24 Jul 2024 01:17:01
Do you know if we have any interest in Ugarte? Also, does anyone rate him?
Thanks.
24 Jul 2024 02:16:46
good player. but personally think that he is another torreira. terrier but lacking in ball skills.
24 Jul 2024 06:30:49
We were. but then apparently we tapped him up and upset the Sporting FC folk.
{Ed001's Note - why would that upset Sporting when he plays for PSG?}
24 Jul 2024 07:26:07
In fairness Ed I think he’s referring to when he was a sporting player last year and tapped him up.
Not sure why we wouldn’t still be interested mind you. I guess new dept in place transfers now with different ideas.
24 Jul 2024 08:05:19
He's well suited to EtH's "negative" approach. A good destroyer who gets about breaking up play to give others more freedom. An upgrade on Amrabat for sure, and much younger than Casemiro.
Ugarte is just not what a team that wants to play tidy possession football needs though, because he lacks any kind of incisive passing quality to play through the lines. He's effectively a body to receive it and give the ball straight back, when you're in possession, which he does fine and keeps the ball well enough. But you're not going to see many progressive passes or carries from him because he doesn't have it in the locker. Same as how you won't see him frequently hitting cross field passes or creating chances for team mates.
Good at what he does, but the wrong player for teams like City, Arsenal and Liverpool who want to play on the front foot and dominate possession in the opposition half. He'll really free up Mainoo to actually show what he can do though.
24 Jul 2024 09:38:19
Exactly, MKS. PSG paid 65m for him and they want rid already? Nah, that's a weird situation I ain't trying to touch. In fact, I think he got benched for the Portuguese Veitinha (boss player, IMO) who does not only know how to win the ball but also, is very good on the ball, great progressive passing ability, as well. And playing next to my BFF Fabian Ruiz for PSG was pretty good to watch in the CL, IMO.
I have said before, teams who are trying to play tidy, progressive footie are looking for DM's like Xabi Alonso rather than Mascherano or Ugarte type DM's who let's face it, are becoming obsolete right now, IMO. Utd are welcome to him.
24 Jul 2024 10:01:03
To mark Ugarte down as just some lumpen destroyer is doing him a bit of disservice here MK, in the season before he joined PSG, he played nearly as many long balls and made more forward runs with the ball than Fabinho at his best (18/ 19 and 19/ 20), who we widely accept as being one of the best around at his peak. Regrettably it seems like United may be getting their act together off the pitch. My only hope is that ten Hag continues with his complete lack of competency.
24 Jul 2024 11:25:46
What's Caicedo regarded as?
Because this time time year FSG and the club were being laudit over their bid for him.
24 Jul 2024 11:59:35
I think Caicedo is regarded to be London’s premier connoisseur of late night fried chicken shops, along with his slightly rotund mother. The Caicedo star rating is the equivalent of a Michelin star in the fried chicken industry, JK.
24 Jul 2024 12:12:26
I didn't really see the fuss in ugarte when we were originally rumoured. Some teams play a way which requires a physical midfielder who's sole job is to break up play but neither klopp or slot need that since both play with organised pressing.
A ball winning midfielder works in a team which is reactive when on defense. A team which is proactive on defense needs someone who is not only high energy but can retain and recycle play. Ugarte doesn't do that, as Viktor points out he wins the ball then plays it long forward. Slot doesn't play that way so he'd be an odd signing for slot and in 6 months everyone would be complaining about how often he's giving the ball away.
24 Jul 2024 12:32:41
Surely we want all of our players to be ball winners? And also be able to pass the ball more than 10 yards.
Preferably with both feet and without falling over.
24 Jul 2024 12:47:21
My point, Nevada, is that Ugarte doesn’t just win the ball and give it 5 yards to someone who can play it, at Sporting he mixed it up like Fabinho used to, although not quite as good a player. So to write him off as some kind of modern day David Batty is somewhat harsh. Truth is that until we have a top class centre midfielder who is defensively excellent, then we’re not winning a the league or champions league and we will continue to be also rans. Klopp’s best sides always played with one (we only won the league when we signed Fabinho. ) and Slot used Mats Wiefer as one of his midfield pairing, it did surprise me we didn’t have a look at him as he wasn’t hugely priced and is technically very good defensive midfielder. If the plan is to continue with what we have then we’ll just continue to give soft goals away.
24 Jul 2024 14:27:28
ViktorVaughan, the can't sign or look to sign anyone and everyone that me or you think they should. That's just impossible. That aside and as for Fab IMO, not only was he great at breaking up play defensively, he was brilliant on the ball and could pick a bass (a decisive pass) from deep or from the final third either diagonally or otherwise. Something Ugarte is not suited for, IMO. His (Fab's) ability on the ball seems to have been underrated and forgotten as time as went on, IMO.
Also remember before there was Rodri, there was Fab who was brilliant in the way he played the DM role for us under Klopp and many of us thought he was world class. Ugarte is not in his league and cannot do the things Fab could do for us esp. creatively.
Now you may think that we won't win the title with a top class DM. At the same time, one can also think that we won't win the title with an Ugarte type DM either cos Slot likes to have the ball hence, his inability to be creative from deep, like Fab was for us when we won the title. Just my take.
24 Jul 2024 14:40:19
With regards to the OP yes I rate him, he offers teams ball winning abilities and is very good at shielding the back line, something Endo was lauded for on here last season.
24 Jul 2024 16:27:39
My bad. I actually didn't realise he moved to PSG.
Thought he was still at Sporting. clearly didn't set the world alight in the French league.
24 Jul 2024 16:35:56
Not writing him off Viktor just pointing out that slot does not like his players to do that. He prefers players to make 5 yard passes so why the club would pursue a player who doesn't fit slots system or provide anything that slot needs doesn't make sense.
I doubt you'll see a "ball winner" signed by us this season because it's just not the way slot has liked to play previously. His team's defend in groups of pressing mostly on their feet. The old gattuso style ball winner isn't something he utilises.
It's not a slight against ugarte, it's just a square peg for a round hole. I do think ugarte is a little overrated though as well. Though psg aren't selling due to him not being good enough he's being sold for the same reason we won't buy him. He doesn't fit their style of play. Ugarte is much better suited to a team who don't expect to have possession much and play on the counter. For a possession based team as I expect slot will make us someone like zubimendi would make more sense as he fits the style.
* That's not me saying we'll sign zubimendi, it was just an example.
24 Jul 2024 17:34:09
Has Trent been told he’s only allowed to pass the ball 5 yards next season.
24 Jul 2024 17:34:49
Nevada, fully agree with all you have said. Ugarte is a player whose skill set we do not need in a Slot setup. I mean even if you look at Endo, he can win the ball cleanly and create from deep due to his short, mid and long range forward-passing ability as we all saw last season. Were he a few years younger, Im signing him over Ugarte all day, every day. Ugarte is a good/ very good player and will sign for a big club who needs his skill set. We're not that team, sorry.