30 Nov 2020 11:52:46
Question for ed01

With regards to our defensive injuries, would you continue to go with Phillips/ Williams assuming that can stay fit or would you look to sign a more experienced better quality defender in January if so, who would you personally go for?

Thanks.

{Ed001's Note - I would stick with Phillips and add him to the Champs League squad in January. Unless there is a top class defender who is available in January for a price we can easily afford (highly unlikely), I don't see the point in signing anyone.

Though I have to say, I would feel much happier if we had a better defender than Williams as the other option. He is only young and could well improve, but defensively he is hopeless and has no awareness or positional sense and is constantly caught out. Adding that to his lack of pace and the turning circle of the double decker bus Jose parked in front of the goal yesterday and it is a major worry.

I don't understand why so few players these days have any kind of awareness of what is around them, but he is particularly bad. Maybe he is just a bit too laid back to be worried about what is happening around him? Shame because he is very good on the ball and calm and composed, which is a big help. No good being calm in the challenge if you are 20 yards behind the play with no pace to catch it up though!}

30 Nov 2020 12:19:29
I admit I don't watch nearly as much non-Liverpool games as I used to, but it seems to me that defending as an art is dying out. Most 'good' defenders these days, especially in England, seem to rely on their physicality and recovery pace than their ability to read the game.

Even van Dijk, possibly on balance the best defender in the world over the last 2-3 years, had lapses in his concentration. And some of the guys who pass as Premier League defenders nowadays are genuinely shocking.

30 Nov 2020 12:55:08
Agreed something red. I think the big change is that the focus now is on attack or contributing to attack. Gone are the days where a defenders first thought is to defend, they seem more focussed on contributing to play, as a result the standard of defending goes done. I used to love watching hypia play as a kid. He was slow but I admired his reading of the game and positional sense.

30 Nov 2020 13:00:58
I’d add Phillips to that list personally Ed001, he was finding himself getting dragged into some horrible positions on Saturday. Particularly noticeable when he was miles away and Brighton got in behind and there was that Fabinho handball incident.
Look where Phillips was.
Not been impressed by anyone of the younger stand-ins to be honest.
Of course they need experience and games but, ideally, you want to do it gradually in a strong side. Not altogether, it just compounds itself.
I hope we can get a CB in that can cover RB too in January, if possible.
Otherwise this will cost us dearly I fear.

{Ed001's Note - only in the first half, he was much better in the second. Clearly it was a tactical instruction to come out and close down which Klopp changed and he was able to adapt.}

30 Nov 2020 13:23:52
I think it’s how kids are being coached early. I see it a lot now. The really fast kids are pushed to play up front or as wingers or even full backs (depending on age) . Then the bigger / taller kids are being used in defence. As they grow up and develop more the kids are already in their positions then. Look at (young) centre half’s these days not a lot of them have out and out pace. Gomez does but even at his age there is a generation below him. They then have to rely on reading the game and positional awareness which takes a lot.

30 Nov 2020 13:51:39
In principle I agree in not panic buying.

But, it's what the January window is for. Our two 1st cbs are out long term. The other senior cb cannot play every game.

Since klopp arrived we have gone up 2 or 3 levels, it won't last forever. It seems a shame to not max out our potential. We aren't going to go beat Madrid over 2 legs if Philips and Williams are our cbs. And it is more than possible they will be. We are playing one of our best cms at the back and thus losing something. It means Hendo plays deeper, and again we are losing something. If Philips gets caught out by Brighton, what do you imagine bayern will do? I'm not saying we can't win games with those two. But defending (which all teams do plenty of in the latter stages of the cl) will be proper nervy. God it was nervy with vvd!

It might be difficult to find decent cbs, but it can't be hard to find one better than Williams. Sorry to the lad, I do think he has a future in the premier league but too soon for juve away.

I keep hearing ghe same two or three names banded about. But if we do sign a cb I don't think it'll be white or uperme- don't know his name really. It'll be someone no one thought of (bit like jota or salah, mane or Firmino)

I'd like to see less pressure on matip. Fabhino in dcm and Hendo further forward. Signing one cb would have a massive effect on 2/ 3 positions (fab, Hendo, matip and new lad) 4 positions even. I think it's worth it.

30 Nov 2020 13:58:14
Do you think Rhys awareness is just due to a lack of experience at 1st team level? Given the pace, movement of the game vs U18’s surely it’s something he should be able to learn.

30 Nov 2020 14:27:47
Yes Southern mate. Being strong, good in the air and a good passer will get you through the academy maybe but pro footballers are cunning too (alot of attacking players) and you either have a natural ability to sniff these moments out, or more commonly, you learn to read it.

I noticed in Williams first game that he was cool on the ball and looked confident, as ed01 pointed out. But he's gone up a massive level before he's ready really imo.

30 Nov 2020 15:17:58
Phillips is who should have been drafted in as our 4th CB cos I said it at the time, he is the most experienced of the young CBS at the club and besides, your fourth CB should not even b playing that much but injuries have said otherwise.

As for defending as an art, it is well and truly dead vid we are prioritising quality on the ball and passing ability over the actual ability to defend with or without the ball, anticipation, positional sense, awareness and so on. Sad but true.

30 Nov 2020 15:52:32
Phillips looks slower than Williams.
He’s a decent, old fashioned CB but never a Liverpool player in a month of Sundays I’m afraid.

30 Nov 2020 16:07:39
I've been watching football since the mid 70's and it has always been like this - the attacking players always got all the attention and glory and people did not give much attention to the rest. It was almost an understood notion that if you were skilled in football you would be pushed forward to the front and if you weren't you played in the back. If anything, defensive players have only started to get more attention and acclaim in the last 15-20 years. They're earning as much as attacking players and are valued at equal levels during transfers. I read all the time on here how defending skills have deteriorated. But I don't remember defenders as imposing as VVD, or running as fast as Robbo or Walker. But that's just me.

30 Nov 2020 21:03:41
Personally i think we will try to bring a CH in if at all possible. Someone will have to be sold to fully or part-fund it (and to free up a non-HG slot), but needs must.
No idea who btw.