Liverpool Banter Archive October 14 2014

14 Oct 2014 21:58:06
Coutinho played very well for Brazil, against Japan, tonight. Brought on for the second half, he made a big difference to the team's midfield creativity and was far better than the player he replaced (Oscar - who still seems to be in a World Cup funk). His Liverpool style of play was clearly on display with key incisive passes forward, pressing the opponent when not in possession, a key assist to Neymar for a goal, and missing very closely with two shots on goal (the boy needs serious shooting practice). His form tonight leads me to think that his problems at LFC are more about overall team confidence, rather than any individual problem he may have.

I saw the game too and he ws very good. Great touches, vision and that flick-pass he does w/ the outside of his boot for the assist to Neyar was typical of his skill which is defo still there. I think the whole team is suffering from a loss of confidence and hopefully w/ a couple of wins (God`s grace), the team will start to beieve again and things could start rolling from there. We can only hope.

Lots and lots of shooting practice mate.

14 Oct 2014 19:25:57
My view on the current transfer situation.

In 2012 the king was sacked. The new owners realised that they had to have some sort of structure which would create long term financial stability. I remember hoping at the time that we would bring in Mourinho or Guardiola, but in reality that was never going to happen because of the rules that were to be put in place by FSG for whoever would come in to succeed the king.

FSG had 2 main targets for the vacant manager position and they were Roberto Martinez and Brendan Rodgers. Why did FSG decide that a manager from a "small" club would be the best option for them? Was it because they knew that there was no chance of a top manager agreeing to their "rules"?

Even Martinez turned his nose up at the opportunity to join Liverpool. What was so deterring about those "rules" that would make a promising young manager refuse a chance to manage at a club the size of Liverpool? This is what Dave Whelan had to say at the time Martinez was approached by FSG. “They set down their rules on how they saw the role and the way they wanted the team run and that was not the way Roberto would do it, ”.

Taking everything into account I can only assume that the "rules" went somewhere along these lines:
a) The manager's job will be to strictly to manage whichever players are made available to him.
b) The manager will have very little say in the strict transfer policy.

This would explain a lot. It would explain why Rodgers doesn't favour "his" new signings and why so many players don't appear to be in his plans. It would explain why so many players go out on loan and why Rodgers has shown frustration when asked about certain signings.

So what is this structure that FSG have put in place? Well, when you look at the players that FSG have signed, you notice that the majority of them are young. You have to wonder why we have invested in so much money in so many young players. The reason behind this is simple. Resale value and low risk.

You might say that investing £150m (or whatever the figure) in so many young players is a high risk, but when you consider that most are bought for around £10m each and then take the potential of those players into account you will see that even if they don't succeed we will still likely recoup most of the money spent on them. If they do succeed then their resale value will soar.

I mean take Borini for example. He has proven to be not quite good enough for Liverpool (yet), however a half decent season in the premier league with Sunderland almost saw him sold for a couple of million pounds profit. Then you have a player like Sturridge who was bought for around £12m. He is one that has proven to be well worth the money spent and if we did come to sell him he would fetch at least double what we paid for him.

In my opinion this is a really good strategy for making money and creating financial stability for the future. However, you have to take into account the detrimental effect this would have on the youngsters at the club. Imagine it from their point of view. They are brought in with promises of first team football and before they know it they are frozen out of the team or loaned out.

You only have to look at the recent performances and the the frustration coming from Rodgers to see that something isn't right. The positive energy and togetherness has gone and the team looks somewhat disjointed. So what has gone wrong? In my opinion Rodgers is becoming increasingly frustrated with FSG for not giving him freedom in the transfer market. If I were Rodgers I would feel very unappreciated after that was achieved last season yet still not being trusted with the responsibility of deciding the transfers. Maybe he has had a say in some of them, but I doubt that he will be happy with having to coach players who a) don't suit his system and b) players who he doesn't really want in the dressing room.

I feel that the only way to address this situation is for FSG to give Rodgers more freedom and trust him in the transfer market. Let the committee continue to bring in youngsters to add to the squad, but give Rodgers a fair budget to bring in players he wants in the first team. I mean what is the point in FSG spending £15m on Sakho if Rodgers isn't going to play him and why bring in Balotelli for £16m when Rodgers "categorically" said he didn't want him?

If we are not careful we will end up losing Rodgers, and for me he is a very good manager who has great ideas on how football should be played. I just don't think he is being allowed to work to his full potential.

P.S. Can I just add that I am in no way slating FSG, and I agree with their ideas of how to create financial stability, I just think that they need to work more with Rodgers rather than going against him, otherwise all the hard work so far is going to fall apart.

Red Rum

14 Oct 2014 20:43:46
I don't think it's any secret that signing young preferably English players is indeed Liverpool's transfer policy. I'd suggest it's always how the club has operated, we've never bought the 'big names' really. The last one I can think of is probably Morientes.

14 Oct 2014 20:00:01
Rodgers like moyes is out of his depth at this level atm.

Surely the manager has a say? Eds, mind clearing this up for me or Red-Rum?

{Ed002's Note - The manager has some input. I explained before that I knew a couple of players were not the pick of BR - surprisingly Rodgers has implied the number is higher. I don't want to go down that road any further. Some managers are happy to have little or no input.}

Lallana won't ever have a resale value for what he was bought for, Lovren won't either. It does seem strange for all these young players, but I guess FSG are trying to create a Barcelona-esque dynasty. That's just my opinion!
YNWA

I think you're adding 2+2 and getting potato.

14 Oct 2014 21:26:51
I think you're 100% incorrect.

In fact, I don't think you could be any further away from what is actually happening.

Liverpool will fly this season and all this nonsensical talk will disappear.

FSG is in LFC to make money / Wow that came as a news flash.

Clearly there is a lot we are not being told about. And it's always been that way. And sometimes players will prefer to play for another club, but before we hit panic stations, let's not forget that the majority of the players in our squad either played a big part of last season or are proven in the PL. Things rarely gel straight away, and even if I for 1 hoped it would, it looks obvious that there still is a bit of getting use to each other.

it will come

I believe 100% that at least 4 of the players signed this summer were not Rodgers' choice. Those being Markovic, Balotelli, Can and Origi. I also believe that Sakho, Ilori, Alberto, Coutinho, and Sturridge were not his choice either.

That's 9 players who cost around £110m that Rodgers had no say in. However, look how good Sturridge has turned out to be. Look at how good Coutinho has been for us. Selling those 2 alone would recoup around half of what what was spent on all 9 players. Look at the potential of Origi, Ilori, Markovic and Can. I can see exactly what FSG are doing and I fully agree with their strategy.

The thing I don't agree with is FSG forcing a player like Balotelli on Rodgers. The reason they bought him is because he was available on the cheap. If he were to "do a sturridge" and set the premier league alight then he could potentially double his value. However, Rodgers has a system in place which he wants to build upon and when the club are giving you players that don't suit your system but want to play every game it creates a problem. Especially when the player is as temperamental as Balotelli.

Last week we had Sakho walking out of the club because he isn't being played. That is because he wasn't a Rodgers buy and Rodgers doesn't want him. You have Ilori who doesn't have a clue if he's coming or going. It doesn't create a very positive environment.

For me this is just basic observation. Surely I'm not the only one who can see what's going on?

Red Rum

Can I just correct myself as, if memory serves me right Rodgers did have a say in signing Coutinho.

Red Rum

Red Rum, I agree with you here. The Ed has said that BR has been a bit too careless with transfers hence the commitee that was put in place which some agree and disagree with. If BR wants to work w/ players he doesn`t want BUT can still work with then that`s his choice BUT IMO, that could ver well end in tears because in the end, BR will get the sack regardless of how right he might be which I wish doesn`t happen. Example, Pellegrini was given players he didn`t want at RM and those he wanted (Sniejder and Robben, for sure) got sold. In the end, who got the sack when Real failed to win a trophy that year? PELLEGRINI! Hence, BR and the owners need to tread lightly here. As for Balo, if he wasn`t BR`s choice then he should have stopped it. However, if he wasn`t available, who would we have gotten? Frankly, I don`t see anyone else we could have gotten or is it possible that BR just shrugged his shoulders and went with it. I hope someone can enlighten me on who that player could have been provided he was available.

Seriously you guys have absolutely no clue who has final decisions on transfers. Pure speculation on how it's done at LFC and this is like Groundhog Day on here at the moment. The same posts slagging off the transfer policy, the players and the manager. If Suarez was still at the club and or if we were flying the board would be very different. Can we get a bit more constructive please

{Ed001's Note - Martinez was never offered the job, he never turned it down, no matter what he said publicly. He did say he would require a lot more power than they were prepared to consider, so it was decided that it would be in everyone's best interest if he wasn't appointed. He was not offered it and did not turn it down.}

You clearly couldn't be bothered to read the post Daniella or you would know that I wasn't slating anyone.

Ohio, I have no idea who BR had wanted, but what we do know is that he publicly stated that Balotelli wasn't his choice. Like with Sturridge the deal was forced through by FSG, and Rodgers had no say. To be fair FSG were spot on with Sturridge and Balotelli could potentially do as well as him. Who knows?

Red Rum

{Ed001's Note - Rodgers was the one who asked for Sturridge! You have no idea what you are talking about.}

Redohio, what about Remy or Bony instead of a Mario?

Ed is right. BR wanted Studge since deadline day of the summer of 2012. It was all over Sky at the time BUT we couldn`t agree a fee and the deal couldn`t be done in time.

Did Rodgers not try pull the plug on signing Sturridge ed? And was it not FSG who got the deal done?

Red-Rum

{Ed002's Note - No.}

15 Oct 2014 17:28:27
What about Aspas, Illori, Alberto and Sahko? Were they his buys or the commitee's? I find it strange how he never gave them a chance even in games where we were cruising. Any info will be appreciated.

{Ed002's Note - Ilori was the choice of someone else.}

If we are getting players he doesn`t want then w shouldn`t be surprised if these players NEVER see the field. This strategy WILL backfire in the long-term and BR will be the one to get the chop. The club and manager should work hand in hand if not, God help us.

{Ed002's Note - The reason he has the assistance of the "transfer committee" is because he is out of depth in buying players he wants. The club has spent a lot of money with zero return. Trusted this summer with the promise of winning the league and challenging in the Champions League there will already be some nervousness. The owners will be as ruthless as they need to be, but the botton line is that from the outside it seems a real mess right now.}

16 Oct 2014 05:19:42
We are in agreement here, Ed002. If indeed the owners were promised these things which BR is not ready to deliver YET then he will be on thin ice for sure going forward. FSG don`t F around and will do what they think is right for their investment.

{Ed002's Note - Absolutely RO, history tells us they will be ruthless if needs be. They are not on the ride for fun.}

Am right in saying Mikitarian was a signing Rodgers wanted but he picked Coutinho instead last signing Rodgers wanted to me

{Ed002's Note - No. Unconnected.}

18 Oct 2014 16:01:27
If we don't finish top four, Rodgers will be gone. I believe it's as simple as that. FSG have been clear about their expectations from day one, it seems to me.

14 Oct 2014 18:06:10
Given what Ed002 mentioned and it being quiet. And with Ed002 encouraging me in another thread to start a new topic I thought I'd give this a go.

Thread 1: Club vs Country - worthy of discussion but in a responsible manner

There are so many different sides to this story for me.

1. I think the internationals should be played at the end of the season.

2. Football is not simply a game any more it's a business. It's no longer a matter of pride playing for your country, it's a multi million pound gamble. We saw what a red card for Jordan Henderson, did to Liverpool over 3 games. What could and injury to a fatigued player do. causing him to miss as much matches. we saw that hendo missing 3 matches really changed liverpool's play and their title hopes

3. For me Hodgeson is a t!t who has spouted his mouth off about not believing in BR's training and resting of quick players for 2 days. asking where the research is, when actually it's there. It's widely believed. Not only that, he's tactically inept etc

4.I have had the ''honour'' of representing Wales and GB in the sport of AFL and was meant to play in the afl version of the world cup this year. I didn't end up travelling and playing because I and the coach simply do not see eye to eye on a great deal of things. it's not as simple as being an honour. You get some real pr!cks in the game and it will be the same for football who quite frankly make playing for country more trouble than it's worth. (Please see SGE complete idiocy regarding Ledley King and Jamie Carragher over this)

5.England relying on a 19 year old to do the business shows how far they've fallen since the golden generation.England really shouldn't need a 19 year old coming off the bench to win a free kick, against 10 men to win a game vs Estonia.

To play internationals at the end of the season would mean playing 10 games at the end of 1 season and playing the final the next Summer. Considering there is the World Cup and Euro Champion ship.

14 Oct 2014 21:28:54
Boss points them bobatron.

Well said mate.

Bobatron,
Liverpool shouldn't be relying on the same 19 year old to win games for us but after spending well over 100 million pounds we are.

15 Oct 2014 13:20:25
Internationals played at the end of the season would be. difficult. But, against that, it would also mean that there is no break in the season and it finishes mid April, so there would be more time to do it.

However, I think that Internationals should generally be run more in 'blocks'. First half of the season we have 3 international breaks - how about instead, we have 1, long break for it and then let the season go? It'll be much better for the internationals as they have time to play and train together properly, and less disruptive to the flow of teams in the league

Irish Rover, given the earlier finish we could expect from not playing the internationals during the breaks I think it would be fine. We'd have an extra few weeks to work with at the end of the season

14 Oct 2014 15:49:03
So lads, sterling comes back from England duty this week and says to Rodgers he needs a few weeks off, would u be happy with that? Say u drew against qpr with him rested would u still accept he needs rest? Would u demand he plays the next game?

I'm not to bothered sterling said he was tired fair play to the lad if it's how he feels, just curious if u think missing 1 game is sufficient enough rest for a lad seemingly suffering burn out?

I think there may be some double standards here and I'm now very intrigued to see how this goes for Liverpool and there fans.

All this Roy being against Liverpool is nonsense too, remind me who he took off at HT against San Marino.

My only issue is why would u make this public?

no matter what kind of pressure he was put into, your a 67 year old manager for gods sake.

however this rodgers vs roy thing is stupid and i hope it ends as quickly as possible.

if he needs a rest then so be it. you feel you need to talk about it, go have a chat with rodgers, not the media.

to answer your question CTR, yes i would want him to play. but i'd rather have him for the season than just one game, so i'd accept it if he needs a rest.

If the player and staff know that he won't perform as well as he normally does, or that it is below the level of other player, I don't see any problem. However, Brendan does have his favourites .

14 Oct 2014 18:09:29
Fergie done it for years Ctr! As Ed002 said earlier, how many caps did Giggs get for Wales? How many should he had?

14 Oct 2014 18:18:52
I didn't mention fergie, giggs or United Irish.

No you didn't Ctr, and if you had left the bit out about double standards then i would not have commented at all. The point being Fergie had plenty of run ins with England and Giggs had plenty of "rests" when he wasnt "fit" for internationals! Double standards?

I think he looks a little fatigued.
His last few performances haven't been to his usual level.
I feel we have enough to beat QPR so yes rest him.
If we loose? So be it I'd rather look after him for the rest of the season.
It, s time for some of the others to step up and carry some of the load too.

14 Oct 2014 23:19:52
Yep that's fine Irish mate, I personally would be slightly worried about how the situation could evolve over the coming few days, but I guess United apparently done it according to u, so I'm sure it will be fine, in fact what was I thinking? It's common fact that if u say United done it too it makes the situation not nearly as potentially bad.

I know! If it does go a bit pete tong you could always bring out another corny banner saying ''well United done it''! That should nip it in the bud, yes?

14 Oct 2014 23:23:08
That's the kind of mature reply I was looking for phooey mate 😊

U have got to protect him from these sorts of things, he needs nurturing and allowed to grow in the game. I'm all for good enough old enough but every player needs a rest and sterling being so young defo does from time to time.

Ctr
Its not potentially bad at all. Its a storm in a tea cup.

15 Oct 2014 09:48:08
Irish we will see how Liverpool handle it.

15 Oct 2014 13:35:35
Problem is CTR all we know is what Hodgson has said so far. Did Sterling actually go up to him and say 'please don't start me?'. Was he collapsing at Hodgson's door? Or was he asked how he felt and said 'tbh boss I really felt training today, I'm aching all over. Playing tomorrow looks daunting right now'. Etc. Essentially we have a media storm over a stupid, throwaway comment. If he really said 'I can't play', I'd be dissapointed to see him play vs QPR. If he just admitted that he's tired and not at his best, then I'd expected a 2-3 day rest to have him back there and ready to face QPR at the weekend (also we're Sunday so it's another days rest, another nights sleep which vs fatigue does count for a lot - sleep quality is one of the best cures).

In all honesty though, I don't get the fuss. He turned up for the squad, turned up for training and played in both games. To me, that's the end of it. If I was a coach, I'd respect and appreciate honesty in my players - if for no other reason than because Sterling is a superior player to Lallana, but if I have a Sterling at 80% and a Lallana at 100% I'd be starting Lallana no question. Names don't win games

Phooey is right. We need to do what`s best for him and the club and give him a week off or he will be ruined for the rest of the season.

15 Oct 2014 20:10:06
I agree hjikle, but rememeber it's not just the England manager that is responsible to look after young sterling.

Sterling could play 2 games a week he's not old like gerrard and he is hardly a 17 year old now your best players play just look at Dortmund there young players get a chance and are a permanent fixture in the team realisticly Gerrard should need more rest than Sterling

{Ed002's Note - If the kid needs a break let him have it. It is no big deal. He is under a lo of pressure, the club should look to ease it if they can. Time to move on. Lessons learned for both managers.}

14 Oct 2014 14:28:48
Might as well kick off the "FA abusing Wembley to repay debts and raise money" post as well while i have little to do at work:

I don't see it as "abusing Wembley"

What's the point in having a multimillion pound facility that sits unused for 90% of the year?

Surely it can only be a positive that they are finding methods to use it more consistently, they are using it as a University type base as well as i am aware one of my friends has gone on to study football marketing full time there.

As long as the money is reinvested in grassroots facilities and training our coaches, its entirely positive. there can be no qualms about the playing surface either as i'm sure they could schedule the hosting of NFL etc and make sure they leave themselves enough time to prepare a quality pitch.

In my opinion, Wembley could be used very well for grassroots, a large population of young people are available, many kids who would jump at the chance to join some form of academy which could be based at Wembley, to try to produce and nurture some elite players from a huge sphere of influence (I myself have a UEFA B license and make do with extremely poor facilities in the Lincolnshire area up north, where its fairly sparse and its a very large place to navigate )

14 Oct 2014 12:51:01
England are woeful and need a fix:

- Long post ahead -

Roy hodgson is an outdated, not up to standards manager, whos only trophies are in sweden and one in denmark, note these swedish ones all being over 20 years ago and the danish one close to 15 years ago.
These were with arguably the "biggest" clubs in their competition so need to be taken with a pinch of salt when commenting on his success.

Being sacked from near enough every job he has had points towards his incapability, his only real success in England was taking fulham to the europa league final.

Hopelessly uncharismatic, he instills a lack of confidence into the team, never says anything positive in interviews and never seems to talk with confidence, regardless of his imperiment.

The lack of flowing football on the pitch, in formations that don't support the players who, at the moment we have a very good crop of young players coming through.
Also, the playing callum chambers at right back when he is tipped to be a CB and leaving clyne on the bench is typical of england, not playing players in their natural position and expecting them to thrive.

The training appears to be outdated since more often than not two or three players return from england duty (not just our players)

The FA is also to blame, undoubtedly we would produce better players if we had better coaches and facilities at grassroots level, we are miles behind Germany, Spain, italy and France in that respect and it proves so on the pitch.

The plan for winning in 2022 is ridiculous, you can't just say we're aiming to win a certain competition, because other countries will also grow and improve, the competitions only get harder as we see African and South American teams growing ever stronger year on year.

A wholesale re-jig from bottom to top is needed, fresh ideas, fresh plans.

I for one don't see a problem with letting out wembley to NFL and other sources of income PROVIDING that money goes towards improving grassroots facilities and not just lining the board members pockets.

{Ed002's Note - I suspect that this reflects the view of many on here. A good starting point.}

Not far from the truth

The main reason england will never win anything is that fans especially don't want a certain England player to do well because he plays for a rival club so we naturally want to batter all the man utd players in the squad& vise verse we all want to be able to blame a man u player when it goes wrong & the same with arsenal & Chelsea fans. Add to that the players don't know who they're playing for are they playing for the queen? For the fans? For themselves? For great Britain? For England? The United kingdom? We need to sing a song that is purely for the England football team before matches

14 Oct 2014 13:53:26
To be fair, Harry, I don't see it that way at all. I'm concerned for our players when they are on international duty as I don't want them injured, but as for not supporting Rooney (for example) when he's got the England shirt on, that's nonsense.

Spain, Germany, Brazil, Argentina all have players from competing domestic teams, some from the EPL, and they do OK at tournaments.

I think it is too easy to lay everything at Hodgson's door. I mean England have been unsuccesful under nearly every manager. Even with their golden era (Becks, Scholees, Rio, Gerrard, Lampard, Cole etc). Maybe a closer look at the players needs to be addressed? Are they really that good? Do the foreign players make them look better at club level? Possibly a bigger effort from grass roots level? Maybe they need to go abroad more, and i don't mean on their holidays!

The fact they picked Hodgson shows England's lack of ambition but also highlights that no-one worth their salt wanted the job.
It's a thankless task.
But it is so depressing watching them play at the moment. We've got so many exciting players and I (stupidly?) thought that we might be dark horses in the World Cup.
We should be playing much better football.
And it's not about age.
How old is Del Bosque?
It's about the method.
There is something wholly unspectacular about Hodgson.
He's just fine, adequate, satisfactory.
Why are we aiming to win competitions 8 years in the future?
We should be aiming for now.
I do think it's a real shame.
The first World Cup I remember was Italia 90. The buzz was amazing.
And Owen scoring that goal against Argentina.
There was so much excitement and hope.
There used to be such a pride in how many players from your team made it in to the England squad.
I absolutely hated it when United players dominated it as it just highlighted how our inferiority but I still supported Beckham et al.
Now I just don't care.
I'm sure a lot of people feel the same.
Something needs to be done

14 Oct 2014 16:09:39
Absolutely. Worse still, If he keeps on rubbing his face like that he's going to start a fire at wembley.

14 Oct 2014 18:07:46
100% agree. I could probably add another 10-15 paragraphs as well but I haven't got the patience with this site recently. It's no wonder Ed002 is so on edge. They must have the patience of a Saint (in a coma).

14 Oct 2014 18:09:04
Very good points JLPred, I will just add a couple of points:
As Ed002 eluded in an earlier post, England should start to imitate what Spain, Germany and Brazil did, by building a strong U17 and keeping them together for years to represent the senior team.

Also we do play far too many games in the leagues and cups etc, I think a top division of 18 teams only will be a good start

Roy, that is the way every successful country in football have done it. It is thru a specific plan to build from the grassroots up in terms of scouting, direction, infrastructure and getting the youth to play a certain style of play that will showcase their talents straight from the U-17 level. Personally, my fav tournament to watch is the U-17 WC/Olympic soccer tournament. That is where real football is played with flair, passion and all-out attacking football. Also, Germany, Spain, Brazil, France, Argentina, Belgium and even countries like Nigeria and Ghana have always investd in youth which is why they are consistently successful in age-group competitions hence success in the senior competitions. England has the finance and infrastructure BUT don`t want to put in the work to get the results. These countries (Germany, Argentina, Spain, France) are successful because they have long term plans and blueprints which with time, yields fruits. Germany has been plugging away for yrs thru youth development until they reached the top in Brazil (the spine of that team like Hummels, Boateng, Khedira, Ozil, Neuer, Muller were all part of the team that won the U-21`s in 2009 beating. ENGLAND in the final). England isn`t ready to succeed and as long as they keep throwing money at the problem instead of digging deep and planning for the future, the 1966 WC will be England`s only trophy till the end of time.

14 Oct 2014 11:52:03
Here's my take on the Rodgers, Hodgson and Sterling situation.

Rodgers has overplayed Sterling in recent times, mainly due to losing Suarez and having Sturridge out injured. Not only that, but because the club failed to bring in any top attacking players in the summer we have been heavily reliant on him.

The club knew before the summer transfer window opened that there was a risk of players becoming injured on international duty, on european nights, in the league or the domestic cup games. Therefore, the club should have been prepared for situations like this by assembling a squad with quality throughout the squad. This all comes down to the clubs failure in the transfer market once again.

As for this public embarrassment, both managers are at fault for making it public when it could have all been avoided with better communication between the 2 managers and Sterling himself.

Red Rum

14 Oct 2014 12:18:59
Red Rum

Your First two para are dead spot on.
There are quiet a lot of players who travel for the African nations football tournament. Would you stop them?

In my opinion, Sterling made a very wise decision and is clearly far more mature than both Hodgson and Rodgers. He admitted his body was feeling the pressure it's been put under and also admitted that mentally he is not in his best form right now.

The real issue here is not Sterling and his commitment, but rather English management and the fact young players don't get sufficient recovery time unless they ask for it!

Sterling is taking the fall in the media for mistakes made by his managers and that is not fair.

All this social media BS about "soldiers know what tired means, you don't blah blah blah" are quite simply, uneducated muppets. My Dad spent 12 years in the army from 16-28 years old and by the time he was 26 his body was shot to pieces. His elbows and knees lock up due to loose particles of cartilage and his muscles have completely depreciated. There is not an option to rest soldiers. It is a sacrifice that they make that we should be very grateful for. However there is an option to rest footballers and to not exercise that option would be incredibly selfish and will without a doubt lead to health problems in the future.

Sterling has done absolutely nothing wrong and the media want to wind their neck in, as do muppets like Daveyboyblue and the word.

Hodgson has a grievance with LFC with the way he was binned off.
BR isn't the most astute person when it comes to the media.
Regardless, the club should come first and foremost to any player.

{Ed002's Note - Roy Hodgson has no grievance with Liverpool. Same old story, everyone hates Liverpool. Tedious and embarrassing.}

15 Oct 2014 06:03:35
I should hope not as well Ed002. He was crap for us.
I don't wish Hodgson any ill feeling at all but he was awful for us and he still makes me cringe to be perfectly honest.
Thankfully we've moved on and so has he.
I hope he does well as England manager. I just won't be betting on it:)

14 Oct 2014 10:33:14
Eds. Soemthing aside Sterling and England.
If you remember. Who were the keepers we were interested in before Mignolet?
Was it only Begovic?
Someone said here, We looked for a top class keeper for more than 6 months and came with Mignolet?. I can't believe this.

{Ed001's Note - we were looking, and continued to scout Trapp, Navas (that joined Madrid in the summer) and there was at least one other ruled out as it was felt he was too old to be a long term option. By the club, not Rodgers, I should point out.}

14 Oct 2014 10:53:07
Do you recollect any concrete offer for either players. A failed Bid may be. What were the circumstance that lead us to capture Migs?
I didn't had much on Navas. Trapp is a great prospect and don't see niether requiring a special GK coach. They both looked well and good.

So Briniging on a new GK coach to improve Migs would as more questions than answers.

Your thoughts Ed01.

{Ed002's Note - It is all in the archives for last summer. I explained about Mingolet - take the time to read it. I was told a couple of years ago that Fabian Giefer is real hidden gem in the German youth.}

Can't be bothered doing your own research boom?
Finding other goalkeepers who we looked at doesn't change the fact Mignolet had a good 3 years at Sunderland and looked a great keeper before we bought him(except for his kicking and distribution)

The problem is Bobatron, Sunderland made him look good. This was under Steve Bruse if I'm not wrong? A manager who set's his teams up to be compact and force the opposition into making desperate shots from positions you're unlikely to score from. We don't sit deep and just defend though. We go forward and leave gaps in behind; gaps a world class keeper can deal with.

Mingolet is a great shot stopper and at Sunderland that was all he had to do. They had dominating centre backs like Turner who didn't care if their keeper couldn't come out to collect the ball because they'd win it anyway. We are trying to play an attacking style with more offensive ball playing centre backs. We don't have 4 defenders all over 6ft3 either becauae we have attacking wing backs. Therefore we need a dominating keeper who will come and collect the ball rather than rely on his defence.

To conclude, it is very easy for goalkeepers to look good in average and defensive teams. You also don't have the problem with losing focus when the majority of the game is played in and around your area. He was making around 5-10 saves a game at Sunderland which keeps you on your toes. At top clubs though you may only be called upon to make a save 1 or 2 times and you could end up waiting until stoppage time to do that. Focus is therefore a big factor in becomnig a top class keeper. I'm not saying Mingolet is bad, I just don't think he is good enough for a top 4 team, unfortunately. If that makes me a bad fan in anybodys eyes, so be it. I'm just being honest though.

I could believe that EMS if he didn't play well for Belgium too, and under Martin O'neil. I was very fotunate in that my best friend at uni is the son of steve walford so I used to go see sunderland play a lot as we got free tickets ETC. He certainly wasn't made to look good under Oneils tactics the season before we bought him, where for me he was the second best keeper in the league.

To say at sunderland all he had to do was shot stop is utter nonsense. He used to come and collect the ball no problem from crosses, although he has always seemingly favoured punching.
The fact you'd call sunderland a defensive team is quite astounding.
Mclean, sessegnon, johnson, rose, borini, larsson, etc, and you call sunderland a defensive team?

That is my point though. He doesn't play for Belgium does he. Because Courtois is far superior. Martin O'Neil has always been a defensive manager very much in the Rafa mould. He likes to sit deep and hit teams on the break. I'm not saying Mingolet never had to do anything except stop shots, I'm just saying he had a different job/workload due to the different styles in play. He always looked flappy though.

I fail too see how listing a few attack minded players (some of whom were never at the clubwhilst Mingolet was there) backs up your aargument. Under Rafa we had Torres, Babel, Kuyt, Keane, Gerrard, Riise, Garcia, Riera, Pennant, Bellamy, Crouch etc. Don't tell me you considered Rafa an attacking coach too?

I'll have to agree to disagree here. Try not to take things so personally though mate. I don't think Mingolet has ever been in the top 10 keepers in the league personally. He had a couple of seasons where he made a few hundred highlight reel saves. He's never looked comfortable and commanding though. Perhaps he just needs a few years more experience. I just don't think we can afford him that time.

Well we will have to disagree about Oneill he's certainly not a defensive manager. To me that's ludicrous. and Sunderland by the players they had and were set out certainly weren't a defensive side. Those players I noted pretty much started every game together. I truly suggest you go watch some sunderland highlights before spouting off embarrassingly that sunderland are a defensive team.

As for the belgium side, just watch them when he plays. I won't argue courtois is far superior, that's pretty much given, I certainly wouldn't believe courtois being better makes migs a bad keeper.

I don't take things personally. I just don't like complete garbage being spouted

14 Oct 2014 18:06:52
Thanks Ed002, i'll look into it.

I said Sunderland were a defensive team.

I'm just going to leave this because you need to grow up mate.

{Ed001's Note - sorry but anyone who has watched O'Neill's tactics will know that he is a defensive minded manager. One of football's dinosaurs.}

I'm glad I'm not alone then Ed001. Bobatron still won't hear it though. He's in one of his me vs the world moods.

{Ed001's Note - O'Neill is all about long balls and big target men as a club manager. Awful to watch, I really hope he never gets back into the club game ever again.}

I completely agree Ed. His most settled job was at Villa. Carew up front to receive the long punt and then Milner, Barry, Young and Downing would just come tearing forward on the counter attack. It was effective at times, but boring and defensive. He tried to recreate it at Sunderland with Fletcher as the big man and the likes of Johnson etc tearing forward to join the attack but never managed to sign players of the same quality he had at Villa.

{Ed001's Note - he is just so out of touch with modern football and tactics, it is scary how highly rated he is just because he talks to the press.}

BTWall this from a man who bet balotelli would get 35+ goals this season. and thought lukaku had a longer scoring drought and scored in dribs and drabs more than Bony. haha

Logn balls doesn't make you defensive, sitting back for a counter, and holding onto 1-0 wins doesnm't make you defensive.
tell me how a defensive team makes a keeper look good, i would love to know, surely it invites more shots and pressure onto a keeper

Whereas I agree he isn't a top manager, its astounding he took an average club like villa to 6th for 3 consecutive years in a row, when he left they pulmmeted, he saved Sunderland from relegation, and he got a draw with germany. dinosaur

14 Oct 2014 09:50:29
Why can't we accept sterling felt he was not fit enough to give 100% and was responsible enough to inform his manager as regards a spat between br and rh this is paper talk having said that outside of the establishment who honestly thinks Hudson is a good manager

14 Oct 2014 10:30:05
We are headlining the Papers for all the wrong reasons. Put this into bed and focus on the Game on Sunday

14 Oct 2014 07:00:40
good evening Ed002 looks like the chat today has not been to good. i'm still amazed no one cotton on to u saying sterling is likely to sign this week. Ed002 it seems u think Liverpool are run very poorley in terms of looking after the youngsters and training fullstop is do the top brass realise this is there any plans to sort this mess out cheers

{Ed002's Note - (a) It seems many people don't care enough about Sterling's contract. It seems strange to me. (b) I have explained before that I am far from convinced about the handling of younger players. This has been reflected in their comments as well. (c) I have explained before about the training methods and help being required. (d) I have explained that the owners will do what they can to protect their investment - the one that this year that was expected to win the league and challenge for the Champions League. If they need to be ruthless they will be. Liverpool should be in the position to be doing very well on the field. The manager seems intent on focussing his energy on a series of high-profile spats.}

Ed, I apologise if I'm a little slow (it's quite the norm!), what is the link between Sterlings new contract and his decision to rest? There is clearly a story behind your comment, are you able to share it?

{Ed002's Note - There is no link.}

What are these spats ed>

thanks

{Ed002's Note - It has been done to death - read the posts please.}

Ed I noticed what you put yesterday, I just wasn't what that thread was about, why would I want to send it in a different direction. I am not 1 of those that goes over the top myself when a new contracts signed. I am glad he's signing and glad he's earning good money, it doesn't necessarily mean I want to start a whole new topic about it though. What would I say?

{Ed002's Note - Anything you wish to start a new thread on these quiet days Bobatron.}

14 Oct 2014 11:50:40
I'd rather let you enjoy the down time Ed002. That raheem things seems to have caused a bit of a fuss for you though

{Ed002's Note - You are very sweet.}