not.


06 Jan 2016 08:50:32
Morning Eds . Do you think the current injury list is going to spark a bit of 'unplanned' action in this transfer window? or do you think we will wait? I know Klopps under no real pressure this season to achieve a great deal, but still, the depth of the squad is looking a little thin on the ground at the moment. On the positive side Sturridge will be happy to have some company and he can show the hospital newbies the ropes!

Believable0 Unbelievable0

{Ed001's Note - the club will not be panic buying, it would only be a case of moving forward transfers they were planning for the summer.}

06 Jan 2016 11:46:56
So might we now look to pay to bring in Matip or Subutic?


{Ed001's Note - I wouldn't hold my breath mate, Matip is keen on a summer move, which would be more lucrative for him. Subotic might well be possible, but it is not a very Klopp-like signing, no matter how much people on here may be talking it up. It would be a surprise.}

06 Jan 2016 12:48:04
Matip for the summer. I'd be very pleased with that.


{Ed001's Note - I didn't say keen on us, he will look at offers on the table and make a decision. No idea where he will be going though myself.}

06 Jan 2016 13:44:43
Perhaps Daniele Rugani. He is next best thing to Nicklas Sule.


06 Jan 2016 13:55:14
Ok mate. Ed002 has said that Klopp likes and has worked with Subotic before and its very possible we will look to bring him to the club in January?

Are we looking at bringing loril back from Villa to go into the team?


{Ed001's Note - I have no idea, but it just doesn't seem the type of signing Klopp makes. Yes, probably will have to. Initially it was just about getting a look at him.}

06 Jan 2016 08:49:45
I know I will get only dislikes for this post and be slated by everyone but I'll still say it.

I don't dispute that we have a problem with Benteke and that Sturridge or Origi, if fit, should start before him (although I desperatly want to see two of these three play together upfront) .

But when Sturridge and Origi are not fit, I am still not convinced by Firmino as a striker. You can say 'you can't argue with results' but I don;t think the 1:0 yesterday was fundamentaly different than the 1:0 against Leicester, and we also won 1:0 against Sunderland both thanks to Benteke, who also scored the third vital goal against Chelsea.

Whatever you think of Firmino (and I am really dissapointed of his contribution so far in terms of goals and assists) he is a poor finisher as are all of our other midfielders, at the moment even Couts unfortunately. We may be creating less with Benteke but I still think if he was on the pitch yesterday we could have maybe scored one more with all the possesion we had in the final third. I understand Firmino do more pressing, but I think most teams after the first ten minutes are not really worried by our pressure.

In any case, we really need Sturridge fit for next week because without him or Origi (and now without coutinho as well) I just don't see us score more than our traditional 1 goal a game and this will not be enough against Arsenal or ManU.

Believable2 Unbelievable14

06 Jan 2016 09:35:43
I think it's a bit more complicated than that, to me Benteke is a weapon and some games call for a Benteke shaped weapon and some call for something else.

Last night wasn't a game for Benteke, it was an open game which allowed our forwards a lot of space which they utilized to Liverpool's advantage. If Benteke had played we would have played differently and may not have done so well. Firmino didn't carry much of a goal threat but he was very much involved in the style of play we wanted to achieve.

I also wouldn't rule Benteke out of the matches against Arsenal and Utd, he caused Arsenal problems earlier in the season and scored a worldie against Utd. I think a little faith in him would go a long way.


06 Jan 2016 09:51:28
No doubt he can be a weapon but that means either we switch up our style or he makes the adjustment to fit the system. In this moment ( sorry if that annoys anyone but it's one of my fav Klopp sayings) In this moment neither of those seem like they will happen, it was also pointed out on here and on a pod I listen too that we are putting in 20-30 crosses in the box, players are looking for him but balls just seem to bounce off him. His work rate and runs have dropped severely compared to his time at villa. The ray of hope we do have with him is the fact he seems to be a second half of the season specialist scoring a majority of his goals from Jan onwards. Let's hope that's the case and we see the real Benteke from now on, all we really lack for the time being to push for top four is a goal scorer. Pushing for the title different story but top fours there if we can start scoring from all the work done up front.


06 Jan 2016 10:17:41
Fanobip

I know you have a bit of a man crush on benteke but you need to stop defending him.

The players behind a more mobile forward look to have more energy.

Firmino needs time to adapt I'm also disappointed in him so far but he has got it he just needs to settle.

Benteke for me has got to be played with a strike partner or at least whilst he is still with us.

Its sickening to think that years back when we had chance to sign some class players we never had the money, now we have the money we are pissing it up against the tree. 32m benteke, 25m Lallana, 20m lovren. its absolutely crazy.


06 Jan 2016 10:50:28
Lavers, I'm so against your attitude on this. Benteke is our top scorer this season, he's scored the winners in our last two league wins and you just want to write him off as a waste of money. He's not perfect and he's clearly struggling to do what Klopp wants him to do but he's still producing the goods more than any of our other players. We're a team struggling for goals and you want rid of the one player who scores with any sort of consistency.


06 Jan 2016 11:14:47
I haven't been overly impressed with Firmino yet but the lad ran his socks off yesterday and he gave us an out ball time and time again, something which Benteke isn't offering at the moment.

Firmino's movement is very good, his positioning is excellent and it allows us to transition from defence to attack because the ball sticks (because of his movement into the correct spaces) . Benteke seems to stand still and the even obvious long ball isn't sticking. But he scores goals.

I'd maybe persist with playing them both, especially if Coutinho is going to be out.


06 Jan 2016 11:29:15
Benteke played okay vs Leicester, but was poor against Sunderland, and West Ham (but who wasn't) . Like you said he scored 2 winners, but firmino offers so much more. Benteke seems to do okay for one game then relax and think he's got his spot fixed. He started off better than I though to be honest!
Anyway I still stand by what I said before. I don't think firmino is as bad a finisher as he is demonstrating, when he gets a good goal or two, he will kick on. If his strike against the post vs Sunderland went in, he would have more confidence and would be more inclined to finish with a bit of composure.


06 Jan 2016 12:21:07
Muscatred - Benteke isn't producing the goods more than any of our other players. He is our striker, he is supposed to score goals! He have needed 190 minutes per goal in the league and for me, that is not enough for a player standing up top doing nothing in terms of workrate, pressing and movement.

To compare just minutes per goal look at this: Giroud need 131 min, Lukaku 117 min, Vardy 117 minute, Sturridge 144 min, Aguero 111, Defoe 183, Kane 160, Ighalo 120

Many of the above contribute with a lot more than Benteke, so to say that he is producing the goods - well i simply can’t agree.


06 Jan 2016 16:55:45
lavije, like your reply, your a man after my own heart. You're right that 190 isn't great but I'm not arguing he's been great, I'm arguing he's been decent, he's below the list you have (The form strikers), but above the people doing badly (Bony 206, Costa 226, Martial 257, Rooney 454).

None of our players have been brilliant, but Benteke isn't amongst our worst.


06 Jan 2016 14:28:39
Muscatred

Its not always about goals scored its about contributing to the team which for me benteke doesn't do.

Yes he may be our top scorer but with 22 goals in 20 league games that's hardly hard is it.

He scored the 2 winners but he also misses a lot.

Benteke makes no effort in creating space for himself or his team mates simple as.


06 Jan 2016 17:15:38
I'm sorry fanobip, but I disagree with pretty much everything you've written. And I'm not even a disagreeable guy.

On Firmino, yes, his goal production has been disappointing. But he's also been quite unlucky on this count. He's blasted several screamers off posts this season, and also could have potted a few more but for some great saves (Joe Hart at City comes to mind, but also Vito Mannone's save of the season vs Sunderland) . The goals are going to come, because he gets into good space with intelligent movement. He thinks the game on a far different level than Benteke, or even most of our forwards.

On Firmino's assists, you're just dead wrong. Again, yes, the totals are a disappointment, but have you not been watching matches? I honestly have lost track how many sitters he's created for teammates over the last several games. And I mean literally sitters -- like sending Benteke on an open LC goal and he bottles it. If half of the sitters he's created were buried by his teammates, Firmino easily has 8 or 9 or more assists on the season.

So, just pointing to goals/ assists is a superficial way of assessing Firmino's actual contributions.

Similarly, just pointing to Benteke's goals is a superficial way of assessing his performance. He's scored some key goals for us, yes. But it is pretty evident now that we play like a bottom table team with him leading the line. He frustrates our creativity, undermines our attack. His "key" goal against Leicester was basically a product of creative build-up between Can, Firmino, and Coutinho, while Benteke stood around in the box. Firmino sent in a very nice, short, low, crisp cross that Benteke tipped into the goal with a toe. Nice touch, but let's not pretend he's been scoring worldies and carrying the team to victory. He's been getting a great deal of crosses in most games he has started and doing absolutely nothing with them.

And I haven't even mentioned that this is Firmino's first season in the EPL, which involved two different managers and a serious back injury. And yet here he is, basically leading our attack against Stoke City in a Cup game, while Benteke-- a veteran of three EPL seasons-- is not even winning aerial duels, the lone thing he's supposed to be good it.

It's like you have something against Firmino-- you keep saying how disappointed you are in him over and over-- while overlooking pretty much all of Benteke's obvious deficiencies and dreadfully poor performances. I can't remember the last game Benteke was dangerous in a starting role; we'd have to think back to our first match against Arsenal, under a different manager and style.

Chelsea, Stoke, and City -- we are just a far, far, better team and a far more dangerous attack with Firmino leading the line than Benteke. That's the reality.

Benteke will, in the end, either be sold, or remain in the long term as an impact sub, to create problems for teams late in games. Not great for a 32m man, but that's his best role for us, IMHO.

And one last thing: sorry, but Stoke was worried about our pressing from 90 minutes, not the first 10.


{Ed001's Note - now this is what I am talking about, a bit of context to the stats, instead of just blindly and stupidly quoting them.}

06 Jan 2016 18:00:14
Thanks, Ed001!


{Ed001's Note - you are welcome mate, it was nice to read someone actually doing more than just spouting stats, but actually trying to give some background to them so it gives a better idea of how useful (or otherwise) those stats are.}

06 Jan 2016 19:14:27
Oh Ed1, you're such a tease, you love my posts.


{Ed001's Note - I do, because you give a different viewpoint.}

06 Jan 2016 19:36:41
Muscatred - actually i wouldn't mind if he used 300 or 400 minutes per goal, if he was attacking balls in the area, dragging defenders around, winning headers, holding up the ball, creating chances and working hard trying to adapt. But for me he doesn't. His sole contribution is his goals. He have scored a decent amount but nothing that make me forget all the flaws.


06 Jan 2016 08:48:45
Thought Joe Allen was very impressive last night, actually looked like a player. One performance, but if he continued like this I'd like to see him stay.

Fickle turnaround from me. after one game but always give credit when due.

Believable11 Unbelievable2

06 Jan 2016 09:24:26
Its not one, he has played well since the Southampton game.


06 Jan 2016 06:40:10
I'd like to apologise to our Welsh Xavi. I called his final ball to Ibe a 'mishit shot'. Looking at it again, it was a brilliant pass. Cheers Joe.

Believable6 Unbelievable0

{Ed001's Note - I don't understand the argument over the pass, he was looking and looking, clearly intending to play it across all along. I really can't see why anyone thought it was a shot.}

06 Jan 2016 07:08:49
I always need to watch games a second time to make a fairer judgement of it. I think you know now that I'm just too overwhelmed with emotion while I watch it live. My parents always used to pull me up on it.


{Ed001's Note - my grandad used to give me grief about that, he taught me to pull emotion away from judgements and to analyse things as they happen without emotion. You see so much more that way, whereas otherwise you just get carried along by the innate natural bias we all have.}

06 Jan 2016 07:21:37
SSN said he missed his effort after the game, that's all I can think.


06 Jan 2016 08:11:59
Bazzaa is right - the confusion comes from the sky commentator saying in the reply 'he definitely wasn't trying to pass' or something similar, and people too busy celebrating would have heard that and not seen the reply.


06 Jan 2016 11:30:14
Look at the replay, he points at Ibe to pull off to the back post!


06 Jan 2016 06:27:45
bit Hi ed1, I was wondering if you had and insight as to what Jamie Carragher was like as a person when playing for Liverpool and what his general attitude was like. Reason I ask is that I remember reading a few comments months ago about how Gerrard refused to play out on the right and that his presence was more of a hindrance than helpful at times, that sort of thing, and I started to wonder if Carragher was anything like that.

Maybe a bit strange to ask so long on but Carragher was always my favourite player, always the first player I looked for on the team sheet and I always felt he was massively overlooked by England. Would be kind of disappointed if he was a bit of a nob.

Cheers bud.

Believable1 Unbelievable0

{Ed001's Note - I love Carra, but he was a very strong personality that was part of a clique with Gerrard that did cause a few issues over the time they were at the club. Between them they were responsible for a lot of the disharmony that existed behind the scenes, as you were either one of them or suffered, as Fernando Torres found out, which led to his unhappiness.

The thing with Carragher was that he expected the same from everyone else as he gave himself. When a player didn't want to be 'one of the lads' so to speak, they would get a lot of stick for it. That was ok at times, but sometimes it led to problems with players being left on the outside and not feeling like they were part of the team.}

06 Jan 2016 06:45:57
Hold up there, Torres left partly because he felt alienated by Gerrard and Carra? I always had an impression that Torres got along with them just fine- especially Gerrard.


{Ed001's Note - they had a few disagreements at the time. Torres was not keen on going out with 'the lads' on nights out, preferring to stay at home with his family. It was silly on the part of what became known as 'the Scouse Mafia' as they were just being childish expecting everyone to be like them. There were times when those disagreements got out of hand and it led to a period of Torres sulking, initially, which the club never sorted out. The club allowed Gerrard far too much leeway and he thought he was a big man and everyone should do as he said. He was treated like some kind of king, with even transfers being run past him for approval at times. It was ridiculous.}

06 Jan 2016 07:05:16
Thanks ed, that's really interesting. A feel like a kiddy at story time doing this but I have a couple more questions!

Do you think Torres would have ever left if he didn't feel alienated? Or was the allure of trophies always going to be too strong? He might regret his decision to leave, despite the trophies. He never seemed to fit in with all the Chelsea lads.

I know Rodgers went to Gerrard for transfer approval, but did any other managers do it? Which manager was the biggest enabler of the 'scouse mafia'?


{Ed001's Note - Torres would have had his head turned I think anyway, but I don't think he would have been anything like so forceful about wanting out. I am not sure if Chelsea would have even pushed their offer in at the time if they were not aware of his unhappiness. It was probably for the best he left though, he was not the same player after his injuries and that has ruined him.

Rafa was the big enabler, hence why Gerrard loves him so much, he let him get away with a refusal to play on the right, he pretty much allowed him free rein. Worked well when he and Torres got on initially. Everyone after that was stuck with having to pander to Gerrard to get everyone else onside, as it was Gerrard's team by the time Rafa went. It was a shame because Gerrard could have been unquestionably the greatest player the club ever had, if he had just stayed on the right like Rafa wanted. I do think he would have ended up in the middle eventually, but he had so much to offer on the right, he might have even picked up that league winner's medal he so wanted.}

06 Jan 2016 08:00:37
Yeah, age would have nudged Gerrard into the middle of the park, but his own ego nudged him there instead. I wish he stayed on the right and put his dynamism to good use. He was pretty fast, he could beat a man, and he certainly knows how to whip a ball in. Plus, the flank doesn't really require as much tactical discipline as midfield does, and tactical discipline is probably his biggest weakness. But he would have been better than David Beckham in that position, I have no doubt about that.

If you told me before Gerrard's new book that he loves Rafa, then I wouldn't have been surprised. But now I am surprised, because he did take a few little swipes at him in the autobiography.


{Ed001's Note - I am surprised at that, he certainly never had anything bad to say to Rafa's face. Just shows how snide he is.}

06 Jan 2016 08:15:49
He arrived here in Sydney today with the other fellas. My mate went to the airport to greet them, and he implied that Gerrard seemed quite up himself, he said he didn't stop to sign merchandise like others did, which is disappointing. I know he had a long haul flight, but I think he has a duty to do those things, especially when the others are.

He also once met the whole Spanish team in hotel in Armenia. He said Reina and Sergio Ramos were legends to him (not surprised), Torres was quiet (not surprised), while Alonso was actually quite pretentious (surprising) .

I once met Rushie in Melbourne, sat down in the hotel bar lounge with him. Was surreal, nice guy. Ayre was pretty nice too.


{Ed001's Note - Gerrard is used to having his entourage pull him away from autograph hunters, so he can pretend it is not his fault he doesn't sign hundreds.}

06 Jan 2016 08:48:27
Hey Ed1, this is kind of related, but which player has had the most positive impact on the dressing room? It would be interesting to know who the guy is that keeps everyone working and the confidence up. Cheers.


{Ed001's Note - why do you think I love Lucas? He is the one that all the players turn to, the one who helped Suarez, the one who convinced Coutinho to sign etc.}

06 Jan 2016 08:50:43
Nick, I saw a bit on the news surrounding their arrival at the airport. Many of the legends were happy to sign stuff and have photos, with the fans at the airport, though it seemed Gerrard strolled right on past them, barely even acknowledging their existence.


06 Jan 2016 08:51:29
Have to agree with the both u Nick and Ed, I also believe he would have been rated better than Beckham, I like many already think he was, but if he had played on the right for the majority of his career I think there would be any doubt in any ones mind he was better than Beckham, offered a lot more, a better all round game especially defensively compared to becks.


06 Jan 2016 09:00:53
Hi eds, I hoped it would be Lucas, it just seems like the nicest and most professional there. Thanks for the reply :)


{Ed001's Note - welcome mate.}

06 Jan 2016 09:45:55
Ed 001's. you have Gerrard weighed up to a tee.


{Ed001's Note - do you know him well then?}

06 Jan 2016 11:38:59
Whenever I have met Gerrard he has been a right misery, as has sakho to be fair. But love both as players.
Pepe reina was always my favourite player to meet, met him load of times and he has a great personality.


06 Jan 2016 11:50:07
I'd Gerrard stayed on the right Keane would have linked well with Torres I think

Especially as Liverpool had and still have been crying for a winger who can cross a decent ball and score.


{Ed001's Note - Keane would have failed regardless, for the same reasons he did.}

06 Jan 2016 12:30:44
Can you please explain what you mean about Keane ed? I was in Tanzania the 6 month he was at the club and i could rarely watch the games. So i never really understood why he failed. I was under the impression that he did not get a proper chance because Rafa actually did not want him.


{Ed001's Note - he was misbehaving off the field. Rafa did want him and had asked for him specifically.}

06 Jan 2016 18:21:19
Cheers ed1, appreciate the info.


{Ed001's Note - you are welcome.}

06 Jan 2016 19:57:29
Thanks Ed, always thought it was the other way around.


{Ed001's Note - no mate, Rafa made it clear publicly that his ideal transfer window was Barry AND Keane. It wasn't Rafa throwing his toys out of the pram at getting Keane, it was Keane's own fault he never got his chance.}

06 Jan 2016 02:48:53
2 more matches to a cup! 1 draw and 1 win is all we need! So what if it's the Mickey Mouse Cup? I happen to like Disney, especially now that they own Star Wars. Haa

Would you guys prefer Everton or City IF we go through?

May the Force be with us .

Believable5 Unbelievable1

06 Jan 2016 04:32:31
you only call it 'mickey mouse' cup when you get beaten in it. funnily enough, most of the time you get knocked out by these so called 'mickey mouse' teams. its a trophy to win.

beating everton for the trophy sounds really sweet to me.


06 Jan 2016 06:25:14
I agree with you kaiser, clubs history is shown by what they win, in 20 years time would you sooner have won a few league and uefa cups or qualify for champions league every year and have nothing to show for it, I would take a trophy any day.


06 Jan 2016 08:23:26
Fact is that it's the sub standard cup, and not the priority at the start of the season. Equally, its legitimate silverware that no-one throws away anymore, especially when they reach the quarter finals. One more game until Anfield South!


05 Jan 2016 23:13:15
Going if what sounness said regarding our training.

Is it that the training is too intense for the Bol hence the injuries?

Or that not having an intense enough pre season and not intense enough training sessions until Klopp arrived means the players bodies just can't cope with it?

Believable1 Unbelievable0

{Ed001's Note - the players are not fit enough that is the issue. Trying to get them fit enough and play games at the same time is causing this.}

06 Jan 2016 05:34:44
Players are more or less same, so it cannot be all players we bought are not fit. I will point the blame at Klopp's fitness regime. Could be too intense for league like bpl. But i think klopp too eager to get players fitness up to play his heavy metal pressing football. Its a trade off.


{Ed001's Note - sorry but you can point at what ever you like, but the truth is our players were not fit. No idea what this crap is about 'Players are more or less same', makes no sense. The players are unfit and being asked to push themselves to play the way we want to play. The issue is not the hamstrings, it is all the long term knee issues that are the main worry. Hammies are always a problem over Christmas, teams usually pick up those over this period, it is just ours is more obvious because we have a new management team that is not English. With the British media keen to slag off anything that is not English, any molehill is turned into a molehill so they can claim Brits know better.}

06 Jan 2016 07:40:17
The British media xenophobic Ed001, never! I was surprised that not more was made of Allardyce's comment though.


{Ed001's Note - if it had been Klopp saying it about Allardyce we would never have heard the end of it. Apparently it is ok for a Brit to make a comment like that though, after all Top Gear managed to make about 400 episodes based on racial slurs and no one seemed to care. Mind sometimes too much can be made of things, but having grown up seeing the damage first hand that can be done by stereotyping, it is clear that it is a problem.}

06 Jan 2016 07:51:20
What i meant is these professional players bodies to take physical punishment more or less the same whether liverpool's or players of other clubs . If other clubs' players can take the rigour of the fixtures without as many injuries, y can't liverpool's? So difference has to be the training regime, it cannot be the players fault. Its just pure simple deduction.


{Ed001's Note - how do you figure that out? If the players lack fitness, which they do because the previous regime did not do much fitness work, then they will struggle. Do you actually know anything about sports fitness? The Brownlie brothers train 6 hours a day, every day, and can do an Ironman triathlon, but not one of our players could complete one, because they are simply not at that kind or level of fitness. Everyone is an individual, how many of our team could run the distances Henderson covers when he is playing? Every player is an individual with a different base level of fitness.}

06 Jan 2016 12:25:15
Shanks, Paisley, Fagan and Dalglish (1st time) were all big on physical fitness and stamina - especially getting the miles in running. We won games a llot of the time because the opposition literally ran out of steam by the 70th minute trying to keep up and we overwhelmed them.


06 Jan 2016 01:30:45
From now on, for all important league games, we should bench Benteke and start Firmino as a false 9, with Coutinho and Lallana in a tight attacking trio.

Why? Well, we've romped over teams in 3 out of the 4 games that Klopp started Firmino as a false 9, with Coutinho and Lallana up front.

This attack routed City as well as Chelsea.

Today they *were* running roughshod over Stoke until Coutinho's injury, which led to a slightly different attack with Ibe coming on (they still did well, with Firmino leading the line, but also regularly dropping deep to build) .

Yes, critics will say. But what about Watford? True, the only game we lost and played badly with this trio was against Watford.

But that game was an anomaly. How so?

We started with the proper 4-3-3 attack (as we did today) but we conceded two early goals, due to stupid mistakes (recall Bogdan's delight! ), and then Skrtel was injured. This led to a change in tactics and formation that disrupted the tight attacking trio of Firmino/ Coutinho/ Lallana we saw in City and Chelsea.

Instead, we shifted from a 4-3-3 to a 4-3-2-1. Origi (who was brought on for Skrtel) led the line, Lucas moved to CB to replace Lucas, and Lallana was moved back to central midfield, replacing Can who was also now playing deeper as our CDM.

Coutinho and Firmino thus were playing behind Origi, in the new 4-3-2-1, reminiscent of the attack we use with Benteke playing as our CF.

And it proved to be as toothless of an attack as it is when Benteke starts in the formation. I like Origi, but I find he's actually better in a 4-4-2; doesn't seem to lead the line as effectively as Firmino.

So, while we started with Firmino as a false 9, with Coutinho and Lallana in attack, that quickly changed.

In other words, Watford was an exception, and Chelsea, City, and now Stoke, show that we're far more effective in attack with Firmino leading the line, and Benteke on the bench.

My reco to Klopp: Start Firmino as a false 9, with Coutinho/ Lallana close behind in our most important games. They'll have an off game here and there, but it's easily our best attack. Do it, Jurgen!

Believable6 Unbelievable1

06 Jan 2016 05:36:31
Coutinho is injured. So i think best replacement is texeira in this formation.


06 Jan 2016 10:21:53
Fear, unfortunately Watford wasn't an exception, we were already 2-0 down before Origi came o. I'm also nervous about using the Chelsea game as evidence, I can't help but feel that we played them at the perfect time and we may well have won whichever formation we played.

I agree we were brilliant against City and we bossed the game last night but i think there's a decent explanation for that. City played to beat us, they were open, tried their passing game and Klopp's style countered it perfectly. Similarly Stoke came with a confidence that they could outplay us at home and they wanted to win, that gave our forwards much more space than they've been used to. They had time to express themselves and looked great.

The league is normally different and most teams we play are more conservative, smothering us in their half, stretching our formation and exploiting this space with crosses. It's these type of games we really struggle with and I don't think Firmino as a false nine is the answer, he will just get crowded out. Don't get me wrong, I don't think just sticking Benteke up front and hoping for the best is the answer either but we do need to develop a way to beat teams that just sit back and gift us possession in front of a compact defense. What I do think Benteke offers us is our best chance of scoring in a crowded box.


 
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