21 Oct 2019 07:26:45
So once again we don't turn up at Old Trafford. Yes the officiating was poor but it doesn't hide the fact that until the last 10-15 mins or so we were shocking. It wasn't until Naby and the Ox came on did we look like penetrating their defence.

Having Mané on the right clearly doesn't work, it hasn't previously so why play him there yesterday.

I knew this would happen, all this talk of us battering them 4 or 5 nil.

A wasted opportunity against a woeful United team, this is 2 valuable points dropped.

{Ed001's Note - when has Mane on the right not worked for us previously? Was this when everyone was up in arms about moving him over to the left when he had been playing so well on the right before Salah's arrival perhaps?}

21 Oct 2019 08:58:54
Mane was electric on the right for a long long time before he was moved across.

Big issues was that we came thinking this was old Trafford not another random game.

I think starting Henderson and Gini was fine but the changes weren’t there.

Origi was very very quiet all game.

Why we were pumping floated balls into a box where a man has a forehead the size of Wales I do not know!

Anyways 2 points dropped but 6 points ahead, old Trafford and Stanford bridge done.

Onto champions league!

21 Oct 2019 09:31:25
Ox must start ahead of hendo, he's our captain yes but how is he assisting going forward He was lost yesterday, we need some creativity from the mf and we are not going to get it from Hendo.

21 Oct 2019 10:34:25
I'm confused why we played so many long balls yesterday. Most of those balls were played when Bobby was next to the midfield and Origi was out wide left so it was Mane on his own against 4-5 Utd players. Even the defenders seemed to boycott the midfield to go long. For me Hendo's game was summed up in the first half when he picked the ball up in the centre circle on the half turn with acres of space in front of him and the commentator actually said Henderson has space to drive into and he immediately checked his run back and rolled a backward pass to Trent at right back.

21 Oct 2019 11:49:19
> Anyways 2 points dropped but 6 points ahead, old Trafford and Stanford bridge done.
==============================
Spot on southern red, considering we very early in the season these 2 points are insignificant in the bigger picture, as long as it does n't become a trend, next week we need to collect 3 points and order is restored . We bound to drop points and so would City.

21 Oct 2019 11:52:19
The lineup was cowardly imo from Klopp. We knew Utd would sit back and suffocate our full backs so why didn't we have Keita or Ox on the pitch earlier? Not trying to find scapegoats here but both Gini and Hendo whilst being consummate professionals are extremely limited when contributing in the final third against parked buses. Either sign a CAM or at least play more advanced midfielders in such games.
2 valuable points dropped imo and will give Man City a much needed boost.

21 Oct 2019 11:55:21
Ed 1 do you think having mane on the right affected the team overall, Robertson had one of his worst games in a long time we never seemed able to get mane into the game. Robertson and mane tend to link up well mane drifting in to create space for robertson where origi stays wider a lot more. Although origi was the brightest player for the best part of the match to many players was off their game and made united look better then they actually was.

{Ed001's Note - no, Robertson's issues were down to poor delivery, not who was in front of him.}

21 Oct 2019 12:25:09
IB, how is Klopp's lineup cowardly? Cos he did not pick who you wanted? Everyone knows the three in midfield that started are his tried-and-tested. Did it work going against a team playing 7 players behind the ball? No but how could Klopp had known how utd would set-up? Did you? Now you come on here saying what Klopp could/ should have done and started Naby (a guy who is yet to play a PL game this season) and Ox (who many said should not start cos he was not good vs Newcastle), all after watching the game already. Pls, keep this whole hindsight 20/ 20 genius stuff to the side, man. It is irrelevant, IMO.

Utd made things made things difficult for us. If any LFC fan did not think that that would happen, then that's their fault. The fact of the matter is that utd played their best (with all the help you can ever have from the officiating team) and still got a point vs a team who were not at their best YET created enuff chances to not just get a point BUT to win it outright, I'll take it and move on to fix what did not work. Peace.

{Ed025's Note - its ok to protect klopp i get that redwolf, but where was the energy, the pace and he high press?, that was a poor performance by liverpools standards and you cant get away from that, a point was a fair reflection i would say but it does reveal the problems liverpool have when one of the front 3 are missing, bobby looked lost and the less said about origi the better, i hope you are now going to eat some humble pie on the divock issue and admit that he should never start a game for the reds EVER, come on man its ok to admit you were wrong and we will think better of you if you just hold your hands up mate..peace..

21 Oct 2019 12:18:44
{Ed001's Note
-----------------------

Ed001, I tried to find your opinion / simple analysis via a post on the game and could n't find one . What do you think happened yesterday, we seemed terrible, but I refuse to believe our now experienced players won't be up and ready for a game against united . Klopp would've had them ready and would've made sure there is no complacency or anyone taking anything for granted . Do you think United's setup surprised him and the team and did n't have an answer . Do you think United were good enough to make us look bad, yesterday they were pressing far more and better than we did ?

{Ed001's Note - we just had a poor day at the office. A lot of factors I would say involved, but mainly down to us being poor as we created numerous chances to put the ball into the box and the quality was non-existent.}

21 Oct 2019 13:27:03
Both full backs were quiet yesterday, with United playing a 5, there was no space to run in behind. I have to agree with Buzzer, I was talking to a friend before the team was announced hoping Naby would start.

Hendo and Gini were on international duty so might have been feeling the effects, they certainly looked a bit leggy. I would have had one start on the bench.

21 Oct 2019 13:33:42
I agree OP. When one of the front 3 is injured we move them all over the place and it's like having 2 out. It's worse when he moves Bobby out wide or into midfield, he can't do it, when one is out someone should just slot in and replace them so no harm is done to the normal Line Up.

21 Oct 2019 14:14:52
We were poor yesterday and VAR was a complete joke in my opinion but that’s football. Onto the next game and let’s hope we get back to winning ways, a draw isn’t the end of the world.

21 Oct 2019 14:38:24
We always play like this at Old Traford, with or without the front 3.

21 Oct 2019 15:20:58
Redwolf, Klopp got outclassed and blew it yesterday. No shame in admitting that.
The midfield combo of Hendo-Gini is solid but not the difference maker in scenarios where our front 3 or full backs are not firing. A game changer like Keita (hopefully) or a tactical shift to accommodate a more creative midfielder would go a long way to giving our team more dynamism and edge.

21 Oct 2019 15:22:40
Christ, I can’t wait to come on this site when we finally lose a league game again! I know that wasn’t a great performance yesterday but some of these posts are truly embarrassing.

21 Oct 2019 15:27:41
Ed25, eat some humble pie over wha/ whot? Origi? He had a bad game and so did a lot of people on our team so as always, you are obssessed wit him so your position is not worth a damn thing to me, really. As for protecting Klopp, why would I protect such a manager who admitted himself that we were not very good in the first half or did you conveniently miss that piece of information in your rant in a quest to slate me cos I disagree with you. You can call me all the names you want (shows a true inability to argue your [point on the substance), bro. It won't change what I think and that IMO, Origi is a very good footballer who has proved his worth to us in gold. He will start more games and help us more this season, like he did last season in the PL and CL so you would do well to get over that stuff quickly for the sake of your sanity, lol. btw, scapegoating him only makes you look weak. Is he better than the front 3? No BUT we don't need him to be cos if he was, he won't not be here.

We did not play well enuff to win and that I can take, take the point and move on to work on what did not work while taking positives with what we did do right.

{Ed025's Note - i dont slate you at all redwolf i am an educator and only wish to help you and your perceptions of how good a player is or is not my friend, divock as other posters and myself know is not good enough for a starting berth in the liverpool side im afraid, norwich or brighton maybe but if you are looking to win the league then a player with such limited ability cannot be allowed to be your first option as a back up, i dont know whether your his agent or something but you seem determined for people to rate the guy, hes probably a nice guy and i wish him well but if i were a liverpool supporter (god forbid) i would be very disappointed if he were to start any more games mate, all the best...and you are welcome..peace..

21 Oct 2019 16:11:51
Read a stat earlier that Hendo completed 26 passes in 71 minutes. Keita completed 22 in 8 minutes. Don't know how true it is. It would involve having to watch the game again and counting. I'd rather watch paint dry than that again to be honest.

21 Oct 2019 16:40:21
Hindsight is always 20/ 20 of course, so it's always easy to say we should have done this and should have done that. But experience is always the best teacher and most of us have seen Origi perform best as an impact sub. He's at his best when coming in for one of our front 3 late in a game and facing tired defenders. Klopp shifted to a 4-2-3-1 in the second half and then to a 4-4-2 in the final 15 minutes which seemed to work best against their 5-3-2. Maybe he should have considered the 4-4-2 from the beginning with Ox getting a start next to Fabinho, Gini and Hendo, since he knew Salah was not starting and Origi is not effective as a starter.

{Ed025's Note - i could not agree more mate..

21 Oct 2019 17:41:25
Our workmanlike approach to midfield works OK when we have our front three as a unit given how lethal they are. They are always going to create chances if they are all available, giving us a decent shot at scoring one or two, while our midfield makes sure the opposition can’t, tipping the odds in our favour for a win.

The problems start when one of them is out however, as we lose a lot of the unpredictability that comes from having two world class wingers on both right and left side. Sides know they can drop deeper without worrying too much about Hendo or Gini.

IMO the one thing Klopp has to do when we are missing Salah or Mane is to add a bit more threat from midfield, and for me this is playing Keita or Ox to carry the ball a bit more and get into the box.

{Ed025's Note - i will have that SG..

21 Oct 2019 18:35:12
When Naby came on the was finding angles/ passes that was missing from pretty much the whole game. Their defence panicked big time with five or so mins to go, that coupled with the Ox’s direct running.

21 Oct 2019 18:51:49
Ed25, who died and made you the sole arbiter on what Origi's role should beat LFC? After all per Ed01, It took you 3 whole years to figure out that Bobbie was a beast of a footballer while the rest of us already knew Bobbie was magic after one full year as the no. 9 so why am I listening to you again? Also, you are the same guy who said Andre Gomes would be better than Fabinho last season. How is that turning out, again? You said Calvert-Lewin was better than Divvy? One is a CL legend and the other is still toiling at Neverton. Again, why would anyone listen to someone who has been proven wrong too many times before?

Also, People who don't rate Origi are free to have that opinion and I am ready to debate them on the merits. I am not interested in convincing anyone of anything. Just to argue my point respectfully. That is not what you are doing, on the contrary.

You have had it in for this kid since he ruined your life in derby games and proved you massively wrong all of last season. Also had Klopp listened to you and sold him, Origi would not have been around to prove you wrong as an option off the bench. And since you can't argue your point and cos I disagree with you, you resort to name-calling and unhinged diatribes. I don't care of Divvy had a bad game out of 5. He is a good option to have and that is my opinion. Debate me on the merits of the topic and prove me wrong and if you can't, move on cos name-calling has never convinced anyone of a damn thing. Peace.

{Ed025's Note - i dont name call mate i just say it like it is, and to call divock a CL legend is typical of you and your red tinted view of all things liverpool, this is not about you or even me its about origi,s suitability as a replacement for one of liverpools front 3, impact sub yes when things are not going to plan and desperate measures are needed, but if you are trying to convince me that he can be a starter i suggest you try someone more gullible..peace..

21 Oct 2019 20:17:33
Clearly the part in my last post where I said, "I am not interested in convincing anyone of anything. Just to argue my point respectfully. " is lost on you, Ed25. For the risk of sounding redundan, I am NOT interested in convincing you or anyone of anything cos that to me, is not the essence of debate. IMO, the goal of a debate is to argue your opinion on the merits and the substance and if you can convince someone then fine. I can disagree with you on Origi while at the same time, agreeing with some of your points as valid arguments. That is not what you are doing here, mate.

First off, you say that desperate measures could be needed if the front three are not firing. tell me, where we not desperate vs your lot, Barca, Newcastle and Spurs in the CL final? Our season was on the verge of collapse and Origi stepped up and did the bus. esp. vs Barcelona where no one gave us a chance. You seem to have an inability to consider both sides of an issue. You can't even argue your own points with perspective so why would I care what you think esp. since you've been wrong on every single LFC player you have slated in the past (Fab, Bobbie etc) .

Also, you say you don't call me names. Do you want me to pull up all the rubbish (school boy, born again christian, most biased blah, blah, blah) you've called me in your other replies? You're not even honest about your own actions and words and can't own up to them so how can I even debate you on anything? You are an educator. As a former tutor, I wouldn't want my kids anywhere near an "educator" who can't make his case with out losing his marbles and resorting to name-calling. For the last time, I am not interested in convincing you of anything and judging by your conduct, I wouldn't even try if someone paid me. Either way, keep the debate coming, man. I thrive on such things. Peace.

{Ed025's Note - arguing your case is fine but there are better ways than bullying people into submission redwolf, when putting your case forward belittling others is not really the way to go, yes i have been guilty of that with you because its like talking to a brick wall at times, its your way or the highway and it does irk me that you never consider anyone but yourself to have a valid point, please dont give me a reason to stop you airing your views as some of your posts are quite interesting when expressed in a more cordial manner..peace..

22 Oct 2019 00:14:52
Ed25, you can accuse me of being a bit too passionate in my delivery of my opinions and points BUT to say it is my way or the highway and not think others having valid pints is wide off the mark, IMO. Countless times I have agreed with many people on here and even when I disagree I acknowledge when there is the need, to agree with points others make without agreeing with their overall premise.

I enjoy debate cos it actually stimulates me and I enjoy banter as well cos I can take it as well as dish it out. What I don't agree with is when people act like their smarter than the rest of us and make hindsight-coded arguments after the game is over like "Klopp should have started this or that guy and not this or that guy" after the game has been played, something that is very rampant here. Or when people start complaining cos Klopp did not do what they wanted or calling us bottlers cos we did not win a game. I don't believe in any of that cos it's easy to sound smart after the fact. Either way, we can disagree w/ o being disagreeable and I'm cool with that. Peace out, man.

{Ed025's Note - disagreeing is fine by me redwolf and we are not looking for stepford wives who all agree with each other mate, what we do want is tolerance of other peoples views and respect for posters even though they may not agree with them, peace..