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RR's rumours posts with other poster's replies to RR's rumours posts
07 Mar 2023 10:16:16
Bellingham, Mount, Nunes, Gvardiol. All sounds great and, depending on who/ what you can believe, it does seem like we are definitely pursuing Bellingham, which implies we have the sort of money available to sign him. But even if we only add a couple of players of this level in the summer, we're talking about spending at a level that we have hardly ever done in a single transfer window. And the difference now is that we don't have a huge amount of value in the squad in terms of players who we would be willing to sell who would bring a reasonable transfer fee.
So my question is whether we have the money to sign, for example, Bellingham + 1 other of these types of players. Total would be going somewhere between £150m - £200m for Bellingham + 1. The on-going costs/ salaries looks a bit better in so much as Keita, Ox, Firmino and possibly Milner would remove something like £500k per week.
Is this type of transfer activity in the summer dependent on FSG getting the investors that we're led to believe they are seeking? Doesn't seem like a great deal of time to secure that and be ready to go with large sums of money in the summer. Or is there already commitment to spend this summer from FSG, regardless of transfer sales or investment?
{Ed002's Note - FSG have been trying, without luck so far, to sell the club so they can invest in another venture. Plan B would be to sell part of FSG but it is had to see how that would help Liverpool. This has all been explained.}
1.) 07 Mar 2023 10:58:01
Is there no option to sell part of LFC itself Ed?
{Ed002's Note - Liverpool is not a separate entity. And if it were possible, where would the money go?}
2.) 07 Mar 2023 11:23:31
Presumably summer business is being planned without investment in mind. That will mean having to be creative and realistic in the market.
3.) 07 Mar 2023 11:23:31
Presumably summer business is being planned without investment in mind. That will mean having to be creative and realistic in the market.
{Ed002's Note - What do you mean by "investment"?}
4.) 07 Mar 2023 12:05:57
Until FSG either lowers the asking price to a more realistic number or someone decides to over spend, which smart investors won't do, FSG isn't going anywhere. Ed002 has explained over and over that any money that is invested would go directly to FSG and not to Liverpool.
5.) 07 Mar 2023 12:06:15
To the owners as they’re the ones who would be selling the shares, but I think the hope was then they would use some of that freed up capital to invest back into the club.
Sorry Ed I know you don’t like to get into finances, but to clarify then is the only way Liverpool will have significant funds to spend this summer a full sale of the club? Or are loans against future income etc an option. Cause I don’t see how player sales will generate anywhere near enough revenue to cover the cost of the required incomes. Or maybe we as fans just need to lower our expectations for the summer!
{Ed002's Note - Liverpool are still carrying a lot of debt although it dropped around 20% last season. The club could borrow more and the owners can contribute to the pot of money, and any new owners could add funds. The owners may put some of any funds from a partial sale of FSG back in to the club, but they would need to see a return on that investment. Right now they are looking to raise cash for another project and the sale of Liverpool would have covered their contribution. It will rumble on for a while.}
6.) 07 Mar 2023 12:06:44
If was just be Bellingham coming in and a couple of free agents, i'd take that, Bellingham is one of the rare players, who is a get at any cost type player.
7.) 07 Mar 2023 12:25:39
LancasterRed agreed, I think Bellingham and a more defensive midfielder like Kone, and then a Matip replacement would be a great window. Don’t necessarily think we need 3-4 midfielders all at the same time.
8.) 07 Mar 2023 12:31:27
Unless i'm mistaken, both owners of Liverpool and Utd have set very high prices for their respective clubs.
What i don'd understand, is why have Utd at least had offers below asking and we've had none?
Is it a case of, whoever misses out of Utd will then turn their attention to Liverpool?
9.) 07 Mar 2023 12:36:51
If the funds aren’t there for say Gvardiol this window I would like us to hopefully agree a deal for him a season prior to joining (like with Keita) . Stops rivals from signing him and ensures he’s our player.
10.) 07 Mar 2023 12:47:50
I think Mount would be an alternate to Bellingham, not an additional player. Because both clearly play the same No. 8 position (although Mount is played in a more offensive role) . He himself has said he is a No. 8. Caicedo, for me, is out of the picture since his contract renewal. If he wasn't moved after an offer of 70 Million by Arsenal, I don't see how we would pay more, now. I'm not convinced by Nunes, especially when we have Bajcetic and Mount waiting in the wings. I'd rather go for a less "media friendly" player that is flying under the radar, at a lower price. Something that Klopp, and LFC, are known for uncovering.
We do need a CB, given how unreliable Matip and Gomez have become. Gvardiol would be great but then the price would be a new record for us, surely. And I am not sure LFC would go in that direction.
Spending 150 Million on two players could happen, but I don't see 200 Million happening, unless Salah or VVD are moved on. And if Salah is moved on then you have to replace him, because I don't see his immediate replacement in the squad. Elliott is still not ready, if that option is chosen.
11.) 07 Mar 2023 12:21:06
Gotcha, cheers Ed.
12.) 07 Mar 2023 14:48:18
Bellingham is nailed on. Gvardiol to a lesser extent. Do not fret.
13.) 07 Mar 2023 14:52:30
Maybe i am the wrong page, but I recall us breaking the bank for our gk and cb. We'll do it again. Jude is nailed on, it's happening.
14.) 07 Mar 2023 15:02:35
Walkon, those purchases were funded by the Coutinho sale.
15.) 07 Mar 2023 15:09:51
Tielemans of Leicester is available on a free transfer, i have a feeling Jurgen will sell Jones for circa 25 million is that a fair price? and Tielemans will be his replacement as a squad back up.
Locatelli (25) is available for 31 million the european papers quote he plays for the national team Italy, he likes a tackle and at six foot one inch he would be handy at set pieces, corners etc. he plays in the same midfield position as Fabhino.
I predict and hope this is our strongest midfield three for next year Bellingham, Locatelli, Bajcetic ( will be a regular starter next year, and future Liverpool Captain in the not too distant future) .
Please don't confuse Loca Telly for the Scouse football player Nick a Telly!
16.) 07 Mar 2023 15:32:01
Bellingham and Gvardiol would be a great summer. Seen someone post in here a couple days ago, that Frimpong had been looked at. He's a first 11 RB, maybe the dream of a Trent centre mid evolution could be coming true haha.
17.) 07 Mar 2023 15:43:16
If we had the never-ending pit of money that city, Chelsea and utd have. We could sign anyone, most successful club after all ?.
18.) 07 Mar 2023 16:54:10
That midfield needs at least 3 new players don’t let one result change that we need serious improvement to get near the title next season.
19.) 07 Mar 2023 16:58:18
We can’t be for sale. Certain posters have told us numerous times we aren’t and they are always right ?.
{Ed025's Note - well im certainly not buying you JK.. :)
20.) 07 Mar 2023 17:26:20
Ed025 I won on the lottery last week and I’ve told Everton I’ll buy them a new striker. I’ve also said if I win another tenner next week I’ll buy them a new defender as well.
{Ed025's Note - you can get 4 maupays for that JK..
21.) 07 Mar 2023 17:39:04
Ed025 I’d rather 4 Fredo’s mate.
{Ed025's Note - so would i JK..
22.) 07 Mar 2023 19:18:55
I really don’t mind our owners not particularly love them or hate them just don’t mind them
And I’m sure they are fully aware if they are struggling to sell us as is then if they don’t invest (in players) and get us back near the top echelon of the league and Europe their investment will be going down in value anyway so I see it as they have no option but to invest and maybe once they do and if (big if ) somehow propel ourselves to higher level they might get close to what they want .
23.) 07 Mar 2023 22:40:38
Gvardiol needs to be careful, if he “ain’t nailed on” he might fall off.
24.) 08 Mar 2023 03:03:50
Spending £270~320m~ish on 2 playing in Bellingham and Gvardiol seems very very unlikely.
25.) 08 Mar 2023 07:46:11
Bellingham and Gvardiol, absolutely should be looking to sign. Mount and Nunes, absolutely not, neither are good enough and there are better midfielders out there, specially in Mount’s case as he’s terrible in centre midfield as Chelsea have repeatedly seen.
26.) 08 Mar 2023 07:47:43
Another pre-season for our attacking group, couple in and couple out in midfield plus maybe a CB is all I think we need.
27.) 08 Mar 2023 18:30:14
Would Mount move to L4? Can't see a Chelsea boy doing that, although the rumours state that he is not a back up option to Jude and is a serious target.
Gvardiol apparently not available this summer, but worth waiting for.
If Jude joins, surely the other players brought in will be more moneyball/ Robbo to keep things balanced.
28.) 09 Mar 2023 07:58:50
Would he be expected to live in the stadium Spaceman?
{Ed025's Note - he could rent a 2 up 2 down in oakfield rd WDW, £80 a week is well within his remit mate.. :)
01 Feb 2023 09:20:54
Maybe only Ed02 is likely to have insight but has anybody got any idea whether any of the Bellingham talk has anything to it? We keep hearing that Klopp is all-in for Bellingham, that we're putting all of our eggs in the Bellingham basket for the summer (which is also suggested as the explanation for not doing anything in midfield in this window), that "his Dad wants Liverpool", that he idolises Steven Gerrard (not sure how much of a factor that would be anyway), that Henderson and Trent cosied up to him during the World Cup.
But all of that is pretty meaningless if we don't have the money, which will be a massive amount of money, to sign him. He could be absolutely desperate to play for Liverpool but if we haven't got upwards of £100m for a transfer fee and many millions to pay him over his contract, then what's the point of all of the above? It would be rather like me being in desperate need of a new car but rather than go for a sensible option that will do a good job for me now, something that I can afford like a Golf, I'm going to hold off and say that I'm going all-in for a Ferrari in the summer, when there is no chance whatsoever that I'll be able to afford that. In the meantime, my current car will probably fall apart completely and become useless.
{Ed002's Note - Liverpool have a declared interest and have heeded the warning about discussing a transfer with his family. Real Madrid think Dortmund will ask €200M and that is way beyond what they will pay. Chelsea and Manchester City still maintain an interest.}
1.) 01 Feb 2023 09:58:39
We better hope we have new owners by the summer then.
2.) 01 Feb 2023 10:05:04
200 mill!? That’s a crazy amount, though I think he’d be a KDB type signing for us for the next decade, so all in all if true its got to be worth it. If a proper squad could be built around him then i think we’d be laughing.
Even at that price I doubt there’s football fan in the country who wouldn't be envious.
3.) 01 Feb 2023 10:16:09
The price goes up by the day. If both United and Liverpool have new owners in place by then I wouldn't be surprised if €200m is the figure Dortmund slap on him.
I personally think that is insane as good a player as he is.
Hope all the 22/ 23 season trauma is worth it.
4.) 01 Feb 2023 10:27:25
He seems to want to come here and we seem to want him here.
Until he signs then there will always be a chance he will go elsewhere but it seems mostly in the bag doesn’t it.
I really rate him and believe his signing will have the same impact as VVD, Ali and Mo.
5.) 01 Feb 2023 11:04:19
What’s to say Bellingham won’t become another Pogba? I hope we do get him and he’s a success but “putting all your eggs in one basket” and potentially stretching too far financially for one player is a huge risk. VVD wasn’t a risk as he was premier league proven. Younger lads still developing from abroad, though could eventually make huge money selling on, are a big risk!
6.) 01 Feb 2023 11:12:29
It doesn’t seem in the bag at all Mikey. If anything it seems more and more likely that he won’t come here. We’re unlikely to be in the champions league next season barring a miracle, which will have a huge impact on our ability to compete in the transfer market, as our hand to mouth policy is dependent upon that income stream. You also have to consider that City are clearing the decks by selling Cancelo and looking to move on Bernardo Silva and Gundogan they’ll have the funds and room to accommodate him, and can any one seriously say with a straight face that the hot mess we are at the moment is a more attractive proposition than a competitive city side? Besides, our squad needs so much work on it we can’t afford to fix all the problems and buy Bellingham with FSG still at the club any capacity at the club, as minority “investment” isn’t going to find its way into the transfer budget and Bellingham doesn’t fix all the issues we have.
7.) 01 Feb 2023 11:51:10
Reckon I might be the only one who much prefers Matheus Nunes from Wolves instead.
8.) 01 Feb 2023 12:24:36
200m that’s us out.
9.) 01 Feb 2023 12:30:39
BrisbaneLFC I think you're definitely the only one.
10.) 01 Feb 2023 13:04:33
Very odd indeed that Youri Tielemans who is a free agent this June was not the subject of any transfer speculation during the transfer window?
Does that suggest that he is one of JKs ideal players and one he is waiting for? no transfer fee to pay also!
11.) 01 Feb 2023 13:09:07
If this site says its 200m it must be 200m?.
12.) 01 Feb 2023 15:12:44
It won’t be €200mil. That’s like £175mil which is incredibly unrealistic.
Good player, if that’s the fee walk away. Blowing your whole budget on one player is never a good idea!
13.) 01 Feb 2023 16:29:28
Buy him for € 200m when he’s 20 / 21 and sell him for €. 350 / 400 m when he’s 26 / 27. Buy him on a 5 year contract (which is going to be the limit), spread the payments over 5 years - € 40m per year and yes some of the revenue he’ll generate for the club over the 5 years via sponsorships, getting the stadium full and his name on shirts sold and winning PLs and CLs.
The above is a simplistic view because the club budgets for the club, not specifically for individuals but it it a bit more likely a scenario than the view that seems to be implied that we will be sending Ward or his replacement over to Dortmund on the 1st of July with € 200m in cash in a big bag.
14.) 01 Feb 2023 17:12:46
Of course Dortmund can ask what they want. If say PSG want to pay it he probably goes there. Doubt even Jude has made his mind up. All these 'preferred option by player' or 'leading the race' or 'favourites' are media/ gambling jargon to sell. LFC have an interest and will try to agree a fee. If not or the player decides elsewhere we go to the next target. If he joins, add a Rabiot/ Aouar or out of contract player and promote Morton/ Clark. LFC may spend 200 mil euros in total and its a fair outlay. I get fans envy of Chelsea but it doesn't mean FSG or any new owner should do the same.
15.) 01 Feb 2023 17:17:22
Can either moan about the price or moan about another club signing him. Klopp wants him go get him haven't signed a midfieler in 2 years despite needing one all we've heard is bellingham bellingham bellingham. Chelsea showed spending big money can be done.
{Ed025's Note - the problem is OK that the loophole that chelsea have exploited will be closed soon mate..
16.) 01 Feb 2023 18:13:01
Oh dam ed, just when john Henry was about to start throwing around money like a drunk lad in a strip club.
17.) 01 Feb 2023 18:21:13
It won’t be €200 million. That’s just my opinion.
{Ed002's Note - you are right. No doubt Liverpool have a pre-agreement to sign him on the cheap like Fernandez.}
18.) 01 Feb 2023 18:26:09
lampard splashed big. We know what happened there. Again last summer Tuchel spent big. We know what happened there. No guarantees of success just by blindly and outrageously spending. I'd vomit if Liverpool gutted the squad and splurged like Chelsea have. Give us two good mids and a CB who's not injury prone.
19.) 01 Feb 2023 18:32:10
He’s not enough on his own, by summer we’ll need 3 midfielders.
And when the club is £100m down coz we failed to qualify for Europe, Bellingham won’t be bought.
20.) 01 Feb 2023 18:44:00
Ah it will be €200m lads, Madrid THINK that's what there going to ask! They also thought they were signing Mbappe last summer.
21.) 01 Feb 2023 18:31:33
If not eds25 football will go to hell in a handcart. Some people don’t realize how much football will shoot it’s self in in the foot. Hope your well mate.
{Ed025's Note - your spot on ace. Yeah I’m good thanks mate and hope you and yours are my friend..
22.) 01 Feb 2023 19:33:27
Chelsea have just bid 150m pounds and offered JB a 15 year contract.
Another one bites the dust.
{Ed002's Note - Where do Liverpool find idiots like you as fans. Embarrassing over and over again.}
23.) 01 Feb 2023 19:42:14
Not in the slightest No2, just my humble opinion that it won’t be €200 million. That’s allowed I believe ?.
24.) 01 Feb 2023 19:51:21
Ed25 is that loophole where the new owner of a club can basically pump a lot of money into transfers when they first takeover? Is that one being closed mate?
{Ed025's Note - no MR. The one that allows transfer fees to be spread over a large number of years. Like if a player is bought for £70m and the contract is spread over 7 years only £10m is counted each year against FFP regulations. I’m thinking Liverpool would use that strategy to bring Bellingham in in the summer but it looks like things will change on that front mate..
25.) 01 Feb 2023 19:54:56
I am waiting for the enviable, unfortunate amd vile backlash Jude will get if he decides to go else where or Liverpools low ball bid is not accepted. The usual disgusting Twitter racists will be out no doubt. Along with people on here saying he's not worth the money, typical overpriced English player blah blah blah. he's worth every penny of what ever is asked, he's phenomenal.
26.) 01 Feb 2023 20:27:31
Ed02, care to give your opinion on what amount you believe Bellingham will actually go for? I know it's complicated with contract length, agent fees, misc add-ons and whatever else may be involved, but I'm curious to hear what you believe will happen.
{Ed002's Note - Real Madrid will not pay the €200m they expect Borussia Dortmund to ask for the player. It is hard to see the other interested sides meeting any such demand either. But it won’t be cheap, and at perhaps €150M there may be two or three sides willing buyers.}
27.) 01 Feb 2023 20:57:47
Thanks Ed! I don't think 150M is unreasonable considering his age and quality. He seems to be a focused dedicated player, so he'll likely at the very least retain his value well as he ages. Most likely grow in value as the transfer market hasn't given us any indication that it is anywhere near deflating a bit. The main risk is injury, but that goes for anyone. I think there are a lot of reasons why going big on Bellingham isn't as foolish as it may seem. Already has the makings of being one of the best midfielders of his generation.
28.) 01 Feb 2023 21:19:30
That’s some fantastic business from Dortmund. You’ve got to take your hats off to them. Players know if they go to Dortmund it’s a great place to improve and the club won’t stand in their way when the bids come in.
29.) 01 Feb 2023 21:39:52
Redflyer, you have a good coach in charge spending helps. Not spending doesn’t help at all.
30.) 02 Feb 2023 00:30:28
only stupid club will pay €200m for overrated player.
{Ed001's Note - you think he is overrated? Clearly not watched the lad.}
31.) 02 Feb 2023 00:01:38
Wow Ed02, really?
I meant nothing other than a simple joke about Chelsea's long contracts but you clearly missed the attempt of a little humor.
Maybe you shouldn't take everything so damn serious, have you ever thought about that?
I'm starting to see why this site is becoming so toxic lately.
{Ed002's Note - It simply embarrassed yourself and in general the Liverpool supporters - and most of the posts represent a misunderstanding about FFP, "loopholes" and payments for transfers. Thgis is why we avoid discussing any form of finances on the Liverpool page.}
32.) 02 Feb 2023 09:57:35
ed1 - maybe they he is over-rated at 200mil.
regards chelsea, surely they can't just keep adding players surely have to move some players on at some point. instead they're ruining Ziyech's career. I have no idea if this is true, but just parroting what I typically here when Liverpool are linked with multiple players or have failed to move on others.
anyways, thankful the window is closed and we can go back to watching the team's growth.
{Ed001's Note - that isn't a rating, that is a price.}
33.) 03 Feb 2023 07:16:12
My opinion is Bellingham's fee will be slightly more than Coutinho's to Barca. A bargain for an English player right now and I dare say future captain of whichever English club he joins (if not RM)
34.) 04 Feb 2023 00:14:47
I genuinely don’t get what all the fuss is about if I’m being honest. Yeah he looks a talented young player but would the price be so much if he wasn’t English? I don’t think so. Saw a comparison to KDB above. There is none.
{Ed001's Note - I disagree, he is better than De Bruyne was at this age by a long way. He is far more than just an attacking talent as well.}
RR's banter posts with other poster's replies to RR's banter posts
23 Apr 2024 10:24:00
It feels a bit like there are no really obvious candidates for a new manager. Not just from a Liverpool perspective, but if any other big club was looking for a new manager.
Even Alonso - despite his sensational season in Germany - is very early in his managerial career with limited experience.
Big names of a few years ago like Pochettino and Tuchel seem to have suffered damage to their reputations. Mourinho is yesterday's man. The wave of English players ending their playing careers and moving into management has slowed down (and none of them have had success) .
I know it's very data and analytics driven these days and that's different to the traditional approach of getting the biggest name with the best track record but there just doesn't seem to be so many all-time-great/ legend type of managers out there anymore. Maybe Ancelloti is the last of that generation still standing.
Zidane is out there. His track record is incredible because of those consecutive European Cup wins but I feel like it's hard to really judge him.
Klopp and Guardiola are the big silver-back gorillas of the last decade. Obviously neither is an option.
Who else is out there? I still rate Tuchel actually. There was a time when I saw him as a possible Klopp successor.
1.) 23 Apr 2024 10:59:56
Zidane only had success because he had the best squad and the most money. His teams played like a BTEC Simeone team, and if that’s the way we want to go, we might as well get Simeone as at least he can speak English and isn’t a personality vacuum, unlike Zidane.
As for Tuchel, he’s a serial failure, has failed in every job he’s ever had. Somehow manages to upset his players, tactically negative and one dimensional and he simply isn’t good enough or charismatic enough for the job. He’d be sacked in 18 months and be as popular as Hodgson.
I’m not hopeful that we’re going to employ anyone remotely competent given that names like Fonseca and Kovac are seriously in contention for the job.
2.) 23 Apr 2024 11:06:16
The more I think about it, the more I appreciate Emery as an outstanding manager. I very much doubt he'll leave villa this season, but his record of success is underappreciated I think.
I like look of Amorim, Slot, Will Still, the Porto guy who's name I can't spell, Terzic, Rose, Farioli and Hoenes as young, up and coming managers.
And Ten Hag.
{Ed001's Note - Emery is brilliant with no pressure, the minute there is pressure on him, then his teams' struggle. Perfect for a team like Villa, for now at least, but not ideal for a team which expects to challenge for trophies.}
3.) 23 Apr 2024 12:33:15
I think Marco Rose is someone who would be a safe option and hasn't been mentioned much yet. He has never stunk the place out at any of his jobs. He played under Klopp at Mainz, did good jobs at Salzburg and Gladbach, was unlucky to be sacked at Dortmund (they were 2nd) and has done fine at Leipzig (including winning the DFB Pokal) . I think the Dortmund and Leipzig jobs are harder than people realise as you're losing your best players every single year. He has a proven track-record developing young players and he plays pressing, energetic football.
{Ed002's Note - Marco Rose is not joining Liverpool.}
4.) 23 Apr 2024 12:56:36
Viktor: I wouldn't argue that Tuchel is a serial winner or the best manager around or anything like that, and I don't have a strong feeling that I would want him at Liverpool, but I don't think "serial failure" is an accurate representation, depending on how you measure success and failure.
Since 2016 he has won domestic cups in France and Germany, league titles in France and Germany, and the European Cup, European Super Cup and Club World Cup with Chelsea. The argument against that would be that any manager can win in France with PSG and with Bayern in Germany (he did also win the cup in Germany with Dortmund) but when we won the European Cup, Super Cup and Club World Cup in the same year under Klopp we hailed it as greatness. Tuchel did exactly the same.
5.) 23 Apr 2024 13:04:46
And that, Babbity is what makes Klopp so special. He broke that stranglehold that Bayern have. Which is why Alonso, Anorim and Slot stand out, because they’ve taken clubs who hadn’t won for a period of time, built them up, developed a style, won a title and in Slot and Amorim’s maintained them at the top. Slot was unlucky that C.V. hit as AZ were competing to win the title against Ajax and were level pegging when it was cancelled. There is a reason they’re the best candidates.
6.) 23 Apr 2024 13:30:17
RR, I would say that Tuchel is a serial failure. Sacked by Chelsea, sacked by PSG and Bayern have said thanks but no thanks, at all those clubs he had almost unlimited resources but they were all absolutely terrible to watch. His “achievement” at Chelsea was meaningless as Klopp could have done the same with that squad and those resources, but Tuchel with our resources couldn’t because he has to have unlimited funds to be remotely effective, this has been shown repeatedly, how many league titles at Dortmund?
The league titles he won were one horse races. Even Nico Kovac won a league title in Germany with Bayern and he’s absolutely hopeless too. If Tuchel was as good as you think he is RR, he’d have won the title at a cantor this year. He’s second rate at best, nothing but a journeyman failure.
Quite frankly that man has no business at Anfield and isn’t welcome.
7.) 23 Apr 2024 14:06:10
@VV - you don’t speak for everybody within the club or those that support the club. Your last sentence speaks volumes about you.
8.) 23 Apr 2024 14:47:52
Tuchel is toxic as heck, man. And the footie he plays is or can be a bit dire to watch. Us getting him would smack of absolute desperation, IMO so I hope we stay well away from him.
As for who is out there, there aren't any very good to great options out there so at the end of the day, we will prolly get the best of a pretty lean bunch.
9.) 23 Apr 2024 15:05:22
Please no Simeone for LFC. we can have anyone else. it doesn't matter
his teams are the worst lot ever. esp AM and their style of play.
10.) 23 Apr 2024 15:09:44
Some of us have higher standards than others, WDW, I expect you’d be happy if we employed Roy Hodgson or Brendan Rodgers again.
Tuchel is not of the required standard, definitely not of the required character and the fact he’s an ex Chelsea manager alone should remove him from list as he doesn’t fit the ethos of the club. Same goes for Mourinho.
11.) 23 Apr 2024 15:25:24
I'm with VV on this. Tuchel would be bad choice as manager. Has shown to be extremely average and his team always plays dire football. It's no wonder that Bayern wants rid of him as well. He should definitely be doing better with them given the resources they have but being second by a long way just shows how limited he is. He did win trophies at Chelsea though but the football was terrible under him. Also has shown to be combative and not a pleasant person to work with. We'll just be setting ourselves back if we appoint him.
12.) 23 Apr 2024 15:53:19
I think Alonso was the stand out Fans choice and then it was Amorim.
So its pretty clear that certain sections of the fan base are going to end up upset or not happy when the mystery person is eventually announced.
After all Edwards has been quoted as saying they will go for a brave choice over a popular one.
13.) 23 Apr 2024 16:11:07
I don't think anyone coming from the Portuguese or Dutch leagues is a safe option, Viktor. They made AVB and Ten Hag look like geniuses. De Boer and van Bronckhurst also killed it in the Eredivisie. Even Steve McLaren won the title with Twente for the first and only time in their history. Unless they do something truly special like Mourinho winning the Champions League with Porto, it is always a massive risk.
14.) 23 Apr 2024 18:03:09
With VV, as well. Tuchel is absolute poison.
15.) 23 Apr 2024 18:04:37
VV - I don't have a strong view on Tuchel as Liverpool manager. Just saying I still rate him, which is just an opinion. And I'm not sure how you get to "if Tuchel was as good as you think he is", when I haven't expressed an opinion on how good I think he is.
My main point was to query your absurd, in my opinion, assertion that a manager who has won at least one trophy at every one of the clubs he has worked at, including league titles in two different countries plus a European Cup, is a "serial failure". The point about it being easy to win the league title with PSG or Bayern is valid but, again, that doesn't equate to serial failure. And whilst Bayern won't win the league this season due to a once-in-a-lifetime brilliant season by Alonso's Leverkusen, remember that Bayern are still in the Champions League semi finals having knocked out the team that is top of the Premier League. Even if you don't like Tuchel the person or think he has a track record for falling out with clubs - which if true is a good reason not to want him as manager - labelling him a serial failure is not credible.
18 Apr 2024 10:23:58
Not much evidence lately to suggest that we're capable of doing this, but I am going to say that if we win our next three matches (Fulham away, Everton away, West Ham home), we'll be top by the end of April.
Significant point to note is that City would have a match in hand at that point but Arsenal now have Wolves away, Chelsea at home and Tottenham away. That's a tricky run on the back of two defeats and a draw in their last three matches; I reckon they will slip up somewhere there.
1.) 18 Apr 2024 10:40:20
RR - I think the West Ham game is also away, so 4 away games on the trot - very difficult to get maximum points from those. In fact, I think we have the toughest run in of the top 3.
The one for me is Everton, because I can see them turning us over next week, especially if we play like we have in the past 3 games.
2.) 18 Apr 2024 10:47:42
RR, West Ham is away.
3.) 18 Apr 2024 11:02:45
Villa away is also tough. They're going for top 4. I just fear that even if we win all of our 6 games, which is a massive ask, we will still fall short. That's why losing to Palace was gutting.
4.) 18 Apr 2024 11:59:29
Not beating United. Drawing with all the top 4 sides. drawing with Luton and countless others.
5.) 18 Apr 2024 12:20:49
I can't see us winning many of them unfortunetly. it feels like that that time we lost six in a row. We look dead oN our legs.
6.) 18 Apr 2024 12:22:29
Love the optimism lads but it's done now I'm afraid, the United game was always going to be the one and for whatever reason we blew it. Maybe it's Klopps bizarre choice to go back to slow down Pep ball, or the fact the forwards couldn't finish. Same with the Palace game and that was the final nail.
Still been a very good season with an entire new midfield and to win the cup with the kids shouldn't be scoffed at.
But once again City are too strong, now u could point to the VAR in the Spurs game, not getting pretty blatant penalties against Arsenal or City but lifes too short.
Fingers crossed for a minor miracle tonight in Italy, the team is capable of it but as he's already admitted I'm not sure the manager is anymore.
7.) 18 Apr 2024 12:23:36
I'm worried about Fulham away. They always seem to give us a game. In our last 6 games against them we've only won 3, drawn 2 and lost 1.
8.) 18 Apr 2024 12:42:26
In some ways I was hoping that city would win last night but now they only have the league to really focus on I don't expect them to mess up. Very frustrating but I still think we've done brilliantly to keep on their heels. We really are just a consistent striker short this season, needs to be addressed. Hopefully new tactics might resolve that under a new manager either that or we can unearth another Salah-like gem from somewhere!
Different topic, I wonder if the likes of Madrid would still be interested in Haaland given his all round contribution this season. My guess would be no.
9.) 18 Apr 2024 12:53:47
I love how when things go wrong for us Pep gets the blame, though no one was praising him when we were winning every week. The only person to blame for tactics is Klopp.
10.) 18 Apr 2024 13:04:56
Time for Klopp to let the brakes off and full throttle heavy metal football again geothermal full backs rampaging down the flanks for width and bin the hybrid full back role for good
Up the pool.
11.) 18 Apr 2024 13:21:32
Geothermal full backs? That may well be an autocorrect issue but I love it! ?.
12.) 18 Apr 2024 13:28:21
Have people seen how majority of teams are setting up to play against us.
Its extremely hard to play heavy metal rampaging football when the opposition put 11 men behind the ball in 30 yards of space and you've got 75% plus possession.
City and Chelsea didn't at Anfield and both nights we looked exceptional. Then we go up against a Sheff utd and Palace and look a different team.
13.) 18 Apr 2024 13:37:34
Jesus lads, wouldn’t want some of you boys in the trenches ?. I know it’s difficult and we’re going to need a degree of luck but let’s not chuck in the towel yet ?♂️. Anyway, ebbed if we can’t win I still want that second spot ?.
14.) 18 Apr 2024 13:39:17
Wishful thinking I'm afraid mate, we're not winning the league, we can hope but it's not happening and we all know it.
I just wish to Christ tactics would be changed but that's not going to happen. We're pretty doomed this season. Gutted but there's more important things in life. We move on.
15.) 18 Apr 2024 14:08:04
No! Salah not u too, you're the king of positivity on here. Don't listen to me I'm just a cynical grump haha.
There is always hope, maybe just a fools hope.
16.) 18 Apr 2024 14:45:16
I’m not saying that we’ll win or not, but, we have been to Atalanta in a Champions League game at their place and pumped them for five goals with no response in recent memory. So it’s entirely plausible that we can do it again. We’ve nothing to lose but going for the jugular.
17.) 18 Apr 2024 17:00:32
I can’t see where our next Goal comes from never mind Win ?
On a serious note I hope we give it a good crack tonight.
18.) 18 Apr 2024 17:15:03
I agree with jk23. We have always struggled against teams with 11 men behind the ball. ( wasn’t that the reason we got Thiago? To unlock defences ) there is not a team out there I’m wary of we have had a wobble and most of you are saying it’s game over, klopps finished he has run his course . Think you need to remember he turned us from doubters to believers. In klopp we trust.
19.) 18 Apr 2024 17:38:36
AAR91, there's a method in my madness mate lol I'm always wrong so if I say we won't win it, we probably will :) - we can hope mate.
20.) 18 Apr 2024 18:04:00
That's a good point, JK. We can't press teams that don't have the ball. But when we have it we need to move it quicker, use more of the pitch and try and pull teams out of their shape. When Salah, Diaz, Gakpo cut inside- without a fullback overlapping- it does my head in.
It's the same with players having an extra touch or look when we are building attacks.
I think we've also suffered because the front three have been weaker with their backs to goal. Diaz is no Mane, Salah has been injured and out of sorts and it's not what Nunez is good at. Nunez is a big lad and his hold up and link up play does need to improve.
21.) 18 Apr 2024 22:01:22
we would struggle to win a raffle.
Klopps clearly checked out mentally, no way a teams form could turn this bad, we've fallen off a cliff.
It's like they've given up.
22.) 18 Apr 2024 22:07:01
Excellent support. Just may as well not bother playing the remainder of our games.
Do any of you even go the match?
23.) 18 Apr 2024 22:21:36
Secure top 4.
If you win the league - brilliant - but others would have to capitulate.
24.) 18 Apr 2024 22:21:50
Have you watched the games cooler? Or do you think anything that's been said is unjustified?
Or do you think it's the forum that's causing us to not be able to pass the ball in the final 3rd?
25.) 18 Apr 2024 22:37:47
Don’t forget the flag protest Dean.
26.) 18 Apr 2024 22:57:19
I am more confident now Salah, ha. I had just about given up.
27.) 18 Apr 2024 23:20:10
We won the game. Not by enough goals, but it’s a scruffy win hopefully it builds some momentum for last few games.
28.) 19 Apr 2024 00:26:43
Looking forward to seeing a new manager and a new system to be honest.
29.) 19 Apr 2024 05:58:19
Taking off my red tinted glasses and based on the way we are playing, I think we finish third or 2nd at best, we aren’t playing great atm or for a while now .
Loved to be proved wrong but I don’t think I will be.
30.) 19 Apr 2024 07:05:27
What are the odds for us to misss out on Top4. 6 games to go. 11 behind spurs, 8 behind Villa. 4 away games. I can't see us winning anything tbh.
31.) 19 Apr 2024 07:31:24
Sadly I'm a bit worried about top4, we could realistically drop a lot of points if these performances continue.
I thought we had a bit of chance for 2 trophies this year, now we have to worry about CL places.
32.) 19 Apr 2024 09:31:05
That is what's concerning me dean, if we continue playing like this we won't win an arguement, imagine if we didn't get top 4? that'd be disastrous.
33.) 19 Apr 2024 09:50:20
Unfortunately we just don’t have enough players playing well. Mac carried us for a good while, but he needs others around him to contribute. If Klopp goes for the same starting midfielders we will drop even more points.
34.) 19 Apr 2024 10:40:51
realistically spurs are 11 points behind, so even with a few expected losses, i would really hope we can be awful and still get top 4.
Otherwise that would be disaster!
35.) 19 Apr 2024 13:03:51
I called it after the FACup debacle.
We wouldn’t win anything else and we’d be in a battle for top 4.
Got loads of abuse for it. ?♂️.
36.) 19 Apr 2024 23:05:59
And deservedly so with statements like that.
37.) 20 Apr 2024 06:25:25
The truth hurts eh John?
12 Apr 2024 10:36:44
Last night had been coming. I think you've got to go back to mid Feb and the back to back 4-1 wins over Luton and Brentford to find a match where we looked really convincing. Since then we've been limping along, still winning most of our matches but scraping through unconvincingly in my opinion. A bit fortunate to get past Brighton 2-1 at home. Really unimpressive and leaving it late against Sheff Utd (worst team in the league) at home. Scraping a point with a late equaliser against an absymal Manchester Utd.
If last night doesn't act as the reset to ignite a change for the rest of the season, I think it will be over pretty soon. Fortunately, our next match is arguably the "easiest" of our remaining seven league matches so provides an opportunity to change course and start a charge. If we don't turn up and win with a convincing performance on Sunday against Palace, sadly I think it will be the beginning of the end.
Klopp faces some tricky decisions now. Many players have dropped away at the same time. Gomez is looking more like the old Gomez who always made me nervous. Endo has had a couple of consecutive shockers. Szoboszlai looks a million miles from the player we saw at the start of the season. Salah has been largely anonymous for the last three matches. Critical individual errors are creeping in (Quansah, Kelleher and Szoboszlai all leading to goals in the last two matches) . So the fact we have players returning from injury is timely. However, not many players can come straight back in and be sharp and at their best straight away. Jones last night didn't look sharp and that's fair after a long break. Trent has historically needed several matches to get up and running. We don't have that luxury. Jota actually looked pretty sharp when he came on and he is the one who I think can make an impact straight away. And the other small positive from last night was that Gakpo was looking better again.
1.) 12 Apr 2024 11:00:46
I thought Jota looked really sloppy when he came on to be honest.
I think the injury crisis has finally caught up with us though, too many look either knackered from playing too much and not being rotated or slow because they are coming back from injury.
Hopefully we discover a bit of form in the next one and the blip is short lived.
2.) 12 Apr 2024 11:07:41
What a low point last nights game was. You can’t even single out one player as they all were collectively bad, maybe besides Gakpo who was okay at best. In regards to Klopp. He has been making some bizarre decisions of late. I and a number of other said before on here that going strong in a dead rubber against Sparta when we had United a few days later was baffling from Klopp. But it’s even more baffling now that in a quarter final tie he has fielded a weakened side. I mean, I would love to know his thought process behind that. Because to me it stinks of either incompetence or arrogance. I’m going with the latter, in that Klopp thought we had won the game before it had been played. Which amongst other things explains our poor and quite frankly inexplicable first half performances for most of this season.
That mentality starts from the manager and filters through to the players. But the players have to also take responsibility, because there is a thing called pride and ownership, which has been lacking of late. What also looked worrying from last night was the fact Klopp appeared lost on the side lines and completely out of any ideas on how to turn the game around. We were out smarted tactically, which is not the first time us saying that this season. And those second half late winners that have been masking a lot, weren’t there to save us. Again, whilst many were shouting “mentality monsters” after those late winning performances this season. Many of us were saying that playing poorly and relying on individual moments to save us was not sustainable and the results don’t really tell the full picture.
Another thing I have noticed and could be wrong is how the players appear. Since Klopp announced he was leaving there has been a shift in energy from the players and it’s seemingly noticeable. I keep hearing we are just exhausted and using that as an excuse. What about Arsenal and City? Have they not played just as many games? The players look disinterested and unmotivated is what it is, and that is really concerning. It can’t be coincidence it coincided with Klopp announcing he is leaving a few months back. Late second half winners masked it but it has been evident. It’s almost like Klopp doesn’t hold that fear factor anymore. When you’re in a job and you’re either leaving or you know the manager is going. Naturally you lose some drive. But the number of players that appear to have done that and the level in which it appears to have happened is alarming. Some of the players are probably thinking - I worked so hard and have the trust of this manager and now he is upping sticks and leaving and I have to win the trust of a new manager who might ship me out as soon as he arrives.
Don’t know what the right answer is in when Klopp should have announced his departure. Maybe should have gone last summer instead of announcing in January of all times. However, even prior to his announcement we hadn’t been playing well. But the announcement completely messed up any type of momentum we did or could have had in the title run in. Dare I say it, but it’s almost like some of the players ain’t really listening to him anymore and that’s a major component of Klopp’s success. Now, is it so us to go to Atalanta and out of nowhere beat them 4-0. The answer would be yes. But is it so us to do that then get beaten a few days later in the league against Fulham. The answer would also be yes. So sad to see us finishing this season like this and if we only win the Carabao Cup, this season has been a disaster!
3.) 12 Apr 2024 11:14:14
I thought Jota looked sharp last night.
He misplaced one sloppy pass into touch but he was one of few who seemed to have energy.
4.) 12 Apr 2024 11:20:12
I personally don't get this 'players looked knackered' remark. Yes, they have layed a lot football, but so have all the other top teams in Europe. We also have probably one of, if not the, strongest squads in terms of depth. Players have been rotated and rested throughout the season as well. Performances last night can't be put down to tiredness when most of the team haven't been regular starters.
It was just shambolic, probably the worst performance I have seen in a very long time. How tsimikas is still an LFC player I don't know. The first few minutes he was in acres of space and put a cross in that sailed over everyone and went out for a goal kick. I knew then it was going to be a long night!
{Ed001's Note - that moment set the tone of the night for me.}
5.) 12 Apr 2024 11:33:58
I don't think this season will be a disaster no matter what happens. Champions league football is all bug secured, we won a cup and we brought some talented players into the club and promoted some very important youth players. It would not be a fairytale ending but still a good season in my eyes from where we were last season.
That said, these Liverpool players and coaching staff only no one way. The hard way. We're not done yet.
Like a wise genius posted on the match posts
"Warriiiooors, come out to play"
6.) 12 Apr 2024 11:35:16
I do wonder whether the last 5/ 6 fixtures being very tactical clashes have also contributed to the loss of form.
The games against City, Brighton, United x2 and now Atalanta have been against teams where we have had to adjust the way we play.
Have we overthinked (is that a word? ) our way out of form?
7.) 12 Apr 2024 11:50:18
It was a very bad night no denying that but it doesn’t happen often so let’s not forget how far Klopp has brought us
Up the pool.
8.) 12 Apr 2024 12:09:08
@Coulred. Two things can be true. He will go down as a legend regardless. There is no two ways about it. But, Klopp has made a lot of blunders this season and is not above criticism. Again, the players have to take responsibility in that as well, not just Klopp. Despite all that that we still have time to turn it around by beating Atalanta in the second tie and winning the league.
One things for sure is that we cannot let the season fizzle out on a whimper with just the Carabao Cup. Many laughed at United for having a similar season not long ago and it could happen to us. Despite Klopp annoying me a lot of late with a number of bizarre decisions, he still deserves the best send off possible for all he has done for us. And winning the league and Europa would be the perfect way to do that.
9.) 12 Apr 2024 12:51:19
These lot get a new manager they are in for a shock, kostas and gomez straight out the door for me, had enough of Joe he's bang average. Reminds me of Phil jones. Gravenberch was a bad signing. And give Trent the captaincy or even salah but not virg.
10.) 12 Apr 2024 14:19:40
That was as bad as it could get this season on a collective level. As Ed said, Tsimikas’s wayward play set the tone from the off. Individual mistakes all over the shop, poor decision making, etc. You name it, it was on show. For me, no point singling out this or that player. It was what the French call, a “Collective Wreckage” from top to bottom. I’ve already moved on.
09 Apr 2024 10:18:49
Just heard an astonishing stat. In the two league matches against Manchester Utd (forget about the cup match where they were also abysmal but somehow we gave them four goals), we had 62 efforts on goal. That is a record for any team against any other single team in a season. And yet we scored just two goals across those approx 200 minutes.
Those stats will include a lot of long range or wild speculative shots. This in itself is problematic in
my opinion and talks to a scenario where a team is dominating but is unable to create really good chances (and misses the good ones) . I don't want to see another Gomez shot on goal this season; for a player who is regularly afforded so much space and time to move infield from left back, I find it incredible that he can't even hit the target. Surely he would practice and practice knowing he would be getting all these chances to shoot.
There seems to be some consensus that getting Jota back will be a big positive. I reckon he'd be going a goal a game and our top scorer if he hadn't been out for so long. On a lighter note, I never understood all of the Diogo "he contributes nothing other than goals" Jota criticism. Glad that the penny has dropped.
In the meantime, I would have our forwards + Szoboszlai doing additional training just working on 5 v 3 or 4 v 2 breaks against the reserves or youth defenders. Over and over and over again. Our execution in those situations has been shambolic. The wrong choice or wrong execution every time. Make them practice it until at least 9 out of 10 ends up in a goal. Look online and find the compilation of how many we've messed it up this season.
1.) 09 Apr 2024 10:47:52
My favourite ones on Jota are “he stinks up the place and shouldn’t start games and then also he’s our most clinical finisher and we miss him”
Those gems came from the same poster.
2.) 09 Apr 2024 11:03:47
I think Szobo has had a great first season so far but feels like he needs a break having been out injured for a while. Elliot to start in his position for the next game I'd say.
Similar for Bradley - been fantastic but I reckon get Robbo back on the left and shift Gomez over to the right untill TAA is ready to return.
And no, this isn't me slating the players, just think that a little shake-up is needed which might help get us over the line!
3.) 09 Apr 2024 11:07:26
I think some of it may be because our current group of forwards (Diaz, Gakpo, Jota, Nunez and Salah) have not spent enough time with each other in actual match time. We don't have a solid trio upfront in the same way that we used to field Mane, Firmino and Salah in their heyday. Remember how the media and the fans used to say "those 3 could find each other on the field with eyes blindfolded"? This season Diaz has been injured and affected by family circumstances, so in and out of the team. Gakpo has been benched very often. Jota has been injured, so in and out as well. Nunez has been in and out also. And Salah has probably had the longest time out of the team with injury, in his career with us. Then there is the fact that, aside from Salah and Diaz, Klopp has had Jota, Gakpo and Nunez shuffling back and forth between LW and CF all season long. It has positives but the major negative is that a player isn't given the chance to develop cosistency.
I also think Salah, Firmino, Mane, Origi and Minamino were a better skilled attack corp than the current one of Salah, Nunez, Jota, Gakpo and Diaz. Salah, Firmino and Mane were a phenomenal trio; history may show that they were possibly our best trio ever.
{Ed001's Note - I think we really could have done with Taki this season. I have no idea why Klopp barely played him as he always did well for us and was a goal threat. He is showing in France how potent he can be when given a run. I really liked Taki. He would run himself into the ground, not sure why Klopp didn't like him.}
4.) 09 Apr 2024 13:07:39
Ed001 call me cynical but I think taki was assigning to appeal to certain markets given he was so cheap.
Can't think of any other reason the club would buy him and not play him.
{Ed001's Note - I would say it is more likely that his personality was not the kind Klopp likes. He wants players to be forceful and full of belief in themselves. Taki is quiet and unassuming. Klopp wants them to be more brash I think.}
5.) 09 Apr 2024 16:47:03
Ed001, fully agree on Taki; I liked him very much. And really think that he would have thrived if he had gotten the same number of opportunities that Gakpo has gotten and has been getting (I'm referring to Gakpo being 5th choice, like Taki, and not specifically the positions they played) . We live in a time where all players love the limelight and the tv cameras on them; loving the public adulation; courting all the attention possible. Minamino's personality did not gel with that kind of ethos. I still remember the players forcingTaki to celebrate the UCL win with the fans in the stands.
I could never figure out why Klopp didn't play him more. I'd take a shy, timid and unassuming player who doesn't sky every shot he gets in front of goal, over a brash and confident player skying chance after chance in an important game, any day of the week. ?.
{Ed001's Note - me too, Taki was a quality player who worked hard no matter where he was playing. There was never any whining in the press, just got on with it. And he scored goals.}
6.) 09 Apr 2024 18:55:53
Aray “We live in a time where all players love the limelight and the tv cameras on them; loving the public adulation; courting all the attention possible”
Does that some any of our current squad up?
7.) 09 Apr 2024 19:28:47
Sorry Aray that’s probably come across Aggressive.
Meant as in do you believe that sums up any of our current squad. Personally I don’t see it so interested in your opinion if you do and which players.
8.) 09 Apr 2024 20:08:40
JK23, I was the one who said that he stinks up the joint apart from scoring and I was not the only one saying it. Even the Ed’s on their podcasts used to say that and Ed01 wanted him sold and said so on multiple occasions about 2/ 3 years ago.
In fact, many on here were saying he should be sold should Newcastle bid for him as it was rumoured at the time and I didn’t even want him sold cos yes, he is the most natural finisher we have and that is still the case. That did not remove from the fact that the guy used to play as if he had never seen a football before as he was SO poor on the ball back then 2 seasons ago.
This season, his all round game has improved massively and he is a much better and well rounded footballer and I’m all for that. Listen if you’re going to spout stuff about people then first off, say the name of who said what and don’t be a coward. Secondly, tell the whole truth rather than peddle half truths and lies just to sound funny, something you are relentlessly poor at cos you fail to realise that comedy is not and will never be your strength.
9.) 09 Apr 2024 20:20:44
Loved Taki to death when he was here. Shane it didn’t work out for him but to me, that had nothing to do with his talent and overall ability. Klopp messed him about and even he admitted it in public.
10.) 09 Apr 2024 20:41:24
Oil why so triggered. Not everything is about you.
Get yourself to an actual game of football and give your keyboard and wifi a rest.
You follow Liverpool like my mrs follows Eastenders.
I’ll try and do better with my banter. Maybe one day I’ll hit your levels and call Utds manager Seven Haag #topbants.
11.) 10 Apr 2024 11:21:28
JK23, I wasn't thinking of LFC or any of our players, when I wrote what you quoted. I was referring to professional footballers in general, within our current digital age in the entire range of sports and athletics where the emphasis is very much on sound bites and visuals or videos of players before and after events.
Lately, I have been seeing a lot of Van Dijk giving post match interviews. It's absolutely natural given that he is the Captain. The media seek him out, I'm sure, and he accepts to participate, too. And I'm also sure he likes it. To my mind, Taki my wouldn't like it or do it. That was my point.
12.) 10 Apr 2024 13:45:55
Cheers for the reply Aray. I kind of gathered that.
In fairness I’d say there’s actually less top level footballers in the limelight than there is out of it.
Just looking at the top 3 sides and apart from Grealish, Foden and Walker I can’t really pinpoint anyone else from City or even arsenal.
20 Mar 2024 09:01:47
That PGMOL audio and Howard Webb explanation for the Doku/ Mac Allister penalty incident is farcical. For a start, in the audio what they're saying is not a reflection of anything that is happening on the screen. It was like they were watching another incident. They said:
"Both high": They weren't; Mac Allister has two feet on the floor and controls the ball on his chest. Not high at any point, not even foot off the floor at any point. On the other hand, Doku is genuinely high. He is jumping with both feet off the floor and the highest of his feet is chest high on a player who is standing upright. Also studs up.
Mac Allister "comes into his space" - what does that even mean? Since when has "coming into his space" been a thing in football? Closing down and tackling is one of the fundamentals of the sport.
Doku "touches it first" - he doesn't. To the on field referee I could see how it might have appeared that way but when you slow it down and look at the replays that VAR were watching, you see that the first touch was Mac Allister's.
Doku "plays the ball" - he gets a very slight touch on it, out of control off his shin, after it's come off Mac Allister's chest and a split second before his studs go into Mac Allister. Anyway, we've been told all season - as explanation for various red cards - that contact on the ball doesn't mean it can't be a foul.
And then Webb repeats it all on TV with all his BS and trained hand gestures, like the David Brent of refereeing. It's astonishing.
In fact, if you were to play that VAR audio over the Gomez/ wan Bissaka incident from Sunday (foul and yellow card against Gomez) it would fit a lot better. High bouncing ball, both come in slightly high (but actually not as high as Doku was on Mac Allister), Gomez gets the ball (more contact on the ball that Doku made) and is just about first to it but his follow through hits wan Bissaka's foot (which is just as high as Gomez) . And if that was a foul and a yellow card, whilst Doku on Mac Allister is not given, that says it all.
I reckon PGMOL are in a position now where they just can't admit any further pivotal errors that go against Liverpool. They are already facing the potential of two binary/ black and white errors that they have admitted (Diaz v Tottenham and Odegaard handball) costing Liverpool the league title and the storm there would be around that. They must be desperate for one team to run away and win it by a comfortable margin.
1.) 20 Mar 2024 10:19:03
Agree with every word, especially the last part.
2.) 20 Mar 2024 10:59:40
Just when you think they cannot be more ridiculous, Webb turns up with that insane position. Honestly, I really really hope that we win no20 and Klopp says what he thinks about PGMOL before he bows out.
3.) 20 Mar 2024 11:09:17
RR, you had to guess that Webbo had to go out there and speak with all 20 sides of his mouth to protect his boy or the so-called "Best Referee in England", NONE of which is actually true, btw.
So look at it this way. Webbo has come out to apologize to LFC on both the Diaz thingy and the Steph Curry or sorry, Odegaard incident, right? Do you really think he was going to go out there to give us a THIRD apology? Also, Webbo threw Oliver under the bus when he came out to apologise to Arsenal saying Oliver influenced the outcome of the game when he did not correctly send Kovacic off for a clear, second bookable offence. Do you really think he was going to throw Oliver under the bus a second time? Let's be real here.
And here is how you know Webbo is full of it (shocking, I know) . He says that the ref Oliver (who couldn't have seen the incident clearly as he was behind the play) was correct to not give it and that VAR was right not to intervene. But then with another one of the 20 sides of his mouth, he said that had Oliver given the pen, VAR would NOT have intervened either? Sorry, that makes NO sense as this is NOT a subjective ruling, as he says.
Why? Cos there is actually a RULE that explains what should happen in this instance of dangerous play with a high boot. Notice, Webbo does not talk about this rule cos it doesn't fit the rhetoric of defending the cartel. We're being gas-lit, mate. It is what it is.
4.) 20 Mar 2024 11:37:19
Agree with all of that RR and I will add that if you listen to what Webb says he actually contradicts himself and virtually admits that Oliver needed help from VAR which he didn’t get. He says:
"It's a massive game, so as a referee, you just want clarity and certainty that you're making the right decision. You don't always have sufficient information that you're making the right decision. You need that on big moments in and around the penalty area. “
Then in the very next sentence he says this:
“Michael didn't have certainty in this situation but VAR didn't have any clear and obvious evidence to overturn the on-field decision. ”
So what is VAR there for if not to give the referee certainty in his decision? Webb is trying to say that VAR followed the correct protocol but is also saying that the ref wasn’t sure. So why didn’t VAR send the ref to have a look to give him the certainty that he didn’t have?
The whole thing stinks to high heaven and the pathetic cover up by Webb is even worse.
Webb and his cronies are the most corrupt organisation in football and that is saying something.
5.) 20 Mar 2024 11:58:46
Absolutely no point of this programme with someone like Michael Owen presenting either, has to be someone who won't let Webb waffle his way out of things.
6.) 20 Mar 2024 12:34:05
This web fella was a police officer. I would not trust this person as far as i could throw him. It is time for him to be sacked along with other referees who follow his instructions and i mean now.
7.) 20 Mar 2024 12:44:48
@Beckers, Webbo already told you what VAR is for in his last apology tour. He said that VAR works hard to "corroborate" whatever decision (right or wrong), lack of inconsistency and blatant incompetence or otherwise, that the on-pitch referee engages in when it's time to make decisions esp. in big games. That is exactly what has happened here, for the upteenth time. Protecting the ref. establishment is the point of VAR, essentially.
Look, he was never going to throw Oliver under the bus even tho, he threw both he and the VAR guy under the bus based on his actual quotes. What I don't get is as you say, the more he spoke to appease everyone and still stick up for his bros., the more contradictory and full of it he appeared. The cover-up didn't work and has NEVER worked we see thru it easily.
And you know what else is funny? It just so happens that for the 3 times we have been screwed that the PGMOL have come out to address, City and Arsenal have benefited from these screw-ups directly and that's not counting the ones they did not come out to address directly. I know, it stinks.
8.) 20 Mar 2024 19:22:31
Let’s get to the basic bottom line- and criticise me for repeating myself
I’ve said it since it came in
VAR is being used to manufacture results
There can be no other reason for the number of shocking decisions or non-decisions made.
9.) 20 Mar 2024 21:06:31
100% agree with everything above, where i do differ ( maybe naively) is the agenda against Liverpool. many teams have been at the wrong end of dodgy officiating and Webb is doing nothing more than protecting his mates ( we know this is engrained in the PGMOL) let’s not forget Mike Deans personal admission which Howard Webb tried to say was wrong, again Webb tried to say that Mike Deans own personal account of events and his own actions were wrong!
The PGMOL are rotten to the core and only concerned with self preservation, not match fixing or grand conspiracy they are simply inept.
VAR is the scourge of the modern game but cannot be scrapped because that would only lead to worse decisions. VAR needs to be stripped to its simplest form, the ref, a monitor and the captains who can request a review. Watch rugby’s VAR in use, the players go to the ref and say ‘ I think there was a high tackle on x’ the ref looks at the screen and makes the decision, no ego involved, the refs want to be correct and anonymous above all else. For those who think Rugby is slower and the game is stopped a lot more etc have a look at all the rules that are involved in rugby and how complex they are, look how many players are involved in a phase of play, we are talking tiny tiny details, honestly when you compare the complexities of both games football is a simple game made complicated so there is no reason for this to be time consuming.
Finally, let’s get refs out of the spotlight and out of the tv studios, they are not the stars and are taking over every bit of punditry.
{Ed001's Note - just to point out that what you have said is grand conspiracy. It might not be grand conspiracy to harm one club above others, but it is conspiracy to cover up mistakes made by their group.}
10.) 20 Mar 2024 21:16:39
Fair point Ed, I guess what I was trying to highlight is that I don’t think it’s a conspiracy against Liverpool to stop them from winning the league although at times it does feel that way!
Can I ask what do you see happening with VAR? It won’t be scrapped but do you see any changes coming down the line?
{Ed001's Note - I hope it is changed because right now it is ruining the game. But with the ex-copper Webb in charge, it will stay the same because he can use it to corraborate what his boys are doing.}
11.) 21 Mar 2024 07:36:02
Webb was a copper in the South Yorkshire police. Enough said.
12.) 21 Mar 2024 09:28:21
" It might not be grand conspiracy to harm one club above others, but it is conspiracy to cover up mistakes made by their group. "
This!
13.) 21 Mar 2024 10:45:28
I agree that findings decent copper is rarer than finding a decent referee. Webb was probably rubbish at that too. They bottled that decision end of last kick off the game wouldn’t have looked great to the powers that be.
18 Apr 2023 13:21:42
At some point I think Nunez is going to just set alight and be phenomenal. I'd say he's had a pretty decent first season actually but I think it's just a little hint of what he can do. Goals, assists, beating defenders. The nerves and tension that he struggled with initially have gone (great run, first touch and finish last night) . Fast, strong, both feet, good in the air work-rate, passion.
18 Jul 2022 12:25:03
I think the theory that we've made money on this transfer is flawed (although I agree that getting £4m is decent) . Yes he only cost £500k up-front (and I assume none of the add-ons have been triggered) and has now been sold for £4m, but I believe his salary was about £3m per year. So for 1.5 years we've paid him £4.5m for not one single appearance. Add the transfer fee and it becomes £5m plus usual peripherals that go with a transfer.
He's not played a single match for us so it's hard to argue that we've had anything for the £5m, other than perhaps the assurance/ cover that we needed in that position at that point in time.
11 Mar 2022 10:21:08
It's an interesting take on Gomez. On one hand, the view is that he's not good enough for Liverpool any longer, but on the other hand there's an expectation that another club would pay £25m for him and that if he gets regular football he'll be pushing for an England place. Now, I know that van Dijk is the world's best, and Matip and Konate are also very good, but we only have to look at last season to know that you need at least four centre-halves who are capable of playing in the first team, so I wouldn't think we'd be rushing a £25m potential England centre half out of the door just to raise funds.
Of course, if Gomez wants to leave or if Klopp has lost confidence that Gomez can get back to the player that he appeared to be a couple of years ago, then that's different.
With Phillips gone and Williams not having shown anything to give any great reason to believe he'll make it at this level, selling Gomez would mean we'd need to buy another centre back of first team quality, or take the chance on van den Berg being our fourth choice, which would be high-risk.
06 Jan 2022 14:29:14
Regarding Ox, I think we have to look at his time with us and say it's been a disappointment, certainly considering the money we paid. When we signed him, I think he was in our top three or four most expensive signings ever. Even now, he must still be top ten or close. It was a big signing. Of course, it's clear he has been unlucky with injuries which have impacted him during his time with us but, whilst he showed a few glimpses prior to his serious knee injury and has that very useful attribute of being able to score goals from midfield, I would disagree that prior to that injury he was looking like a player you would expect for your third highest transfer fee of all time.
Nothing personal, seems like a great bloke and a good man to have around the club but he's not really delivered and, at this stage, I don't expect that he is going to, even if he stays fit and has a good run in the team.
But of course, not all of your big transfers work out well. Fortunately most of ours have in the last few years and, importantly, one or two of our less expensive/ lower profile transfers have also worked out very well.
25 Mar 2021 15:38:51
And despite all of that, 6Times, he still has 19 goals so far this season, will probably finish with mid 20s goals and is on track to win the La Liga title with Atletico Madrid this season.
You are using the example or benchmark of scoring 20 goals a season to lead to your conclusion that he is only fit for the knackers yard, when he needs one more goal this season to literally be a 20 goals a season striker this season (having also done the same in eight of the previous nine seasons) . Clearly, at this stage of his career, he's not one for the future but it's ridiculous to say a player with his current and recent record this season is washed up and only fit for the knackers yard.
But, just to say it again, I personally wouldn't want him back at Liverpool, we took some reputational and credibility damage last time he was here, and I expect that there is no substance to this rumour anyway, but I don't see how he can be described as past it, over the hill, washed up or similar when he's already scored 19 league goals this season, is second top scorer in La Liga and top scorer for the team who are top of the league.
23 Apr 2024 18:04:37
VV - I don't have a strong view on Tuchel as Liverpool manager. Just saying I still rate him, which is just an opinion. And I'm not sure how you get to "if Tuchel was as good as you think he is", when I haven't expressed an opinion on how good I think he is.
My main point was to query your absurd, in my opinion, assertion that a manager who has won at least one trophy at every one of the clubs he has worked at, including league titles in two different countries plus a European Cup, is a "serial failure". The point about it being easy to win the league title with PSG or Bayern is valid but, again, that doesn't equate to serial failure. And whilst Bayern won't win the league this season due to a once-in-a-lifetime brilliant season by Alonso's Leverkusen, remember that Bayern are still in the Champions League semi finals having knocked out the team that is top of the Premier League. Even if you don't like Tuchel the person or think he has a track record for falling out with clubs - which if true is a good reason not to want him as manager - labelling him a serial failure is not credible.
23 Apr 2024 17:48:47
Ed025. Acknowledging the 'Allo 'Allo reference. Brought a smile to my face. Understandably I think that will go over some heads. Probably need to be at least 45 and lived in Britain in the 80s.
{Ed025's Note - thats my target audience RR, when sitcoms were actually funny mate..
23 Apr 2024 12:56:36
Viktor: I wouldn't argue that Tuchel is a serial winner or the best manager around or anything like that, and I don't have a strong feeling that I would want him at Liverpool, but I don't think "serial failure" is an accurate representation, depending on how you measure success and failure.
Since 2016 he has won domestic cups in France and Germany, league titles in France and Germany, and the European Cup, European Super Cup and Club World Cup with Chelsea. The argument against that would be that any manager can win in France with PSG and with Bayern in Germany (he did also win the cup in Germany with Dortmund) but when we won the European Cup, Super Cup and Club World Cup in the same year under Klopp we hailed it as greatness. Tuchel did exactly the same.
19 Apr 2024 13:14:59
YorksRed - I agree up to a point but I'm cautious of throwing the baby out with the bath water. If it's all change this summer and a new manager who wants to go and sign half a dozen new first team players, my concern would be that it would take us back before we go forward again.
With a team that has come close (and could still win) the league this season and with a number of players who we might feel frustrated with right now but who we were thrilled about earlier in the season, plus many of them being young still, I don't know that we need more than a couple of new first team players.
For me, one of the requirements of the new manager will be to get the best out of Szoboszlai and Gakpo, to get Nunez performing consistently, to continue the development of Quansah, Bradley, Clark and Danns, to have a plan to reintroduce Bajcetic, a plan for how to best use Trent and a succession plan for Salah.
19 Apr 2024 10:32:07
But the point is, I think, winning the league wasn't a fairy tale ending; it was very much a realistic ending. We were top of the league with eight matches to go. Could have gone top again with six matches to go if we'd been capable of beating Palace (who hadn't won in almost two months) at home. No fairy tale needed; just some half-decent football would have done it.
For similar reasons, I can't take consolation from the "if we'd been offered this at the start of the season" point of view. It may well be true; I don't think many expected us to get back into a title challenge so quickly after last year but we did and because of that, and because we were top so late in the season with our destiny in our own hands, the expectation has to be redrawn.
Regardless of what we might have been willing to accept at the start of the season, when we got to April top of the league, my expectation was that we would go on to win the league from there.
If we don't pull this out of the fire in the last six matches, it will, for me, be a huge disappointment and an undeniable damp squib ending to Klopp's time at Liverpool.
The way that there is almost always one team that falls apart in a title race fascinates me. The lazy conclusion is to put it down to tiredness or say the players are exhausted. I've never bought that. Why would that only effect one team? And it can't be that the players just aren't good enough; they wouldn't have got so far into the season at the top of the league if they weren't. So is it physchological? That seems most likely to me, but again unpicking that is fascinating. Experienced professionals who have played at the very top of the sport and suddenly they are all overtaken by the same malaise, not one of them can break out of it and drag the team forward.