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22 Jun 2022 10:34:46
Good move for club ad Minamino I see a lot of people on here saying he should have played more. I don't think he should have, I don't think he was suited to are league it's all right scoring in the cups against weaker teams but Klopp gave him plenty of chances in the league and he did not take them went missing to much in games Jota might do the same but he pops up and scores.

Agree0 Disagree0

22 Jun 2022 10:48:14
I would agree with you re the 20/ 21 season but he was much more physically impressive last season. I'd say he played the RW/ RWF role better than anyone else that was asked to in Salah's absence. He was also an excellent finisher and pressed intelligently.

22 Jun 2022 10:50:49
He played 176 minutes in the league and scored 3 goals, so he didn't get that many chances and for the time he did get hedid well, and I'd say he got about the pitch and showed a lot more desire than jota, not saying he should have stayed or anything I think the move is best for everyone but to say he got plenty of chances in the league and barely did anything is extremely unfair to the lad.

22 Jun 2022 11:07:46
Agree 21 goals and 8 assists and finishing first in most successful pressures and closing down is not the type of player we need. Hopefully we can offload Jota at the first opportunity.

22 Jun 2022 11:26:12
Sammy, i think it's fair to criticise Jota's touch and passing but it is absolutely laughable to question how well he gets about the pitch or his desire. Out of all of our forwards only Firmino averaged more defensive actions per 90 (pressures, tackles, interceptions, blocks and clearances) . Jota might not be silky on the eye but making up nonsense about his attitude on the pitch is not something i have absolutely any time for. It's actually embarrassing how fair the agenda against him on this site has gone now.

For anyone interested in the defensive actions made last season by a few of the forwards (rounded to nearest whole:
Diaz - 18 per 90
Firmino - 29 per 90
Nunez - 19 per 90
Jota - 26 per 90
Salah - 17 per 90
Mane - 17 per 90

One thing you most definitely cannot hold against Jota is his application out of possession.

22 Jun 2022 11:39:40
re Jota - opinions seem to be getting a bit extreme in both directions. He's clearly a talented player and deadly finisher - two footed and freakishly good in the air. His issue is that he needs time to work on his game in terms of link up play. That is a criticism that could be aimed at most of our forwards at times.

He's also not been helped by being moved from the left, to the centre and to the right. He's also chucked into a 4-2-4 formation when we get desperate in games.

The bigger concern is that we have another busy schedule in this condensed season and I wonder how much time they will have to invest in developing his all round game on the training field. Pre-season is going to be incredibly important for him.

Interestingly, the games that I felt he had his best all round games were when Bobby was in the side too. Might be something in that.

22 Jun 2022 11:44:59
Mk I question his desire because he spends half the game flailing his hands in the air like a child. So yes I think his desire is lacking I don't care what stats you throw at me the amount of times I see him make a mistake and just flail his arms about is what I find laughable. I still think jota a great player for the record, I just think it's unfair for OP to say jota does the same but gets results when minamino has also got results with his limited time whilst also always working hard to rectify mistakes he made.

22 Jun 2022 13:16:49
Jota has a pass completion of 75% and Bobby 78%. It’s amazing how 3% changes a player from being can’t pass the ball to our front line cannot function or score without him knitting everything together.

Roll on the season starting. Hopefully we as the best fans in the world can stop giving our own players pelters once the football starts.

22 Jun 2022 13:36:47
JK stats aren't the be all and end all. How difficult were the passes for example. Is Bobby 3% better whilst attempting twice as many through balls or passes into the penalty box, for example? Or is it in fact Jota who attempts more through balls and progressive passes?

That being said I have no problem with Jota as part of the squad. Generally speaking, he trades control of possession for goal threat. There are games where we will need that and there are games where we won't.

Going forward, a lot will depend on how Nunez settles and if Diaz adds more end product. If they start banging them in, then Jota might find his niche being encroached on.

22 Jun 2022 14:25:55
SR all of our forwards have lower percentage pass completion compared to our midfielders or defenders due to them not passing the ball backwards or sidewards as many times. But that’s the nature of the beast and I’d rather see the forwards attempt riskier passes to create a chance.

Just from the naked eye it’s fairly obvious that Bobby is a better player than Jota with regards to retaining possession and then Jota is a better goal scorer. Last season Bobby played less than 30% of league minutes throughout the season so as important as Bobby is it has been we did pretty well with Jota in the lineup.

22 Jun 2022 16:02:34
Back to Minamino, underused and never given a chance to build any kind of momentum. Wish we used him more as they were obvious times others as head of him needed a spell.

22 Jun 2022 19:08:19
Jota bashing IMO is a joke. I have nothing to more say on it.
Anyway on Taki, probably deserved more of a chance but never let us down when called upon. Good player at the wrong club I think. Ironic that for all the plaudits of our first choice front 5 (before Mane left) we didn’t win the trophies they played the most part in but did the double in no small part thanks to bit part players Divock and Taki who we would not even of got to the final without. All the best to the pair of them.

22 Jun 2022 19:37:00
Taki wasn’t as good as the other 5 players ahead of him in the pecking order it’s that simple. He has talent but I always thought he didn’t have a big game mentality and shied away when things got tough.
It’s been said before a million times I trust Klopp who sees him train every day and knows him personally and he never quite trusted him to step in when the others were out. That’s tells it’s own story for me.
Good luck to him I have nothing against him at all he gave his all every time he played but some players just aren’t meant for big teams where pressure is unbearable at times.
I hope he goes on to have a stellar career he seems a genuine, hard working guy he deserves it.

22 Jun 2022 21:32:30
Lfcsammy he did not play 176 minutes that’s how often he scored.

22 Jun 2022 21:41:01
Some fans just assume he is not good enough just because Klopp doesn't play him. Similar cases with wijnaldum, fans thinks he is very good player just because Klopp always play him.

That is simply lazy thought without really watching him play.

Assist and then score an equalizer against Leicester, weaker team according to some fans, but then we lose against Leicester the next match.

Come one just be truth and honest, Klopp didn't play Minamino simply because he doesn't rate him.

Klopp rather play Ox in the false 9 than Minamino. What else you want to say. No need to degrade him. Saying he is too weak for EPL and all sort of poor and lazy excuses.

22 Jun 2022 22:07:55
Sepah, nobody is saying Taki is a bad player, he’s a very good player that much is obvious.
He just didn’t quite have what it takes to be first choice at one of the biggest clubs in the world at this stage in his career.
There’s no shame in that it’s a ruthless business. He didn’t really set the world alight at Southampton either to be honest.
Good squad player that can do a decent job when called upon but that’s about it.
I hope he can find a home at Monaco and really push on he seems a great lad.

23 Jun 2022 01:36:09
I am also sick and tired of the Jota bashing

Had a few discussions on here with posters. Agree to disagree I think is the only way we can leave it.

23 Jun 2022 06:24:24
Good god take out jota’s goals last season and there won't be a title challenge.
Can he improve and get better, of course yes but the anti - group is a bit ridiculous here.
Also now he has a season under is belt and done good, i can only see him getting better.

23 Jun 2022 08:27:11
If you take our forwards last season : Sadio, Mo, Bobby, Diogo, Luis, Big Div and Taki, I would argue that

Diogo is the most natural goal scorer and Taki might very well be the second rated most natural scorer.

Bobby has, by far, the best instinctive football brain.

The best combination on the pitch was Luis, Sadio and Mo as they are all brilliant all rounders.

Of course they all have their weaknesses but Mr Klopp being the pretty good manager that he is, seems to have the happy knack of knowing which combination to pick based on the opposition we were up against.

Obviously, three of the seven have gone but on the plus side we have brought in Nunez and with the five we have at our disposal, possibly augmented by Carvalho and Ox (and a slightly altered formation) we should go ok. No doubt over the course of the season we will hear more of the players faults but that seems to be the norm for fans these days, sadly.

{Ed001's Note - what do you mean these days? That has always been the way. I can remember as a little kid listening to a group of Liverpool fans discussing Sammy Lee - he was everything from a fat waster to a useless lump. In fact just about anything bad you can think of to say about a player he got called. Nothing has changed, it is just that now it is online for everyone to read, rather than just in the pub or workplace etc.

And Divvy was by far the most natural goalscorer of them all, Jota misses a lot of chances that a natural goalscorer would gobble up. While even the best miss some, the amount he misses is not far off the likes of Salah. Yes he scores a lot, but it is clearly he is not a natural penalty box predator, that is something he can improve on markedly and hopefully will.}

23 Jun 2022 09:00:54
"And Divvy was by far the most natural goalscorer of them all". Excellent point, ED. That 4th goal vs Barcelona alone in that CL semi final at Anfield, is all you need to know about how naturally gifted a goalscorer Divvy is/ was. None of our forwards are in his league in this department, IMO.

{Ed001's Note - if he had the fire in his belly to match his natural talent, he would be up amongst the best in the world easily. I remember chatting to some of the Belgian international staff just before Bobby Brown Shoes was appointed and they raved about him as the best natural talent Belgium had.}

23 Jun 2022 10:48:59
Fair point about the fans having a scapegoat. Gary Ablett was another one who wasn’t a favourite.

It just seems that the threshold of tolerance is a lot shorter in general these days.

Take the point about Jota missing a few - when I read the response Brian McClair popped into my head - scored a few for Man Utd but missed a lot more than he scored.







 

 

 
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