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02 Oct 2017 16:19:57
A quick question to the eds if you guys are free. Its been nearly 2 years since klopp took the job and at the time there was big talk of Ancelotti. Correct me if I'm wrong but I remember reading that klopp said he could win the league with what we have ( I think paisley would even struggle to win the league with our defence) and wouldn't need to spend too much money while CA said he needed to rebuild the whole spin of the team which to be honest looking at the spine of our team compared to the top 6 is pathetic

Clearly klopp does not feel the same as he did 2 years ago? Cause in my eyes and I'm no expert by any stretch we badly need a gk who can catch and kick a ball in a straight line. A cb who can talk without being afraid to hurt there voice (carra its a shame your retired) possibly even 2 cb's not mad about matip but would give him a go with vvd if that happens and I think we need 2 centre mids and a proper striker who knows were the net is.

As carra said yesterday if that Sturidge chance dropped to lukaku Kane or morata that's 2-1 and 3 points. People are baffling me on here saying we don't need a striker cause salah mane and firmino contribute too much which is great and they wouldn't why cause we have a main man up top? but I bet those people would be licking there lips if a Kane or Torres of old or Suarez joined tomorrow.

Agree3 Disagree0

02 Oct 2017 19:02:00
IR, Klopp is trying to fix the issues BUT we have to wait for the TW to come up again so till then, we have to work on what we have as he is well aware of the issues as Ed01 has said. Also, we scored near a hundred goals last season (92 to be exact) and are top 5 in the PL for goals scored since Klopp took over playing the exact way we play so to me, that argument is a red herring. Had our boys scored the goals our play deserves, this is not an issue. We hit Arsenal for 4 (could have been 8) and this issue never came up so why is it coming up now after 7 games in?

Also remember, the striker thingy is not full proof either. We have seen Kane, Morata and Lukaku fluff their lines as well this season so NOTHING is an exact science even tho, people make it look that way. I don't have a prob with a striker coming in however, we should just not rip up a proven system just cos you're in a sticky patch. If you have a striker who is also fluffing his lines and in a dry spell, do you rip up that system and go back to the one you had before? That is senseless knee jerk stuff which in the end, is what this debate is, IMO.

Had we stopped creating chances then the debate would be relevant BUT that is not the case. Our issues lie in the fact that our midfield is not clicking right now, our defence is well, our defence and our boys are overthinking things when in good positions to score as we saw again last night. That is where the work needs to be done.

02 Oct 2017 20:31:40
Yes we scored loads and loads of goals last season but sadly Bingo they do not count towards this years league or CL. Have teams worked out how to play against us to nullify our attack?

02 Oct 2017 20:40:13
Klopp said that he believed he could win a trophy with Liverpool in a couple of years. He did not promise the title! He may be a larger than life character but he's no clown (as some would have you believe)

02 Oct 2017 20:45:05
Bingo red. I do agree that its not a given if we got a Kane for arguments sake that we would blow teams away every week 4/ 5 nil with Kane scoring every week 2/ 3 goals. Football doesn't work like that unfortunately. But you can't honestly say you wouldn't change a system that has won us nothing by the way so don't know how its so fantastic, yeah maybe fantastic to watch but leaves us massively exposed at times if players are not switched on but that can go with every system to fit a harry kane / Torres of 07/ 08 Suarez and sarcifice let's say wijinaldum. I don't know why klopp doesn't switch to 4231 play a proper out and out striker up top firmino behind him in the number 10 role which imo is his best position as he always drops deep, links play very well and is a very intelligent footballer someone we are blessed to have and mane and salah on either side. I don't get how salah or mane wouldn't score the same amount of goals as they currently are (both fantastic players by the way) just cause we have a striker up top. You would then have the added protection for the back 4 with 2 midfield's not sitting as such but not running around like headless chickens either. Keita will be interesting next season I think getting him a proper partner in midfield is a must. i've already mentioned fabinho think he is a class act. Can pass short and long, good engine for a Brazilian and is not afraid to get stuck in. Gk and at least 1 centre back for me are prioirites before a striker walks through the door as defence is the main problem and think the spine of the team is very poor for a top club like ourselves trying to get back to were we wanna be. Competing and winning trophies on a regular basis and being a force in Europe again. I know it takes time but we are the only club I know going through transition the word that keeps getting throwing about since our last title win.

02 Oct 2017 20:45:05
Bingo red. I do agree that its not a given if we got a Kane for arguments sake that we would blow teams away every week 4/ 5 nil with Kane scoring every week 2/ 3 goals. Football doesn't work like that unfortunately. But you can't honestly say you wouldn't change a system that has won us nothing by the way so don't know how its so fantastic, yeah maybe fantastic to watch but leaves us massively exposed at times if players are not switched on but that can go with every system to fit a harry kane / Torres of 07/ 08 Suarez and sarcifice let's say wijinaldum. I don't know why klopp doesn't switch to 4231 play a proper out and out striker up top firmino behind him in the number 10 role which imo is his best position as he always drops deep, links play very well and is a very intelligent footballer someone we are blessed to have and mane and salah on either side. I don't get how salah or mane wouldn't score the same amount of goals as they currently are (both fantastic players by the way) just cause we have a striker up top. You would then have the added protection for the back 4 with 2 midfield's not sitting as such but not running around like headless chickens either. Keita will be interesting next season I think getting him a proper partner in midfield is a must. i've already mentioned fabinho think he is a class act. Can pass short and long, good engine for a Brazilian and is not afraid to get stuck in. Gk and at least 1 centre back for me are prioirites before a striker walks through the door as defence is the main problem and think the spine of the team is very poor for a top club like ourselves trying to get back to were we wanna be. Competing and winning trophies on a regular basis and being a force in Europe again. I know it takes time but we are the only club I know going through transition the word that keeps getting throwing about since our last title win.

03 Oct 2017 13:18:02
IR, I agree with you on the whole and I don't disagree that the system cannot be tweaked a bit BUT you have to look closely at the system we play to understand it. We play with a Firmino-type CF cos of his movement, guile, skill and ability to bully defenders and draw them out of position. The spaces being left behind when this happens, are the spaces that Mane and Salah attack with outside-inside runs hence, creating havoc.

We played a striker in Studge on Sunday and cos he can't do what Firmino can do, he kept taking up the spaces that Mane and Salah normally attack and we all saw how dire he was. This is why we have wide forwards or strikers and not wingers. Look at the Hoff game and Sevilla game at Anfield and you will see how important Firmino is in our system. He was involved in EVERY goal we scored cos of the way he plays and toys with defenders, dropping deep to lay off the ball and the wide forwards attack the space in behind. If you want a top striker, you have to play with real wingers whipping balls in hence, you have to rip up the whole system and like you know, you can't do that. Just my take.

03 Oct 2017 16:59:26
Bingored. I agree 100% that firmino is vital to the team 100%. He is a fantastic footballer and a player we are blessed to have imo. I don't agree with you have to play proper wingers to have a striker up top. Torres Suarez Henry lacazette benzema (Costa) as I wouldn't class hazard or Pedro proper wingers they are as much like mane and salah all those didn't need wingers wipping balls in left right and centre to get goals. Could they score if balls were wipped into them 100% but they didn't rely on it . If you are going for a striker like benteke/ carroll then to play to there strength you would need proper wingers that could ping crosses all day to get the best out of them. They are limited in terms of what way you can set up as you can only play one way with a striker like that. For argument sake Suarez he could do everything. Could play up top on his own and still cause defenders nightmares, could play out wide, behind the striker ect ect my point is just because we buy a striker Werner would be a fantastic player (only really started watching him this season when the wife allows me) I don't think it would impact the amount of goals/ assists that mane/ salah/ firmino would get. Firmino will cause caous whether he is playing up top on his own or in a number 10 defenders will be worrying about him and he will still create the space for mane, salah or let's say a werner. Think 4231 is the way to go going forward but that's me I'm not saying I'm an expert by an stretch but think with a main man up top and 2cm not sitting but offering a better balance and offering support to defenders instead of can hendo and wini chasing shadows (its great when it does work) but all teams have to do is play long and that is the whole formation out the window.

{Ed025's Note - when you say "firmino will cause chaos" IR89 he is already doing that mate to liverpools attack..

03 Oct 2017 17:46:15
Ed025. What is your opinion of firmino pal? I think he is a fantastic player but don't and will never be convinced that he is a striker/ forward/ main man whatever you wanna word it. I think him behind someone like Kane which will never happen but someone even more realistic like a Werner would be cause defenders nightmares. People are convinced if he is not played up top that suddenly mane and salah goals and assists will start drying up but I honestly don't see how. He is vital to our team yes I agree 100% but not to a point were you sacrifice a striker of kane I know I keep using him ability. People are obsessed with this formation claiming it works ect but to my knowledge we haven't won zilch and I'm not bashing klopp as I'm a huge fan but he has flaws like the rest of us. None of us are perfect but we can't be blinded by problems that are constantly being talked about and scoring is not our main problem but strikers like your henry's Suarez's Torres win you the games you win 1-0 on a rainy nite in stoke ect. I think 4231 better protection to our frail back 4 and still can be dangerous with mane salah coutinho till the summer and firmino and get a striker in Jan or the summer.

{Ed025's Note - firmino is never a striker IR89, he will be couts replacement if he goes to barca i imagine, he misses too many chances for me and as well as not being prolific he finds it difficult to take up scoring positions, liverpool create tons of chances and a decent striker would score 25 goals a season imo mate, unfortunately firmino is not one..

03 Oct 2017 18:13:41
Ed025. I agree 100% with firmino not being a striker nor will he ever be. Appreciate the reply ed.

{Ed025's Note - no probs mate..







 

 

 
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