09 Oct 2017 14:22:54
When do we start to question if Klopp is the man for the job?
I don't think it's now, I think there are worrying signs but we're still in the green for now. But with so many people who believe he's the messiah, with so much willingness to forgive all faults and equally so much willingness to condem him to damnation for every failure, when is that time? And when it comes, what will we be looking for?
Personally, I think this is THE season to judge him on - 2.5 years to judge the squad and identify holes, 2.5 years to judge and hand-rear the young players he wants, 2 full summer windows and 2 full Jan windows all to prepare for now.
As for what we judge him on, I'd say two areas:
1. Qualify for the CL again. Now we are back in it, we absolutely cannot afford to let it go under any circumstances and doing so would be a massive step backwards.
2. Relative success in at least one tournament - for the FA Cup that would mean a win, for the CL at least quarter finals and a competitive performance.
What do people think? When are we no longer reserving judgement on Klopp and his management, and what are we expecting to see when we do?
09 Oct 2017 14:41:36
He is the right guy for me but not addressing the weaknesses when having this 2 years and enough windows is my only gripe, its taken both Manchester clubs 1 season to figure out there failures and even though they have plenty more money than us we can still buy a decent enough standard of player
Wijnaldum and Ox are 2 buys I don't get when we have plenty of cover in midfield and the keeper situation worry's me, January will be an interesting month.
09 Oct 2017 14:51:51
I respect your opinion but I must disagree. Personally I think he deserves another season after this one, we didn't have the best transfer window, was that his fault? who really knows, I don't. We needed to sort the defence out and we didn't which is a problem but it's not the end of the world, we're not doing as bad as some think. We have big issues within the squad there's no doubt about that but even if we went and signed VVD like everybody wants on Jan 1st, it doesn't mean our problems are solved.
Let him have Jan/ next summer to sort thing's out, I believe he really will, he has no choice, he isn't stupid . I hope not anyway. I trust the man, I think he will get it right, if he doesn't then fine, get him out but not just yet, he deserves more time.
Plus id like to add, even if we don't get top 4 again this season, yes that be classed as a failure but id still give him another season should that be the case.
09 Oct 2017 16:24:58
Corleone, I couldn't agree more fella.
09 Oct 2017 16:21:23
Thanks for that Corleone - like I said, very interested in hearing other people's views. Obviously we started off with a good answer (3 year contract so 3 years judgement) but since he signed the contract extension it's all become a matter of opinion.
09 Oct 2017 18:08:49
May 2019.
09 Oct 2017 18:57:30
Two years on the job, is way too early to be questioning the manager, that much is true. If that was the case, then Poch should be out of a job at Spurs as he has won nothing there and has been there longer than Klopp has been here. What Poch is doing is showing progress and improvement and that is what we need to do here. Improvement and consistency like Cl footie every season need to be shown as well as improvement in player personnel need to be seen so in a year or two, we will be well-primed to mount a meaningful title challenge and hopefully, win.
Comparing us to City and Utd is a false argument cos they are able to drop 250m every season on players. We simply cannot do that, plain and simple. Therefore, we need to be smarter and be more targeted in our TW and look to pay whatever is needed for the right player we want that can improve us like we did with, Naby, Salah, Mane, Wiji, Robbo and the like.
In short, do a Spurs with the hope of winning the PL in the near future. For that, we need support the manager throughout cos like it or not worts and all, FSG are all in with him and we can't be abandoning him each time there is a sticky patch.
09 Oct 2017 19:48:02
Honestly, I think the whole premise of the question is stupid. And now after saying I'll stupidly take part.
My preference is not to judge at all, unless you are truthfully casting a judgement with the purpose of assessing areas to improve in order to move forward. Cast iron judgements based on trophies or fan's perception of progress to decide whether so and so is the person for the job is just not the right way to go imo.
when we got rid of BR it was partly due to poor results but it was also because he was at the helm when it looked like the club had totally lost its way. That is the point of questioning whether someone is the right person for the job. Not in the middle of building a squad having just recently qualified for CL, playing good footy except in a few games not scoring more than 1 goal, sitting a couple points outside top4 after a handful of games.
Look at the areas that need development and support the manager to make those changes.
09 Oct 2017 20:24:27
Once again Bingo, great post mate and I am in full agreement.
09 Oct 2017 20:53:08
I think we should be looking for the team to be on the improvement. If we stagnate, maybe we should see where it's going wrong. Personally I think his behaviour tapping up has been an embarrassment- that's my biggest issue. As for performance I think we've improved in many ways going forward but I think our defence has been caught out. Obviously he needs help but it's unlikely he'll accept any which is a shame. I think we're a lot better than many posters on this forum would believe. I'd like to see him sort out the goalkeeper fiasco and I don't think vvd fixes everything.
09 Oct 2017 22:28:19
Spot on, Faithworks. AOE, I agree with you. Klopp has made mistakes and that much is well documented. We are currently not stagnating and that is the most important thing under Klopp compared to sinking ship he found when he arrived, and a sticky patch in the beginning of this season, does not change that fact. BR was sacked cos we had become poor under him, were seriously stagnating and with no end to the misery in sight. The guy had to go, period.
People seem to forget how bad it was under BR esp. in the beginning of the 15/ 16 season. I remember home games vs Norwich, Villa and Sion when I simply could not tell you if we would get a point in those home games as we were that poor. The life was getting sucked out of me, literally. Who can forget the eyesore that was the EFL game vs Carlisle where we had 40 shots and could not score a goal and needed penalties to get through? Yeah, that was all under BR.
I'm sorry, I do not have a short memory and right now, NONE of that is happening now so the fact that Klopp's position is being questioned after losing 2 out of 13 games this season is laughable to bordering on the ridiculous.
{Ed025's Note - i agree bingo, its far far too early to be calling for his head mate..
10 Oct 2017 09:11:53
Bingo/ Faith - not sure if that is a reference to the original question or not, but if it is I'd like to remind that this was a 'when' question and I specifically stated 'I don't believe it's time yet'
10 Oct 2017 10:45:43
If we don't make it into the Champions League for me, and then you have a look at things. I am not saying that is decision time but rather look at mood/ morale of player and fans, development of players and team, significant injuries, cup win etc and then work out what is best for the club.