07 Apr 2017 13:33:10
The more I see of the difference between Klavan and Sakho the more I can't help but think Klopp has made a mistake.
For Bournemouth's second goal Klavan still doesn't know where the ball is whilst Josh King is already shooting. Meanwhile, down at Palace Sakho is clearing anything and everything that comes near him.
I do understand that Palace play more defensive than we do, but making blocks and aerial challenges is effective however you play.
Lovren - Matip - Sakho - Gomez in rotation for CB is a superb set up to have moving forward.
Ed/ s, do you see any chance swaying Klopp towards leaving this loan period as Sakho's punishment or do we still expect him to be sold?
{Ed002's Note - The club are actively trying to sell Sakho because Klopp doesn't want him. Klaven is the player Klopp wanted and got - and I am not aware of any efforts by Liverpool to move him on.}
07 Apr 2017 15:00:49
Klavan is the player klopp wanted and got. to replace kolo as 4th choice at the time leaving matip lovren sahko Lucas Gomez. Then sakho burnt his bridges and was shipped away leaving matip lovren klavan Lucas and Gomez in that order (gomez might have been 3rd or 4th choice if he hadn't been injured) . Klopp got his man he got his bargain centre back to fill in when there's injuries £7m and about 45k a week. There's no problem with klavan in my books he's what you'd expect from a player in his position of the pecking order. See the likes of jones/ rojo, mertersaker/ gabriel, wimmer/ dier, terry/ zouma/ ake, all of cities are at a similar standard. Don't get me started on Everton's back up pairings.
{Ed002's Note - Klopp made it clear he wanted 4 centre backs - that is what he has. Sakho was never included.}
07 Apr 2017 15:18:31
Yeah I don't care what anyone says, he has replaced one of the best CB's in the league with one that is bang average and expects our defence to improve? Matip is a constant injury concern meaning we are going to continue to be left with Klavan for the foreseeable future. I genuinely believe with Sakho in the side we would have at the very least 6 more points.
{Ed002's Note - That was the choice of the manager - he gave you Karius as well. Caulker the previous year.}
07 Apr 2017 15:37:39
Well i really hope Klopp revisits the CB situation. Matip is the only decent option we have while Gomez is still young. Lovren would be a decent 3rd choice but Klavan has to go. Simply an awful defender already past his best and nowhere near good enough for LFC or the BPL.
07 Apr 2017 15:56:05
Klavan was brought to replace Sakho while Matip replaced Skrtel and Gomez replaced Toure. Stop brining excuses. We have 4 CB and we have conceded she'd loads of goals!
07 Apr 2017 16:09:32
I actually don't think Klavan or Lovren are as terrible as people on here make out.
I think the biggest problem is that neither of them are blessed with pace yet we play a very high line without an out-and-out midfield destroyer, with two bang average wing backs constantly leaving them exposed. Yet we still regularly restrict teams to less than 3 or 4 decent shots on target, which usually results in us conceding because Mignolet is the only keeper in the Premier league to have both rubber wrists and rubber ankles!
When Sakho was here we all said he was error prone. In Aggers final years we all said he was error prone. Skrtel also deemed a liability just a year after being voted player of the season under Dlaglish/ Clarke. Carragher even was dropped in his second to last year after struggling.
How many centre backs do we have to go through before we actually look at the rest of the defensive unit and point the finger at the whole picture. Not to mention the defensive and goalkeeper coaching.
Mignolet, Clyne and Milner are all not really up to the task. Just look at our keepers and full backs in recent years; Jones, Reina, Doni, Itandje, Cavalieri, Manninger, Karius, Mignolet; Moreno, Insua, Aurelio, Konchesky, Dossena, Cissokho; Johnson, Arbeloa, Clyne, Degen, Kelly, Flanagan.
Now honestly tell me that our recent centre backs are as bad as those listed above; Skrtel, Agger, Lovren, Sakho, Kyriakgos, Carragher, Klavan. Personally, I do not think we have ever properly replaced Reina (pre 2010 form), Finnan or Riise. Until we do no centre back is going to look good for us. Period.
Defence gets fixed as a unit, or not at all.
07 Apr 2017 16:11:53
And mane ed. let's not forget that. Wijnaldum for that matter and matip 😊.
{Ed002's Note - Matip really isn't all that. Has Wijnaldum justified his price?}
07 Apr 2017 16:39:26
Matip has been a breath of fresh air in most games. And Gini has gotten better as the season progressed. One mistake last game that costed us but other than that he's been pretty darn good. And I think he will only get better. Mane speaks for himself. I'm just saying a free transfer for a center back like matip was a steal. He's not the BEST out there but he's pretty darn good. And seeing what others, like stones and Luiz, went for makes matip look the bargain of the century.
07 Apr 2017 16:40:23
I agree the caulker signing was baffling but it wasn't that big of a deal. The Karius signing wasn't that bad, but the way he has been managed has been pretty woeful.
07 Apr 2017 16:42:29
MK just look at King's goal again, it was the most predictable turn and finish yet if Klavan had been given another 2 seconds to get his foot in the way he'd have still been nowhere near it despite being stood right next to him. Honestly one of the most pathetic attempts at blocking the goal i've ever seen that in the end was responsible for us dropping two points.
07 Apr 2017 18:13:09
Klavan may not be perfect but would have him as backup compared to Skrtel any day of the week. It is clear we need better adept CB's but who else was Klopp going to sign at £4.2m which is what Klavan cost. It is not like he was going to be a stater for us but using my eyes he is an upgrade on Skrtel.
Our biggest problem is that Lovren is injury prone and seems like Matip has his own problems. At this point I cannot rule out Klopp signing another CB in the summer. Gomez recently returned from a serious injury and hopefully fior his part he can stay fi going forwrad.
Like MK Scouser points out, our fullbacks are average. Milner never going to be a long term solution but has been ok at LB, better than Moreno. The less I say about Clyne the better. He is mediocre.
Attacking fullbacks are an important ingredient in Klopp's setup as they provide the width so hopefully the summer Klopp signs two quick and creative attacking fullbacks to take one step closer to completing the puzzle.
07 Apr 2017 18:31:16
Why do we need a back-up in Klavan who will never push Lovren? We need a player to push and displace Lovren.
07 Apr 2017 18:38:55
I don't care how good a player looks on match of the day, if he is a disruptive influence and undermines the manager then there is no place for them in the team.
It's as simple as that.
We may sign some defenders in the summer, things move quickly and circumstances change. Stop panicking because you already think Klopp won't sign the players you want.
Chill out, what will be will be.
07 Apr 2017 18:58:56
You guys are like rabbits, on and on and on and on, you must sit and talk to yourselves in your mirrors, no one is listening forget sakho he's not wanted and no matter how much you complain or watch match of the day he ain't coming back.
Gini and Matip yes have made mistakes had bad games but have also had great games its their first season at the club and they in my opinion show signs i like and i think they can be at the club for long term.
Karius is as the ed has said the number 1 keeper at the club but i think it will be next season but you guys all complain he is not good enough do you all forget what de gea went through when he arrived he's young needs time to acclimatise to get use to english football and i hope we end with a keeper like de gea.
But you guys are so fickle you jump on the backs of every and any player making a mistake and if a guy looks good on match of the day you think he's the second coming.
a good example is brandy a lot of people here thought he wasnt good enough to slight etc but once it was said that he had a deal with bayern set up you all went on about how we missed another player.
for the umpteenth time get behind your players and managers stop moaning.
oh and after watching the stoke press conference even although he said couthinho is feeling better i get the feeling he might not be playing so you will all get your wish to see some kids, which i don't know but looks a distinct possibility.
07 Apr 2017 19:16:12
Imagine an alternative reality. Sakho, despite having been given 2 or 3 chances to clean up his act by Klopp continues to be undisciplined off the pitch (and I suspect we don't really know the half of it) .
However as he needs the defender defender the season Klopp forgives him again and again (as many on here seem to think he should have) .
Sakho continues to mess around (he had established a pattern of behaviour after all) . Other players (especially younger players) after a while see this and start to think, maybe I don't have to live such a disciplined boring life off the pitch. Maybe Klopp's rules aren't really rules you really need to follow. Why should I try so hard if others don't.
What happens is the performance throughout the squad drops and Liverpool would be mid table now wondering what went wrong with the Klopp appointment.
Can we stop the Sahko back nonsense please. He messed around a new manager who had to show all the players the rules mean something for the good of all the squad.
07 Apr 2017 19:22:57
Sures he's not 😊
Wijanldum. If pogbas worth 90 million then wijis worth 25 minimum 🖒.
07 Apr 2017 19:30:51
The real AG, Sakho was bound to partner Matip this season until Sakho made an absolute clown of himself and the club. That left us with Lovren partnering Matip this season ad Klavan coming in for Skrtel. Gomes was still injured so Klopp had to go sign somebody who was willing to take the back seat i. e. Klavan.
It is not like Klopp could go sign the next best thing as we finished 8th last season and doubt any top CB's were interested in joining us unless we were willing to pay over the odds. Yes Klavan has not been to everyones taste but he has had some good performances this season ans £4.2m compared to paying £60m for another Southampton player seemed to be a reasonable move considering that we cannot ask someone like Godin to join our ranks.
Klavan > Skrtel so disater in that case averted.
07 Apr 2017 19:40:51
Spot on, Fitzy. Shows the moral compass (or lack thereof) that some people have in their quest to ignore a player's repeated atrocities and blatant disrespect for authority of the manager, just so we can get a couple of clean sheets to the detriment of team harmony and team spirit.
The worst thing is that, it's not like Sahko (who I am a fan of by the way) is the second coming of Paulo Maldini. He has played here for 3 seasons where we conceded 150 goals in the PL. So in what way was he a needed defender to shore up the back line when he was part of the problem? His fan base can't answer that question cos all they see is what he's doing (under different system and diff manager) at the GREAT Crystal Palace.
Memo to Sahko's glee club: Klopp wants rid of Sahko cos he's cancer to the squad and in the DR, not due to his ability. He listens to no one and has NO respect for authority and this since his days at PSG. If you like him so much, form your own club and make him your first signing. Till then, stop defending the indefensible cos you are embarrassing yourselves each time you do.
07 Apr 2017 19:57:04
HX, everyone on here was singing from the tops of the hills about Ben Gibson just yesterday who was at fault for 2 goals against Hull in midweek.
Not saying that Klavan is better, Gibson is clearly the better player over all. My point there is that one mistake or one bad game doesn't define a player. Klavan was part of the team that shut out Manchester City earlier in the season and was arguably the best player on the day. He is an experienced back up, and I have no problems with him in our squad.
If anyone on here has ever played football, just imagine being in defence with Clyne trying to stop crosses from the right, Milner trying to stop crosses from the left, Mignolet organising everything, and all in a system where pretty much every player is charging forward at full pelt to press the ball. If that press gets beaten it is basically just our centre backs vs the opposition attack! You could put Ramos and Boateng in our defence and even they would get exposed at times in our team.
Klopp has picked his 4 centre backs. We need to accept that to be honest because it is unlikely we will sign anyone this summer for that position. Klopp hasn't however signed a single full back for us yet, or given his choice of keeper a sustained run in the team (mainly to protect Karius from the abhorrent abuse he was getting from absolutely everyone) . He is trying to build a solid defensive unit and we are pointing the finger at the one area he has addressed. So really that finger (if you genuinely believe centre back is our main issue) should be pointing at the guy who picked them; Klopp.
I get it, Klavan made a mistake and it is currently very raw to some people as we dropped points. I just don't get this massive over reaction. He struggles with pace in general, but as a back up he is easily adequate. The focus with regards to centre back should be getting Lovren/ Matip fit, and developing the likes of Gomez and Masterson for the future.
I swear to god people, after the Derby their was literally a post on here about us being back in the title race. A very serious post which got more agrees than disagrees might I add. Fast forward 4 days and our whole team is completely terrible and we won't even get a CL spot because Stoke and West Brom are coming up?! Holy Christ, fickle is an understatement. This is bi-polar.
07 Apr 2017 20:36:01
Fans are nervous.
We had a great chance to nail down a top 4 place and we tossed it away in the last few minutes in contrast to Spurs who stepped up in injury time to turn a defeat into victory.
That's behind the labile emotions, people do need to relax a bit more. 🤠.
07 Apr 2017 22:02:57
I agree here with Ed 002 I don't see the obsession with Matip, not bad, but not great. The best we have but we can do better! Not a carragher or a hyppia by any means though.
07 Apr 2017 23:13:53
No way, Welsh. Matip has been a consistent performer in Germany for years. he's been more than solid in his first season for us and that is a fact. Can he get better? Yes. Is he great? No and neither was Carra. In fact, Carra does not possess the natural ability that Matip has.
He has a desire to win, do what he was told, and play wherever and that is what got him through his career. Matip needs to improve his fitness along with Lovren and we'll be fine. We are looking to bring in a LCB which is why Gibson and Nastasic have been scouted.
07 Apr 2017 23:19:41
It's his first season. Hyypia and Carra both struggled in their first season.
Give Matip a friggin chance.
08 Apr 2017 00:16:02
Klavan lost track of the ball for the 2nd goal but the player on the near post only got half a header on the first ball in.
It should be our no 1 priority to sign a keeper and a center hslf who can dominate the box and clear the first ball as anything can happen on the 2nd ball, with all the players in front of the goal any deflection could result in a goal.
Cut the threat at source.
08 Apr 2017 13:50:03
The keeper had nothing to do with the second goal and Klopp will not sign a GK cos he still has confidence that Karius will come good BUT it is up to Karius to take his chance.
09 Apr 2017 14:43:38
Is it possible to have a bi polar team that has wonderful highs against better opposition and agonising, lethargic lows against the rest?