Liverpool Banter Archive September 08 2015

08 Sep 2015 18:05:57
There's a very interesting article/analysis on the empireofthekop website regarding Liverpool's appalling record art player loans. Here's a snippet:-

Since the 2009/10 season, Liverpool have sanctioned 111 SEPARATE LOAN DEALS. That's 111 finalised temporary deals out of the club, some of which were players leaving multiple times - for example, Danny Wilson left on loan on three occasions.

These 111 deals include 91 separate players.

Of these 91 players who've left Liverpool on loan over the past six campaigns (including this one that's just started), JUST ONE IS A REGULAR, CURRENT FIRST-TEAM PLAYER. Jordon Ibe. The 19-year-old spent time with Birmingham and Derby before establishing himself in our squad.

08 Sep 2015 22:35:13
Dreadful record that shows the shambles we have become at transfers and managing players' careers,

08 Sep 2015 22:56:12
shocking stat

09 Sep 2015 00:43:08
Chelsea have more than that out on loan at one club! Seriously though it's an awful stat I wonder what the figure of the sort of clubs we aspire to be like are probably not half so bad but the context of arsenal Chelsea city United would be nice

09 Sep 2015 07:54:11
We and Chelsea are leading the way with loaned players.

However, Chelsea seem to have a plan given where they are sending their loanees and, according to the eds, keep in regular contact with them and talk through the whys and wherefores of each loan.

We, on the other hand, seem to have spotted that Chelsea are helping their FFP clause by loaning our players, and seem to be following like sheep, rather than understanding how to do it properly.

Would be interested to see, Lenin, if the source at Empire of the kop can find out similar stats for Chelsea as I suspect they have at least generated decent returns for players who have been on loan - Lukaku springs to mind as one.

09 Sep 2015 08:16:38
They made ~£10M off de Bruyne as well, although I imagine they initially would have preferred to kept him a year of two more. Courtois obviously worked out pretty well for them too.

09 Sep 2015 20:24:11
Chelsea have a plan, we don`t. They have made more money from their loan to sell players than we will ever dream of making. that`s a team with a plan.

10 Sep 2015 00:20:15
You lot need to change your red shirts for blue ones. I'm sick of hearing about Chelsea. There are numerous examples of them having no plan whatsoever and they have failures just like every other team. Kakuta being a high profile example. What was that all about? Quite frankly though they can do what they like, I support Liverpool so am only really concerned with us.

08 Sep 2015 11:22:07
So how do we approach the Utd game? A win gets our season back on track whilst a draw could be seen as a good result away to a top four rival. A defeat, however, would be a big blow after the West Ham result.

Should we set up to attack, play an open game and hope that we put away more chances than they do? Do we play conservatively, hoping to edge a tight game or do we park the bus?

Try to leave Rodgers out of your answers, I'm interested in what the fans would do.

08 Sep 2015 12:23:24
The fans will adopt a 3:0 away win approach I think.

08 Sep 2015 12:23:55
4-4-2 diamond. High press. Ings and Benteke up top with Firmino at 10. Can at DM, Hendo and Milner box to box.

08 Sep 2015 12:16:07
This should be a game that the players do not need any motivation for. A loss as you stated would be almost mortal as regards player confidence so I would be setting up to firstly not concede so a counter attack offensive should be deployed. De Gea rumoured to be back between the sticks which does not aid our course.

08 Sep 2015 12:51:29
The issue is not really what the fans would do - sadly we are all experts!!!! The issue is how the team is set up, the whether the players are up for it which, I'm afraid, only 2 or 3 will be. I am dreading this game against a below par United, instead of relishing them over the years. I just hope my lack of confidence is misplaced and we play a blinder. I agree entirely that if we lose, our season is in real trouble so early into the season.

08 Sep 2015 13:16:40
This is not the utd of old- they are there for the taking by a good side with strong motivation, some real pace and attacking flair, and who can also put up a decent organised defence.
They have some problems to address, although not as many as we do.
But utd are THE team who are now looking to beat us to that 4th place finish. In that sense they are now our direct rivals and we should be trying to get the win, although we must avoid a loss at all costs.
A draw means we keep pace with our rivals, and even a loss will not be end of the season of course- but it would add pressure into br and the team to get back to winning ways.
A win means 10 points from 5 games, which brings us right back onto the pace in terms of a 4th place finish.
A loss would mean 7 points from 5 games, which is way off the pace for a top four finish.
If we really want a CL place those players are going to have to turn it on in nearly every game- if they slacken off at all we've had it.

08 Sep 2015 13:19:36
We failed to beat one of the worst UTD team in century last season. I don't see us beating them on Saturday.
On the set up, BR would yet again play a cautious defensive midned set up with two holding players and absorbing all the pressure from the word go.
I would love to see the battle between Clyne and Depay.
Which Liverpool Player would trouble UTD players?
Answer : I don't know.

08 Sep 2015 13:39:11
RedHouse, that's not the spirit! This is about pinning your colours to the mast and saying how you'd approach the game, it's about foresight over hindsight.

I'd go for something similar to Essex but change the personnel slightly with Hendo at the base and Can in front (I think Hendo would be better at releasing runners).

08 Sep 2015 14:31:56
Essex is right on the money. This Utd team is there for the taking and that formation is just what might do it. However, I am afraid he will play those error-prone CB`s again and at that point, i suggest we hold hands and start praying for no rushes of blood to the head from either of those two. having said that, their CB`s are just as aweful. I would take a draw right now but we MUST take our chances when they arrive and for sure, we will win the game.

08 Sep 2015 15:19:49
I just have the worryin feeling he's gona start with the 5 at the back,gomez to go to cb to help protect the other two. Its such a rodgers reactive thing to do. Protect his selection of lovren and skrtel. Think he just won't want to lose.

08 Sep 2015 15:31:02
Lucas can/milner
Hendo
Firmino benteke ibe/ings
Give hendo license to roam, benteke stay Central, possibly on blind if he's cb, not chance against him in the air, and the others press their back line. Lucas sit deep and can or milner just stop their holding midfielder playing, be it carrick or schweinsteiger.

08 Sep 2015 15:44:43
Tactics-wise, I'd have a 4 2 3 1 with benteke up front, milner wide right, coutinho in the middle and firmino left. Lucas and hendo/can in front of a back four of clyne, skrtel, sakho and joe g.
Play good old counterattacking footie in 1st half, and maybe nick a goal on the break early in 2nd half whilst utd are pressing on.
Can is a cracking player but i just don't know where to start him.

08 Sep 2015 16:15:12
Anonymous, Coutinho's suspended, you need to adjust your team.

08 Sep 2015 16:23:47
Anonymush

Countinho is not playing on Saturday.

08 Sep 2015 16:37:44
Park the pus! That is Brendan's only hope.

08 Sep 2015 16:38:48
Of course he isnt, the little tinker. I'll get me coat.

08 Sep 2015 16:50:18
Yeah tot 66. because your attack hasbeen scoring fives and sixes every other week.frankly the arrogance is outstanding 😂😂

08 Sep 2015 16:43:53
I can't see us do anything there without Couts tbh. Even with him United were big favourited given how we look this season. Couts was the only one who. could hold the ball under pressure in midfield. But its not that we know how to park the bus and defend effectively. Another painful Sat I am afraid.

08 Sep 2015 17:32:46
Part of me wonders if Couts not playing maybe a blessing in disguise. Our attack this season has basically been 'give the ball to Coutinho, hope something happens'. This may force us to come up with a better plan.

08 Sep 2015 17:11:51
TOT, come back when you've won a game.

08 Sep 2015 18:02:48
I agree with Essex although
- I would play Lucas over Can as I think we'll need to absorb pressure and he has the experience. Lucas also gives Hendo more license to go forward.
- In defence I'd go Skrtel/Sakho and Clyne/Gomez. Tempted by Moreno but I would prioritise defense over attack away from home.
- Firmino/Ings/Benteke would be a dangerous combo on the break, and for all that Coutinho is one of our best players, this setup has more pace on the counter attack and Firmino will feed Ings runs.

We seem to struggle most against sides with a strong defensive setup and a pacy counterattack, so I'm hoping Man Utd will be a better match with more open play for Firmino/Ings/Benteke to do some damage.

08 Sep 2015 18:15:02
Maybe muscat. At least it will push other players to step up and be counted and don`t forget, Firmino is quite creative himself.

08 Sep 2015 21:35:46
sort of with you muscat red. years ago gerrard was injured, at a time we were expected to drop points due to his injury. if we didn't take maximum points we nearly did.

08 Sep 2015 23:07:35
bore draw by two teams who can't buy a goal. 4-1-3-2 lucas, firmino ,ibe/milner, hendo, ings benteke, go for broke and show some bottle mancs are dross too.

07 Sep 2015 23:10:54
Hi eds

This is not strictly a Liverpool question. Is there any interest from English clubs in UAE's Omar Abdulrahman? He was amazing in a recent qualifier; I think he assisted 6 goals in the match!! I know he had a trial with city a couple of years back but haven't heard anything of him since. Has anyone shown any interest in the player?

Thanks and cheers
Ray

{Ed002's Note - A couple of years ago Abdulrahman was courted by Sporting Lisbon and Manchester City, spending time with both during the summer. There have been a number of clubs Ajax, Hoffenheim, Lyon and Hamburg have also expressed interest in the Al Ain player in the past.

08 Sep 2015 08:56:12
Talking of sporting what happened to the young Dundee lad who was supposed to be the new Scottish messi ?

{Ed002's Note - He is still there.}

08 Sep 2015 10:08:09
Ed2. you probably don't want to answer this but do you have access to an Industry database to pluck this information from or is this all your own notes? Only ask because it's impressive that you can give such detailed answers on such obscure players.

{Ed002's Note - Abdulrahman is hardly obscure, but the notes are mine - some of the information is provided by colleagues.}

08 Sep 2015 06:14:33
How does this work with Milner expecting a central role. Is it that rodgers or whoever else verbally told him that, or is there more to it such as contractual obligation. Basically, can we play him out wide and not expect any fuss? I know he is a class pro but who knows when you're promised something that's taken away.
Also, Can just came out and said he needs to work on his goal and assist output so if one more person gives me a face and tells me he's our new DM when I say we should play Lucas they can fill (themselves) in the(ir) blanks. He can still learn but he's too forward thinking to stay disciplined to that role and I agree with him and his goals.

08 Sep 2015 07:05:39
Excellent point. Someone is wrong here and I always believed Can is an offensive midfielder. No clue what's the scouts were watching in him. For a player whose biggest weakness is positioning could never be a DM.

Milner was promised the central role, if not he was happily playing the wide role at city.

BR now will try to shorn one of Milner / Henderson / Can to the DM role which they are not.

Good luck to him.

08 Sep 2015 07:40:04
Probably had to do with him playing DM quite frequently for the Bayern youth sides, I'd imagine. Frankly I think he'd be a good DM, if he worked at it and wanted to be. Not many better to learn the art of positioning from than Lucas.

08 Sep 2015 08:15:45
RDl

That makes no sense to me mate. Y did we not looked at a readymade DM? We always end up in this confusion every year.

Lols, What happens if All the 4 Midfielders are fit and ready?

We all agree to some extent, BR is pretty much clueless in buying players, But How could the whole club become such backing him buying the same players over and over again.

Had someone asked this question to BR before buying Milner this whole situation wouldn't have come up.

Y are we buying Milner when we have Can here ready to go, let's buy a DM the club needs or a Playmaker the club doesn't have.

08 Sep 2015 08:21:31
Didn't Louw play Can at RB last week?

Maybe coaches see something we don't?

08 Sep 2015 10:32:58
Milner would do a good job for us on the right of midfield, it's up to Rodgers to use his man management skills (yep) to convince Milner that's where he needs to play.

08 Sep 2015 11:33:16
Robboz,

Germany do not play Can at right back because it is Can's best position. They play him there because they're short at full back right now and are trying a number of different players out - Can is one of those players since he is able to play that position not because it's where he is best suited to.

08 Sep 2015 13:13:45
milner should be made into a dm not can - think milner would be ideal for that role - because he don't offer anything going forward in cm

08 Sep 2015 14:41:34
Spot on, Puzzled! because a player plays a position doesn`t mean it is his best position. Germany need a successor to Lahm at RB and are currently experimenting. Besides, we`ve tried Can at CB and RB for the disastrous results we now know of so don`t understand the reason it is being brought up gain. As for Milner and BR`s promises to play him at CM, he is the one who keeps buying similar players for one position. I mentioned many times, what is Milner bringing to the CM position that Lucas, Can or Hendo (already at the club) cannot bring? The transfers are a shambles and this is another illustration of a distinct lack of foresight or strategy wwhen we sign players

08 Sep 2015 16:04:24
EG- if you're looking for me to explain our transfer policy you might be waiting for a while unfortunately as it makes little sense to me either!

08 Sep 2015 17:13:32
EG, simple answer. Not a soul within the club can explain it`s own transfer policy with a straight face based on the shambles we have seen for the past several years

08 Sep 2015 17:32:02
RDL

Lols. I got that. 😄😄😄