18 Aug 2015 19:26:16
I have a question for the the few people who aren't keen on Lucas.
Let's assume for a minute that Lucas isn't all that good and doesn't do anything special. This is wrong, imo, but let's assume. Jordan Henderson played at DM against Bournemouth instead of Lucas yesterday. What did he do from open play that Lucas isn't capable of doing?
Cos apart from set pieces (he doesn't need to play DM to take corners) I saw nothing from Henderson that Lucas can't do. He basically did no defending, because after the 10th minute he didn't really need to. Most of his passes were backwards or sideways. He didn't drive forward with the ball. So all in all, he was restricted to staying deep and passing it around the back.
So what was the point in having Henderson at DM? He didn't do a bad job at all, but by my reckoning, Lucas would've done at least as well if not better. Meantime, Milner and Lallana were further forward and didn't effect the game in anything like the way Henderson would have had he been in their position. I actually think that part of the reason Hendo played most of his passes backwards or sideways is because no one else was showing for the ball in the way that he would have had been playing in Milner or Lallana's position.
When Can came on he made one 40 yard run with the ball, but otherwise it was the same thing. He just did Lucas' job slightly worse than Lucas would have done it himself. Everything about Can's play screams that he's an attack minded player to me, and I don't think he'll ever be completely comfortable at DM, so why not let him develop in his more natural role?
Now if we take into account that Lucas anticipates danger better than both Can & Hendo, then leaving him out and effectively wasting Hendo or Can in a DM role instead is the height of madness, even if you don't really rate Lucas. I'm hoping that Arsenal don't give us a painful demonstration of that fact.
18 Aug 2015 19:53:52
1.It's a straight case of Manager falling out with a player mate and they ain't a new thing. But every time a manger fall out with a player he has a reason , Unfortunately we have no reason known so far.
2. BR has promised players game time and positions to certain players. To achieve this stats, he ll have drop / out of positions players.
I am not a fan of any player and all matter is position and we need a genuine player to stop the opposition coming to us. And ATM its Lucas.
18 Aug 2015 20:21:42
I posted a reply on the banter page Something.
18 Aug 2015 20:50:46
My thoughts exactly something red, its really not rocket science. Lucas is probably the most comfortable passer under pressure we have at the club and most accurate. The only criticism you can aim at him is his injuries but assuming he will be fit for 50% of the season Can can learn the role in the other games. Its all a pipe dream however, were getting rid of one of the best footballers at the club and its no surprise teams like Juve and PSG are interested in him.
18 Aug 2015 21:03:56
I think it is well documented that BR is a numbskull where Lucas is concerned. Him along with Sakho saved us big time last season and their rewards were to be immediately replaced by Allan and Lovren when they got fit. the likes of Henderson, Allan, Lovren can have numerous bad, ineffective, below average )or what ever you want to call it) games but will still feature for a run of games. God forbid Lucas, Markovic or Sakho has one of those, we won't even see them for at least 4 weeks apart from training pictures.
18 Aug 2015 22:04:58
I'm not a huge fan of Lucas but I agree he's the best DM we've got.
What did Henderson and Can do that Lucas doesn't? Nothing
They also didn't give away very dangerous free kicks around the box
18 Aug 2015 22:10:29
We stockpiled on midfielders and bought milner who is actually a winger and promised him gametime in midfield. When he does the exact same job as hendo in the middle. but you can't mention milner was unnecassary because peopke will say milner brings experience. Sometimes i just can't get my head around it.
18 Aug 2015 22:11:52
To argue the other side Something I disagree with some of your conclusions. Lucas is certainly better than breaking up play but he doesn't have Hendo's range of passing, vision, or ability on the ball. Just because Hendo hasn't been great in that position yet doesn't mean that he hasn't got the potential to positively effect the game more than Lucas.
As for the falling out thing EG I'm not convinced it's even that. Rodgers wants Lucas to be a squad player, they'll be times this season when he will want to use him, but Lucas, completely understandably, wants more than that. Rodgers will have told him that if a sensible offer comes in he can have his wish.
18 Aug 2015 22:18:22
SR,
During Liverpool's brilliant run after Xmas in 2013/14, Lucas did not start (m)any League games at all.
Rodgers went with the deep lying playmaker.
That still seems to be the ambition, and that was the role that Henderson was tasked with. Not defensive midfielder.
If Liverpool could have afforded Kovacic, there wouldn't be any of this.
By the way, Sakho only played in 18 League games during that season too.
18 Aug 2015 22:37:23
Hyach, spot on! I have posted the ver same parts of your post a few tomes already. The man is just vindictive and cruel for no reason. He doesn't fancy Lucas as a player but can't make a case for him not playing because his replacements are nog in his class as a DM so, he makes all this stuff up and engages in fake bust ups to make him and Sahko look bad. That is just cowardly and wrong.
18 Aug 2015 23:10:13
So let me get this right.
You say regarding Hendo:
He basically did no defending, because after the 10th minute he didn't really need to.
Yet, you still think we should've played Lucas??
What!?!?!??!? . Shaking head.
19 Aug 2015 00:27:51
If we're going to consistently change for titles, we need to do better than Lucas. Same goes for Skrtle and Lallana
19 Aug 2015 00:28:29
redohio did u learn engleesh bi washing allo allo. i shell post dis onlee oonce
19 Aug 2015 07:59:50
Im not a massive Lucas fan anymore,
Agree with everyone on Lallana - Weirdly I think going forward he slows everything down and haven't seen him make that killer pass just yet although not sure if any seen against Bournemouth when he did swap into one of the 3 in midfield with milner and Can i thought he was 10 times better getting back and defending making really good tackles and playing the ball out really calmly - i'm not saying this is his position but if you didn't notice just have a look back through the highlights he really done a good job once hendo came off
19 Aug 2015 09:23:05
If we are going to consistently challenge for the tittle, first thing we need to do is do better than Rodgers.
19 Aug 2015 11:06:32
Rodgers just has his mind set on the way he wants the team set up. He doesn't want a defensive midfielder, but a deep lying playmaker who can play the ball long. Lucas isn't that type of player. He is an intelligent player who breaks up play brilliantly and initiates attacks with fast, precise, low balls.
Same with our centerbacks. He wants a deep defense and doesn't seem to care much for employing the offside trap, otherwise Skrtel would never play. We have a complete team for a high press, bar the offensive sweeper keeper, but that is not his style.
I believe he'll destroy every single player at the club to make his dream system a reality. Hendo has the potential to be the best box to box player ever (I'm perhaps a bit biased). He definitely has all the required attributes. This should be probably be left for the conspiracy page, but I doubt Hendo was taken off because he was injured. He seemed livid to be taken off and anyone who can lip read saw the "Yeah right" reply to Rodgers. Brendan never liked him and if true we'll continue to see him exposed in a position alien to him until he's pushed out. Along with Sakho, Lucas, Ilori and everyone else who's better suited to the high press.