09 Jun 2025 08:48:24
Probably a clickbait story from the Daily Express, but if Sadio Mane went to Man Utd this summer (he’s apparently deemed surplus to requirements in Saudi), would he tarnish his Liverpool reputation like Judas did?
{Ed001's Note - yes.}
09 Jun 2025 08:59:21
Oh yes!
09 Jun 2025 09:05:11
Definitely, anyone who moves to them after playing for pool tarnishes their rep. Not quite as much as Owen though, that one hurt more as he came through the system too. so he had absolutely no excuse. Harder to expect the lads from other continents to have that loyalty though. Hard to see Mane get anywhere near his levels with us though as he was on the wane before he left and struggled since really.
09 Jun 2025 09:08:13
Yes. Unquestionably.
09 Jun 2025 09:12:31
It's not true, but it would be genuinely hilarious.
09 Jun 2025 09:19:19
Absolutely. But equally, a player of his standing deserves a much better club than them.
{Ed025's Note - im sorry but i just dont get the hatred, just another club for me..
09 Jun 2025 09:28:49
Mane groomed a child and threw away his career at the highest level by moving to a country where he wouldn't catch any flak for marrying her. He's already dead to me. If he wants to go to Man United he may as well because he literally cannot sink any lower in my estimations. In the grand scheme of things, playing for one of our rivals pales in comparison to grooming a child. He picked her out at 16 years old (he was 29 at the time) and told his family of his intentions, he covered her school tuition fees whilst building up a relationship with her, and then her father arranged the marriage once she turned 18 and was of legal age.
What reputation is left to tarnish?
09 Jun 2025 10:12:14
There's so many racist and ignorant undertones in your post that I don't even know where to begin MK. For starters, they were introduced to each other by their families so there was no grooming done by Mane. Furthermore, the age of consent in Senegal is 16 years, not 18. And he didn't run to Saudi just so he wouldn't catch flak for marrying her. From all accounts, they were married in Senegal where they received the blessings of both their families and the community around them.
The Western standard isn't the only standard that exists in the world and I would suggest you study and read up on cultures around the world before you use your own lens and your own perspectives to judge other people by. Because, using the lens of other cultures, it could also be argued that Western culture is the barbaric one.
09 Jun 2025 10:17:04
How did he groom her, MK?
09 Jun 2025 10:33:17
Oooof I didn't have grooming on my bingo card this morning, MK.
09 Jun 2025 10:49:40
Wouldnt jump on MK, think you'll find a lot of people would support his views. Me personally i think IRRESPECTIVE OF ANY RACE that 29 is a bit hairy to be shacking up with a 16 year old. I know by the time my daughter is 16 what i would do if a near 30 year old was chasing her.
09 Jun 2025 10:49:59
yeah that's a low blow MK. unless you have some inside info that Mane deliberately stalked, targeted and had some kind of indecent interaction with a minor, then you really should just sit this one out.
09 Jun 2025 11:35:17
16 is age of consent in the UK, though it's 18 for those in a position of trust, which could be argued, Mane was in that bracket.
09 Jun 2025 11:39:25
Not sure what was racist about that, i never mentiond anything about his race ? sounds like a cheap excuse to justify it. I don't care if other cultures think it's okay to line up children for marriage, that's not morally okay regardless because there is scientific evidence that people aren't fully mature during adolescence and can therefore be easily manipulated. I'll call out dodgy behaviour regardless of who does it. There's plenty of dodgy stuff goes on in the West and that's just as bang out of order, but that's not relevant on a post about Mane is it.
I think anybody who supports what Mane did probably should have their own hard drive checked to be quite honest, and I mean that with every bit of offence because you're a wrong-un if you think it's okay for a 29 year old to pay the school fees of a 16 year old so he can win her affection and her fathers permission. Sad world we live in if not offending people is more important than the welfare of children. It's a very well documented story Faithinworks, but good shout, I'll sit this debate out from here on in. Very strange behaviour from anyone defending him.
09 Jun 2025 11:44:01
Piss poor from MK. Completely ignorant.
09 Jun 2025 12:02:32
its not p. poor from MK. you understand what grooming is right? he's established a relationship with a 16 year old (don't care what anyone says its a minor) paid for the education then years later agreed to marry that's classic 101 grooming. would you be happy if your 16 year old daughter was talking with a 29 year old man no you wouldn't.
Mane as a player fantastic great memories
Mane as a human now. nah not right.
09 Jun 2025 12:06:20
Maybe I wasn't very clear in my post but what I was trying to say is that what Mane did was culturally appropriate to him. He didn't pay for her school fees to gain her affection. He was initially business partners with her father in rebuilding his village and was introduced to her that way, by her family. He then got his uncle to act as his representative to talk to the girl's family to propose marriage. The girl's family agreed to the proposal. It was after this, after they were engaged, that he started paying for her school fees. He didn't do it in the first place to win the affections of the girls or to get her father's approval. And seen from the lens of his culture, all this was done above board and in line with what his culture deemed appropriate and correct when it comes to marriage. To call him a predator and to say that he groomed her is false.
And I am against labelling people as such when you are seeing things from your lens, instead of the lens of the culture he's from. The lens you are using comes from the Western world and based on recent events happening in the world, that same moral perspective isn't the universal barometer that it claims to have been.
09 Jun 2025 12:17:43
Florian Musiala, exactly mate! I'd imagine people defending it don't have kids.
I remember being 16 and a girl in my Chemistry class was dating a guy in his 30's and she had the audacity to make a joke about me being a virgin. I said to her "you are a child being abused". I suppose that wasn't ignorant or racist of me though because her boyfriend was white!
It's wrong regardless and the Western civilisations are 100% not immune to this shady behaviour around kids! You've only got to look at the stuff that comes out every few years about a person in a position of relative power; Epstein, Diddy, Prince Andrew, Saville, Schofield, Glitter, Harris etc. I actually find it more racist that people have tried to make this about race. I didn't even mention Mane's race or religious beliefs so the people getting offended are the ones who've made that connection subconsciously.
Anyway, well said Florian.
09 Jun 2025 12:26:20
I'm with you MK, the term racist is used so freely now a days it discredits those who are actually victims of racism.
It is also used to defend people who.
09 Jun 2025 12:28:10
Reminds me of the time I was serving at the engagement party for an Indian wedding near Manchester. I couldn't see the young couple; just two families at the head table so I asked my manager who the bride and groom was. She pointed to two toddlers in the centre of the table.
A lot of cultures do things very differently. Some times you just have to accept that but other times these things need calling out. In the case of Mane, there are blurred lines. It would be an unacceptable thing to do in Britain regardless of his cultural background but he didn't do it here. I don't think MK is either right or wrong to call it out.
09 Jun 2025 12:30:19
Not sure it counts as grooming but it’s certainly quite gross and dodgy of Mane.
09 Jun 2025 12:33:54
Well said Kloppers, literally the definition of it.
Dracred, I wasn't going to get involved in the debate again but you're piqued my interest. What you just described in your latest post basically explains how a young girl was used by her father to keep a business partner sweet and taken advantage of by a man who knew she couldn't say no as it would damage her fathers business. You've made it sound even worse, just take a step back and think about how you described it for a second. That's abhorrent.
Also, why do you keep saying what's culturally appropriate to make this about race or religion? It's legal in the UK where I live for a 50 year old to have intercourse with a 16 year old he's known since she was born and bought her birthday presents every year etc. It doesn't make it right though does it, and the UK government would probably change the law if there wasn't so many wrong-un's in positions of power. I hate that this happens around the world and is considered acceptable. Have you ever actually spoken to a 16 year old girl? I was a GCSE maths tutor and those 16 years girls and boys I taught were not ready to make life changing decisions for themselves. It's wrong mate, stop defending it because you're scared of being labelled a racist.
09 Jun 2025 12:47:52
Let’s hope he doesn’t join ManU.
09 Jun 2025 12:51:55
Different cultures have long-established ways of behaving that may seem alien, dodgy or downright wrong to us, but that doesn't automatically mean Mane is some sort of deviant.
It's the equivalent of saying "arranged marriages are only taken up by dodgy guys who want a position of complete power over their wife, because arranged marriages are icky to me".
Not saying that Mane possibly isn't a dodgy creep, the 2 don't have to be mutually exclusive, but it's a tad ignorant to say he definitely is when this isn't an uncommon practice for someone from that part of the world.
Let's not forget, if we were to go back a few generations in this country, it wasn't wholly unusual for older males to marry girls straight out of school. In fact, if we all looked back in our family tree far enough, I'm sure the majority would find an instance of this somewhere.
09 Jun 2025 13:16:01
MK . She was 16 . not a child . the way u put it . I thought she was 10.also it's different faith n race to us westerners . but even the age of consent here is 16. thought i was going on a football site today. can we keep it to this in future.
09 Jun 2025 13:22:23
First I hear of this story and regardless of culture, religion or law, as a father if a (now 18) girl I find what was decribed absolutely disgusting of Mane.
09 Jun 2025 13:26:57
Best to steer clear of judging other cultures by our own standards.
09 Jun 2025 13:33:42
In Senegal if someone has a same sex relationship with a person under 21 they are looking at 5 years behind bars.
So for those doing cultural age justification, can you please explain how a straight girl of 16 is wiser to her life choices than a gay 16 year old girl or boy?
09 Jun 2025 13:44:26
I'm saying it was actually appropriate because it is. And the way he went about the whole thing was what was expected of him in his culture. There was no shady dealings or anything to sweeten the deal. You make it sound like there is coercion involved when there wasn't any evidence of that happening. That's just your perspective of how things went down based on the lens that you wear and the experiences that you had growing up in the West. It's entirely different for Mane. I would suggest you to read up about how it actually went down because you are making a load of assumptions about the entire thing.
I'm not defending him because I'm scared to be labelled a racist. And I didn't label you a racist either. I said that your post had racist and ignorant undertones. I apologise if I made it seem that I was calling you one. I've known you since the early days of this site and I highly respect you as a poster. Just that in this case, I don't think you are right to label Mane as a predator or groomer when you can't see the cultural context he was operating in.
But anyway, this is a discussion and debate that's better held in person than on a forum. Too many nuance is lost. And as Stroms said, let's just stick to football from now on.
09 Jun 2025 14:04:09
Yeah fair enough Drac, it's hard to fully convey the context or emotions of our opinions through text only. Things get misinterpreted. We can agree to disagree and be civil. Wirtz will sign soon and nobody will even remember this anyway!
09 Jun 2025 14:17:23
Can open, worms everywhere (to quote Chandler)
As said, these discussions better over a coffee or a pint, lots of nuances.
Bottom line, if Mane joins Man Utd he sits in the same pot as Owen. Slightly above Owen, but still in the same pot!
09 Jun 2025 14:19:22
MK accusing someone of grooming and suggesting others should have their hard drives checked doesn't help the real victims. If anything it has a detrimental effect because false accusations make it harder to catch and convict the real perpetrators.
09 Jun 2025 15:56:14
A bit confused by that claim, Rigsby. I think calling out dodgy behaviour from men towards young girls is exactly how you help real victims. It's far more unhelpful to the real victims for people to use 'cultural norms' as an excuse, as that just desensitises people to it. 16 years old is not an adult. Maybe not by law in many or even most countries, but scientifically speaking you are not at full physical and/ or mental maturity by that age, so factually speaking you are not a fully developed adult; otherwise known as a child or, at best, an adolescent. You can't argue with proven science. Law is not fact, it is opinion that varies from country to country. Science is fact until you can prove otherwise with overwhelming evidence.
If we just stick to the facts, Mane met a girl who at 16 who is scientifically not a fully developed adult, he was a fully developed adult at 29 years old at that time, he met her through doing business with her father, he used his uncle as an intermediary to communicate his desire to marry the 16 year old, he paid for her schooling and tuition, her family agreed and arranged the marriage for when she was 18. That is literally grooming, and there is no counter argument here. I've not embellished or made any assumptions there, nor are there any personal opinions there or ambiguous/ inconsistent laws. That is the timeline of events corroborated by those involved.
Grooming in itself is not an inherently negative term, it just means you prepared/ guided someone to become something else or take up a role in the future. You groom an apprentice to take on a particular job role. She was prepared to be his wife from 16 years old; she was groomed. Take it up with the English language and it's definitions if you want!
I'm out now. It's dragged on long enough and if you still think what Mane did is acceptable then I admit defeat in making you see my point of view. I just felt it was quite important to correct you there though Rigsby, as burying our head in the sand is absolutely not what is best for victims. Any victim will tell you that raising awareness is vital. It gets people talking if nothing else.
Peace.
09 Jun 2025 16:27:12
It's grooming in your eyes but not in the eyes of the law, MK. Then you follow that 'there is no counter argument here'.
Do you expect me to just take your word for it with offering a counter argument?
You keep saying it's grooming and making child abuse claims doesn't mean it's grooming and child abuse.
It doesn't work like that in the real world and I can't believe your ignorance as someone who has worked with children.
Feel free to counter argue, though.
09 Jun 2025 16
{Ed025's Note - this thread is ended..