24 Feb 2015 16:36:16
The majority of the fans seem to want Rodgers to stay! So do I, but only under a DoF!!!! So my first question is this, would you still want him to stay if we don't finish in the top 4? And second, if you were the owners would you risk Rodgers making the same mistakes for the 3rd time? So just to be clear, I don't want him sacked, I want him to stay on as HEAD COACH not as manager
24 Feb 2015 17:09:54
Rodgers will be gone in the summer. Can't see him working with a MONCHI on his back!
24 Feb 2015 17:45:41
I'd like him to stay as head coach under a DoF with coaching staff added where we lack and a focus on youth to fill the squad, only buying players to slot straight into the first team (or to go into the academy).
But Rodgers should only stay if he's willing to make the concessions a director of football would need to operate. I'd be wary of who the DoF is, if we cannot get our targets (Cruff?) then do we just add people to the list until we get one. Comolli despite bringing in Henderson, Suarez etc. was a disaster.
24 Feb 2015 18:10:47
If you hire a young, unproven manager you have to expect him to make mistakes. So yes I think he will be given another season regardless.
A DoF and hopefully a stronger no2 will be brought in but regardless of whether they are I hope and think he will at least get another year.
A lot of the criticism aimed at BR is over-the-top, eg the transfers. Firstly we have a committee and no one really knows whose choice was who etc, secondly they actually haven't been that bad.
Also his crazy David Brent impressions have to be somewhat forgiven, because he never played football at high level so isn't used to media, limelight etc.
No one really knows how things will turn out, Bony could of been just as bad as Balo for example. And we could end up with a coach who makes more mistakes than BR, and if we do all these fans with a hate on for BR will vent that anger towards the owners. The gamble to get rid of BR and bring another manager is too great a risk (de boer is probably the highest calibre we could expect), running the club as a business it would be smarter to keep him on for one more year and assume that he's learnt from his errors.
24 Feb 2015 18:40:06
Where do we go for another manager exactly ? Yes Rodgers has made mistakes but who hasn't. Compare us to Dortmund. We both lost our best player before the season started us Suarez them lewondowski and look where both teams are in there respective leagues. Klopp was the guy everybody wanted and I would argue that Rodgers has done a good job in turning things around in recent weeks.
24 Feb 2015 19:47:44
Actually dortmund have lost 4 of their best players over the past few years, not one, and had injury problems that make man uniteds look a walk in the park this season. So imagine what position we would be in if we lost sturridge, sterling, henderson, sakho and lucas to injury, andsuarez had left.
24 Feb 2015 20:17:43
I doubt be in the bottom 3 woolyback
24 Feb 2015 20:44:14
Rodgers will be here next season barring a total disaster in the remaining 3 months
25 Feb 2015 00:01:27
Dortmund are not in the bottom 3.
25 Feb 2015 00:58:13
Extra Bacon, I read your post and I agree with the him working with a DOF and all BUT to me, the rest of your post was to me excuses, suppositions and baseless exoneration of BR for what has gone wrong this year in the first half of the season, . All you did IMO, was absorb him of any blame, responsibility and accountability for all our troubles and all his blunders, I`m sorry to say. Then you make abstract suppositions about maybe Bony would have been no good, it is normal that BR is embarassing in the media because he hasn`t been coaching that long or maybe a new manager would be worse. WTF? NOBODY knows if a new manager will help or hurt because like a new signing, it is always a gamble which is why your research should be on point. Many used that lame excuse to defend Rafa YET we found BR who almost won us the PL in his second year. Morale of the story? NOBODY KNOWS. Secondly, BR`s been coaching professionally for about 6 yrs now and has been here for 3 of them so how long does he need to get his mouth in check? Is he a teenager? Yes, I do expect a young manager to make mistakes. What I don`t expect and will never tolerate from any employee of mine is for him/her to make recurrent mistakes, not learn from them and think he is above reproach, reprimand and accountability for them. That is where we differ. I need a manager to be accountable, responsible and be a leader. Simeone lost a game kaweek w/ AM and the first thing he said was "I got my tactics wrong in the first half". THAT is leadership and is that too hard to ask BR to do instead of the crap he talks and the blaming of everyone but himself? Every manager is prone to mistakes but the good onse learn from them and BR does not learn REGARDLESS of how many excuses people want to make for them. He`s been here for 3 yrs yet the mistakes and TW bunglings remain to the point that the club is amassing debt in the name of PL glory BUT obviously none of that matters provided we play well for half a season. Also, not once did you mention any of his mistakes. If you are to b right, we might as well act as if the first half of the season never happened. If we want to have an honest debate on whether BR should stay or not, then all aspects have to be onsidered and becos I and many of us, are willing to do that does not make us haters or anti-Brendan or all that other nonsense many post on here. The fact that his blunders and ego and arrogance got us to play catch up for not even the title BUT for 4th spot after coming 2nd last year cannot be wished away at the snap of the fingers just because we are unbeaten in 10 games and all in the name of "positivity". If we almost won the PL, you can no longer sette for 3rd/4th. If you make 3rd or 4th while aiming for 1st then I`ll take it. Now, we are 6th and that is failure and that lies at the desk of the manager because the buck stops w/ him. FYI, I am always positive because when there is life, there is hope and as a former athlete, you have to believe that as long as there is a chance, you can always win. The fact that many of us here are ready to proposed balanced arguments should also be respected so we can have that healthy and sncere debate. I am not slating you for your opinion. I just wish that you and many others stop with ignoring his errors and mistakes while making a case why he should be kept because trust me the owners will NOT. Let us consider both sides of the coin so we can make progress on this issue.IMO, I want him to stay IF he changes his ways and accept the help he needs, learn quickly from mistakes and just focus on coaching then IMO, he should be kept. What if he doesn`t though? What if the owners refuse to bow to his ego and refusal to work and adhere to the framework they are trying to put in place (DOF, transfers etc)? Should he be kept just because you or I said so? The last time I checked, FSG writes the checks at LFC and if you ain`t writing checks then you are up for the chop. All in all, the owners will consider ALL aspects of his tenure here and if he goes, he goes and if he stays, he stays. For those sayng he will be here regardless or barring a disaster, I suggest you don`t talk too soon because you are not the owners and it wasn`t your money that got wasted. I for one, am ready for any outcome because a manager is an employee and not a fam member I am stuck w/ for life.
25 Feb 2015 05:51:34
I agree with Essexred884 and just add that it will be with no DoF.
25 Feb 2015 09:44:19
Does anyone actually know what a DoF does?
I'm just asking because before Ed01 mentioned it, no-one ever mentioned a DoF. Now, every man and his dog wants a DoF.
I don't know enough about a DoF to make that call. Actually, I know very little about the role of a DoF, but if it improves us a club, then fantastic.
{Ed002's Note - Typically they provide input to the transfer process, they take responsibility for overseeing all footballing aspects (first team, youth, ladies etc.) and they sit between the board and manager or coach.}
25 Feb 2015 10:44:47
Jimmy, surely you're not suggesting that there's a large number of sheep on this site!
25 Feb 2015 10:52:50
Thanks Ed002.
Can I ask what clubs are successfully working with a DoF in the Premier League? I've read a little piece on Southampton and a few internet searches show a couple of disasters, notably Newcastle & Tottenham, so what other clubs have a DoF that seem to be working? Sounds like an obvious statement, but getting the right DoF is paramount, more so than the head coach I'd imagine.
{Ed002's Note - Chelsea and Manchester City sit first and second and both have a Director of Football.}
25 Feb 2015 12:55:19
Thanks Ed002. I guess outside of those two clubs? I'm not sure whether their success is down to the DoF structure or the fact that have spent far more money than anyone else. Maybe a combination of both, but I don't know.
I'm keen to see what other clubs have successfully used a DoF in the Premier League, and indeed what is the criteria that determines whether the DoF setup is a success? If success is based on winning the Premier League, then any clubs outside of the two you mentioned have yet to have success with a DoF. If success is based on transfers, then is that success from a financial perspective, or from those players bought being successful on the field? If it's the latter, then I revert back to point 1 on whether winning the Premier League is the baramoter of success?
Sorry for the questions, but I'm keen to understand more about the very thing people are asking for, and to see whether it's going to work for us and to find out what other people value as a successful setup of the DoF.
{Ed001's Note - Alex Ferguson acted as a DoF in all but name at Man Utd for most of his time there. That is why the style of play changed so much, the number 2 was responsible for that and did all the coaching.}
25 Feb 2015 20:38:41
Redohio, I'm not ignoring BRs mistakes but i think people like yourself are exaggerating them for your own argument.
ive read your posts this season and although your venom towards BR has softened lately, you were ready to hang him from the terraces a month ago, and the mere suggestion of him staying was unthinkable to you.
I've never denied, BR has a lot of faults, his ego and interviewing probably the worst of them. His transfer dealings haven't been as bad as you and others make out.
But he also has a lot of good qualities, we hired a young forward thinking coach who exceeded all expectations last year. And with losing Suarez and sturridge for 5months, this year was never going to be easy. Plus nobody was going to be surprised by us. A lot of teams have better than expected years than fade away a year later (Spurs, Everton Newcastle in the last 3 years). The fact that BR managed to pull it back is of great credit to him and whether it was his fault or not is almost irrelevant. He fixed a problem and if gets 4th that's an achievement and based on that I would give him at least one more year.
if he reverts back to type than I'll be with you but I'm also an optimist and think he will learn from his mistakes and keep playing the football that we've seen the past few months. If you hire a young manager you have to let him grow into the role, and despite what anyone says I remember the awful cringe worthy 'being liverpool' and BR is not as bad as he was in that. Which shows PR improvement. Why can't he improve in other areas?
Not even Ed002 knows what's going to happen in the upper echelons of liverpool football club in the summer. But I'm hoping BR stays regardless of what changes are made.
25 Feb 2015 20:59:41
Thanks Ed01.
I'm not entirely sure Alex Ferguson is the best example to use, after all, I have never seen an abundance of DoF's tapping their watches on the sidelines, or chasing referees down the tunnel, or doing post match interviews. He was the Manager first and foremost. Yes, he did delegate the training activities to his coaches over time, that much I know. I guess you are privy to more information than me and I can see the correlation of him acting similar to the DoF role, based on the explanation of the DoF but he was the Manager, not DoF.
Anyway, I like the idea of a DoF, but it has to work, not just be a great sounding philosophy on paper.
26 Feb 2015 00:12:13
Extra, I agree that I wanted him gone because at the time, I could not believe what I was watching. How could I? I thought someone kidnapped BR and put an impostor/clone in his place because I did not recognize him nor our team anymore. I defended him to the hilt last season because he was doing the business and provided we were winning, I didn`t care. Some even had the gaul to give Bielsa credit for our showing last year and I faced them head on and defended BR against such pathetic notions. Then the Ed`s revealed that he reverted to his failed system in a bid to prove us wrong and for nothing else. WTF? I have defended this guy all this while and this is what he does? I couldn`t take it anymore. I don`t know if he will revert to it again BUT what we do know is that that system should NEVER be played here again because it has failed, miserably. Now granted we have gotten better BUT there was NEVER a prob to be fixed. This is a fact. He should have just played the system that almost won us the league because at least we know what works because we have seen it work. How hard could that have been? Only BR can tell you that and I beg you not to make excuses or suppositions because that does not help honest debate. If we are giving him all the credit for the good, we should be sincere and honest enuff to demand accountability for his costly mistakes as well and not be quick to absorb him of blame or airbrush his mistakes in the name of "positivity". Is that too much to ask for? He needs to improve in the media aspect. Obviously he has not because he is still being snarled at by the owners about his mouth running wild. How is that improvement? Listen, I love the way we play and would gladly keep him provided he works within the framework and if he cannot do that due to his ego or whatever then, he should go and I will have no prob with it. That is where we differ, Bacon. BR cannot be dictating to the owners or fans what should happen. They are his bosses and if he doesn`t learn quickly, he will be goneregardless of what you and I think. `Hope this clarifies my views on the issues.