22 Oct 2019 14:27:19
Question for you Ed001. Been stuck in a bit of a youtube hole today, watching some highlights of the great players of the last 20 years or so, including ones you have previously mentioned that you loved Ronaldo, Ronaldinho, Bergkamp etc
Are there any more non-Liverpool players who you felt were just a joy to watch and seem to get less and less of the recognition they deserve as time goes on?
{Ed001's Note - Ozil before he joined Arsenal, Denilson (mostly for comedy value as he would do 700 stepovers and fall over his own feet a lot of the time), Joaquin as a youngster was very exciting before he lost his way. One of my favourite non-Liverpool players is Javier Zanetti, he was the Argentine Steve Nicol, could play anywhere like he was born to the role. Nedved I always loved to watch, he was the most two-footed player I have ever seen as he trained so hard on his weaker foot he made it into his strongest foot. He would go home from training with the club and then train in his gym at home because he wanted to be better. Loved Nedved. There are a bunch of players from the old Yugoslavia at one point that were brilliant to watch, but whose names completely escape me. Stoichkov was a hell of a strutting peacock but could play. Prosinecki was a Rolls-Royce of a player before the heavy smoking destroyed his ability to run. There are loads more I am sure but I just can't think of any off the top of my head.}
22 Oct 2019 16:07:41
Hope he doesn't do punditry like nicol though ed😂😂😂.
{Ed001's Note - I doubt anyone else could quite match Nicol in that department.}
22 Oct 2019 17:10:45
Nedved's a great shout, loved that guy;
Gianluigi Lentini before his car crash;
I know you said non-Liverpool but Jari Litmanen earlier in his career;
Manuel Rui Costa supplying Garbriel Batistuta was an amazing combination;
Thomas Brolin before he signed for Leeds and got fat;
My favourite non-Liverpool player ever is Edgar Davids in his prime. He was just unplayable.
22 Oct 2019 17:38:33
I remember Denilson in those Sevilla colors, Ed001. What a dribbler. But you're right. Dribbling for dribbling's sake and not much else. I'm sure you're thinking of Boban and Savicevic from the old Yugoslavia teams. In my opinion, a lot of the African players never got the acclaim they deserved. Players like George Weah, Jay Jay Okocha, Kanu and Abedi Pele never really got the recognition. Of course the internet came later and players like Drogba, Eto'o, the Toure brothers and Michael Essien benefitted from that. But I've never seen a forward tear up defenses single handedly the way George Weah did. Just like Ronaldo and Shevchenko (at his peak with Milan) .
{Ed001's Note - you are right about Boban and Savicevic. Do you really think Weah, Okocha, Kanu and Pele never got the recognition? A world footballer of the year, a player whose nephew can't so much as blink without a subtitle under mentioning it was Okocha's nephew blinking, Kanu who was a massive star (more than his laziness and dreadful attitude at times deserved) and a player known as Pele because of just how good he was. They got huge amounts of recognition. Weah and Abedi Ayew are the two best African players ever and I think they get massive (and well deserved) acclaim. Sam Allardyce is still living off having had Okocha in his team!}
22 Oct 2019 18:19:24
Spot on, Ed01 re: African players. George Weah is a god in Liberia and all of Africa and a role model not just for his prowess on the pitch BUT for all he represents off it. When he was Liberian capt. he used to fund their away trips, kits, administrative costs, the whole lot. They were so top heavy in the team like Joe Nagbe (his son Darlington plays in the U. S), Christopher Wreh (Weah's cousin and ex-Arsenal) etc so he would play at CB just to accommodate his team mates. They qualified for the AFCON twice under his leadership.
Also for a guy with only a primary school diploma for most of his life, he made a good way for himself and now, has two colege degrees as President of Liberia. Now his son, Timothy Weah plays for the U. S and Lille (camr thru the PSG academy) . "Mr George" was/ is an inspiration to African kids (like me) who grew up in that era and frankly at the time, the best CF since Marco Van Basten, IMO and the first and ONLY African player to win the Balon D'Or and FIFA Player of the Year in the same year (1995). he would dedicate the Balon D'Or to Arsene Wenger, the guy who signed him at Monaco from Tonnere Yaounde in Cameroon.
{Ed001's Note - he was incredible Weah, good enough to stand comparison with the Ronaldo.}
22 Oct 2019 20:00:08
Spot on, Ed01. It is these types of players from back in the day where you to win the Balon D'Or, you actually had to be THE best player cos your peers (fellow legends of the game) were just as good enuff to win these awards as you were.
This is why I will NEVER agree with this notion that the millenials (Who in some cases never saw these giants of the game play) want to convince us of that Lionel Messi is the best player of all time. Sorry but NOPE, ain't having that.
The likes of Weah, Ronaldo (O Phenomeno, the best player I have ever seen), Diego Maradona (El Diez, the god of football), Pele (El Rey, The King), Marco Van Basten (arguably the best CF to ever play the game) etc. are all inferior to this guy from Argentina? Nah, man. They need to take that ""Messi is the GOAT" stuff somewhere else and I will be happy to debate anyone with this opinion respectfully on the merits. Peace.
{Ed001's Note - it would be nice to see Messi have to play in similar conditions to the old school players, so a fair comparison can be made. It is much easier to produce skill on a billiard table pitch than it was on the old ploughed fields they used to play on!}
22 Oct 2019 20:45:16
Duncan Edwards for me was awesome. Still can't believe the number of ManU fans I meet who have never heard of him.
{Ed002's Note - That is because he died 60 years ago.}
22 Oct 2019 22:09:47
Spot on, Ed. I would also love to see Messi and CR7 perform/ keep their cool while suffering the type of brutal, inhumane treatment Diego Maradona had to suffer in the hands of Claudio Gentile at the '82 WC or the abject physical pain the Portuguese players meted out to Pele in the 1966 WC where they almost left him crippled for life.
I also remember the types of challenges Ronaldo had to ride to score the great goals he scored in Serie A going against hard men like Carnavaro, Nesta, Paolo Montero, Lillian Thuram and the whole lot of defensive legends that played at that time.
{Ed001's Note - it would be just as good to see just what magic those old time players could conjure up without the brutal tackles.}
22 Oct 2019 22:14:27
You do have a point there about Weah winning the Player of the Year, Ed001, it slipped my mind. I guess the point I was trying to make is that recent and current players have benefitted far more from the internet than their predecessors have because it wasn't there. In my case, I learned the most about them through the monthly footie magazines and the occasional World Cup and Champions League games if they were televised wherever I was living at the time.
Interesting thing coming up soon, in regards to the Messi GOAT discussion. Ronaldo (CR7) is slowly creeping up on Pele's total tally of goals scored in a career. I wonder if he will be anointed the GOAT? But in my mind it's pretty clear that the greats of earlier decades were far better than players like Messi or Ronaldo. Players today have their entire lifestyle "managed" for them for optimal performance. The pitches are better, the ball is actually as round as it can be, and players are protected physically far better by the rules of the game. Not to mention the financial rewards.
{Ed001's Note - I suppose it is different for me as well, my world has always revolved around footie. My walls were covered in posters, Shoot was the comic of choice etc. In fact I would say probably getting on for 90% of the conversations I have had in my life were about football as well! So I forget that if you are not in the same life you might not hear so much about these players.}
23 Oct 2019 13:53:27
For me it was Shoot and Match and World Soccer (English) , Onze and Mondial (French) and even Placar (I tried to decipher Brazilian Portuguese due to it being close to French and Spanish) .
It's so much easier today to follow your passion (s) with the internet being accessible to everyone.