Liverpool banter 216497

 

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18 Sep 2017 09:06:32
I'd love a front 3 of Salah, Solanke and Chamberlain tomorrow night against Leicester. I think we could really punish them with Salah and Chambo whipping crosses in from both sides. Solanke showed better movement in 10 minutes against Burnley than Sturridge of Firmino did all game, so give him the cup game from the start!

Salah is simply undroppable in this form though. He doesn't deserve to not play, so if he is fit, he has to start. Hard work and end product should be rewarded. He is well on for 30 goals in all competitions at his current rate of 5 in 8, especially when you consider he got hooked at half time vs City and he started another game from the bench. It will suddenly click for him and the 4 or 5 chances a game he makes for himself will start bringing him 2 or 3 goals instead of 1.

I think we bagged ourselves a gem there. I know everyone is all over Mane, and rightfully so, but i am going to put my head on the block and say Salah will score more than him this season and could be our best winger since John Barnes. There! I said it! 😨

Anyway, sorry for a positive post lads! Normal service may now resume 😂.

Agree10 Disagree0

18 Sep 2017 09:47:54
I wouldn't be dropping firmino Adam.
Front 3 of salah, firmino and the ox for me.
I would like to see Robertson and Karius play as well.

18 Sep 2017 09:52:24
Yep agree that Solanke should start in the cup match.
Gomez at CB would be nice too to see how he looks.
I'd rest Firmino and Salah for the weekend personally.
AOC, Woodburn to start on the wings hopefully.
Rest TAA and try Milner at RB.
Ward/ Karius in goal, obviously ha.

{Ed025's Note - i would not rest TAA kev, hes a young fit lad who needs games under his belt to improve and get experience mate..

18 Sep 2017 09:53:39
Mk im not a liverpool supporter. But i agree on salah your team looks better balanced with him up there but the glaring miss is a centre forward. Firmino is not a cf and the whole team struggle without the focal point. I think firmino is a really good player he is not a cf.
Obviously your defence is the issue so a change of shape is what's required imo to 4231. Solanke or studge up 3 behind mane firmino salah.

18 Sep 2017 09:54:49
Salah might need some rest! I would play Coutinho to
Improve his match sharpness as well Woodburn. I want to see how they both work together.

18 Sep 2017 10:13:30
So make a load more changes and play youngsters and fringe players and then moan after the game if we loose?

18 Sep 2017 10:18:58
I know what you're saying Ed025 of course, but TAA had a poor game on Saturday and we will have to play him in the Champions League game next week as well as possibly against Leicester at the weekend (unless Gomez gets the nod) .
Gomez is banned for the European game and Clyne is out injured/ not registered.
TAA is only 18 and I personally wouldn't want to risk burning him out.
Long season, he's only a kid and not strong enough to play every match yet and the priorities are surely League and European results.
He can sit out the cup match I feel.
We'd like to win obviously but there are more important matches coming up in the next 12 days.

18 Sep 2017 10:59:32
Not sure i agree we need a centre forward, ken. With how we play the wide men are expected to come narrow and attack the penalty area. Mane and Salah will be good for plenty of goals each this season. Firmino dropping in creates the space fir them to run into. A centre forward in our first choice team will occupy spaces Mane and Salah want to run into and hurt our overall game.

However, in some matches when the primary tactics aren't working, i would like to see Klopp switch the wingers back to being on the right side fir crossing with their strong foot, and Solanke put in the box for a more physical presence who wants to attack balls into the box.

Unless we could get someone like Lewandowski, Kane, Aubameyang or Suarez though, i don't see how a centre forward will improve us in general. Yes for certain games, but Firmino is vital to our play.

Besides, Kane, Lacazette and Morata didn't help their teams score this weekend did they! Different tactics require different players, and every single system or style will occassionally draw a blank. That is football. Pining for something different every time you are disappointed with a result is just sad though. Nobody wanted a centre forward when we won 4-0 against Arsenal after putting 6 past Hoffenheim in two legs, and 3 past Watford on the opening day. We've apparently had a terrible week in front of goal yet we still scored 3 goals, missed a penalty, and should've had about 3 other penalties. Klopp should've put Solanke on sooner, but he had faith in the team he picked to start. Just unlucky for him that the finishing let us down on the day.

18 Sep 2017 11:19:30
I didn't think so neither MK but then Ed01 made a good point the other day. A midfield partnership does tend to work better than 3 (threeship? ) . They get to know each other better- when to go, stay etc. An out and out striker would mean Bobby dropping back in to a number 10. Klopp has already said how useful his movement his to open up space for other attackers.

Then Can, Hendo, Coutinho, Wijnaldum, Lallana battling for the midfield two. Henderson and Coutinho for me btw. In a bizarre round about way it could even help out our defence. But that's probably hope more than anything else.

18 Sep 2017 11:33:51
The reason above all that a good poacher would work for is in the case of a Plan B.
We always struggle to break down deep lying defences.
A poacher would get in amongst them and have them chasing shadows with movement causing confusion and leaving spaces.
A false 9 is useless against the likes of Burnley.
There are already plenty of spaces in the attacking midfield positions as the defence is sitting deep. Hence why our players took extraordinary amounts of long range shots on Saturday. Plenty of space 30 to 40 yards out, but no options in the box. Sturridge doesn't sit in the box and his movement is not as good as it used to be as we all know. A poacher would have scored from the spilled shot in the second half and Solanke hitting the bar from right under it just shows we need a world class poacher to mop those chances up. He's still raw and learning his game. So not fair to rely on him too much.

18 Sep 2017 11:42:35
Use the width more and stop playing narrow. One or the other way you will succeed in breaking the shape of opposition. Full backs are most important to break the china wall. The way we scored against Sevilla. All you need is couple of boadies inside the 6 yard box and their movements will create chances. Bobby is deadly in and around the 6 yard box as well Wijnaldum! Two players who should be scoring enough if the supply from full backs are good!

18 Sep 2017 11:52:38
You've misinterpreted Ed001's point Bledd, or at least you have in my opinion.

A midfield 2 isn't better than a 3, it is just easier to develop an understanding. The problem was not it being a 3, it was that we had too many similar players in the 3, who weren't communicating.

I think Ed001's point was that we have to establish clearer roles within the 3, rather than ditch it and switch to a 2.

For me, the 3 should consist of a holding midfielder, a box to box midfielder, and an attacking midfielder. The problem we had was that Can, Henderson and Gini were all trying to play box to box and their was nobody sitting back because they all went together.

I perhaps have misinterpreted Ed001's post, but i did not read it as a suggestion we should switch back to a midfield 2.

People are not grasping this though. We currently play a front 3. It makes us susceptible to the counter, but it also makes us lethal going forward. Don't let a couple of off games (in which we scored 3, missed a penalty and got denied other clear penalties by the way) cloud your judgement on that. Switching to a single forward and a 5 man midfield will not make us more potent, but we would get more 1-0 victories as we'd be more solid. It would be a total waste of Mane and Salah though. They are unique wide players in that they almost play as strikers at times.

Are myself and Bingo seriously the only people who can see how vital Firmino dropping deeper is to creating gaps in the defence for Mane and Salah to exploit? After Hoffenheim Firmino was the best thing since sliced bread and now he has missed a penalty he needs binning?

To play a system with a lone striker you have to have someone up front capable of scoring 20-30 league goals a season, because you will stifle the goal scoring exploits of your midfielders. We do not have a Kane, Lukaku, Costa etc type player though so we'd just end up not scoring most weeks and wasting Mane and Salah in more defensive midfield roles.

What is wrong with people? 1 bad week and they want to bin the system which has put us back on the football map? Whining about things they don't have instead of appreciating the beautiful football our front 3 is playing. We have lost 1 game this season and that whole result hinged on a red card. Get over it.

18 Sep 2017 12:00:02
Two away games at Leicester isn't good news considering our last outings there didn't look at it. Also take into account the complete lack of protection for the centre backs and the inability of anyone who is paid to play at centre back to perform competently and you have a recipe for a very painful week.

18 Sep 2017 12:05:57
I personally never said anything about dropping Firmino.
Haven't seen anyone else state this either.
He's an Attacking Midfielder naturally no so why not use him as one in games such as Saturday's?!
There's plenty of room for 2 wingers, a Striker and an Attacking Midfielder vs a team like Burnley. You could even argue that there's room for 2 Attacking Midfielders in a match like that (Coutinho) .
These are games we should be overpowering them.
Use our strength (Attacking talent) .

18 Sep 2017 12:23:44
We've got two games a week for the foreseeable future. Klopp needs to make sure his regular starters get a break at some point and tomorrow's the night for it I reckon.

18 Sep 2017 12:41:19
Thanks for the shout out, MK. The typical "we need striker" narrative is getting boring and desperate after every bad result. Had we beaten Seville and Burnley by three goals, this pathetic narrative would not be coming up so why it always comes up, I have no idea. We don't play with a typical CF as our wide forwards are strikers who play narrow hence, they go against CB's who are simply no match for their trickery and pace. Just ask the Arsenal and City and Hoff CB's. This is why we are unstoppable when on form and with Firmino's guile, skill, vision and intelligence, he is perfect for that system.

Bar maybe Lewandowski (Klopp's creation), I don't see wherany other typical no. 9 would fit in as he will be attacking the spaces that Mane and Salah attack. MK has explained another flaw in the system as well if a normal no. 9 is used. This whole striker thingy is nothing but a misnomer and a false argument. We already tried Benteke in that role for the disaster we know of so why revisit what we know does NOT work?

18 Sep 2017 13:15:14
I think we should play a 2nd team in the cup and our best available on Saturday. We must stay in contention for top 4 even at this early stage.

18 Sep 2017 13:16:00
Bingo, are you telling me that if you were given a "Mulligan" on the match from Saturday, that you'd play the same system again after it failed over the weekend?
Have you ever heard of the famous saying about insanity and failure? :
Trying the same thing over and over even though it doesn't work and leads to failure is basically insane.
So Hernandez for example wouldn't have gobbled up a goal or two vs Burnley from the amount of chances we created in and around the goalmouth - Solanke's miss, the shot that was spilled by Nick Pope into the middle of the goalmouth with no (that's zero) Liverpool players within 15 yards of the loose ball?
Come on mate and open your eyes!
You even have non Lfc fans telling you that we need a striker.
One who would stick in the loose balls, also drag CBs all over the place and cause confusion.
If you think only a false 9 can do that, you're nuts.
Look at the 2 teams at the top of the table.
Do they play with Strikers or false 9's?
Are they struggling to break teams down?
You lot need to wake up if you don't see how much nonsense you write at times.
It's borderline stubborn, a bit like Klopp in fact!

18 Sep 2017 14:34:18
Olirish, not bothereded as to what non LFC fan (esp. mancs who wish us no good) have to say about me or my posts so I will not respond to that part of your post. Now, to your true point. Again, it is a false narrative, IMO. Why? We played with a top striker in Studge and what happened? He like the others, fluffed his lines and was making bad decisions on when to pass or shoot. Same with Kane and Morata. They fluffed their lines and no goals were scored and their teams like us, drew.
The tactics and the line up was fine with me as we played all our attacking players in the line up as we knew Burnley would play ten guys deep. Also, we have played with a false 9 since last season and we are top 4 in goals scored in the PL in that span so why is it such an issue now? We thumped Arsenal 4-0, Hoff 6-2 on agg. and scored 3 at Watford in second gear so again, did we need a top striker with all these goals flying in? That debate never came up at the time so why is it coming up now?
I stand by my statement as the facts and numbers back me up on it. Now, did we create a lot of clear cut chances? No. Could we move things around a bit to accommodate Solanke earlier in the second half? Prolly. Did we do enough to open them up? Fairly yes and had our boys been a bit more composed, made better decisions and had the valid penalty that the pundits should have been given not been turned down, we win and this is a non issue. I deal in facts, my friend, not what he said/ she said and as they say in American politics: "Facts are very stubborn". So if that makes me stubborn like Klopp on this issue, so be it.

18 Sep 2017 15:20:26
You're showing serious immaturity by the way you speak about rival fans. They're here on a banter site. They're discussing their passion, football and how do you know their true intention?
So editors on this site who don't support Liverpool? You think they have ill will too or are they different? Maybe you should stop being so cynical and judging others off of your own behaviour or ideas?!
Sturridge IS NOT a top Striker. He's unable to make a plain, average English team. How is he a top Striker? How many games has he played and scored in the past 3 seasons? Man wake up to your own nonsense.
Kane is a decent Striker. Spurs nearly won the league last season didn't they? He's finished as TOP SCORER in the league the past 2 seasons but can't score in every match without a little help. What team last won the league with a False 9 in every match?
Now what was the last team to win the league playing a Striker?
Who won the Champion League last season? Do they play a False 9? Nope they play a number 9, an out and out Striker? Who won the Europa league last season? Did or do they play a False 9? Nope! Both Manchester are running a mock in the league so far, they play wiiiiith. you've guessed it, a Striker! I rest my case. A false 9 doesn't win titles regularly. In my opinion because not enough chances, poacher's chances are gobbled up due to not enough bodies near the goal enough of the time.
One more time, only insane people carry on with doing something that is proven to not work.

18 Sep 2017 15:40:04
You are in no position to tell me what I can or can't post about a rival fan who comes on here to tell us that our manager is not good enough and he will be a failure. Now that is disrespectful as I would not go to their boards (I never do as I can't be arsed) to insult their manager to their faces regardless of what I think of him. Not judging. It is what they said. You don't see Ed25 (Everton fan), Ed33 (Celtic fan, I think) doing any of that nonsense, do you? You may see that as being fine BUT I don't so let's end that crap right now and calling me immature is out of order as I never called you any names during our debate. Keep it civil, pls.

Now to your post. Again, a false narrative that is only coming up cos we haven't taken our chances. Studge is a top striker. FACT. A different breed of striker BUT striker nonetheless so there goes your talking point. Other teams are set up differently to ours and Klopp has set us up to attack this way and by all accounts, it works. The system works. FACT. If it did not for the past 18 months, you would have a point BUT it does hence, you don't. We will agree to disagree on this one so personally, I'm over it. God bless, my friend.

{Ed025's Note - putting FACT after a statement does not automatically make it true bingo, sturride being a top striker for instance is your point of view as is the system working, other posters from teams have as much right as anyone else to comment on here as long as they are respectful and polite, one to one arguments are frowned upon because they usually end up as a slanging match so my advice would be to just ignore posts that you feel might start or incite a confrontation, this is not a dig at you just a guide to what we expect from our patrons mate..

18 Sep 2017 16:14:43
My apologies if you take it personally my opinion of your attitude towards other clubs' fans posting here.
I'm not here for an internet fight, but I hope you don't disrespect these posters going forward.
Just because this is a Liverpool page doesn't mean they're not allowed to give an opinion on us. They might be valid opinions, they might not. But they're entitled to post.
I value their opinion because they're not emotionally attached like us so believe it or not they make sense a lot of the time. FACT Lol!
For 3 or more seasons Sturridge has not played or scored regularly for us. He's not currently a top Striker! By your reckoning Ings is a top Striker.
I can't be bothered writing anymore on the system as the results speak for themselves.
If we win the league come May, I'll come back on here and give you my apologies (again) but we both know that is extremely unlikely as for one our defence is awful and two, our attack sits too deep against deep lying defences. Blah blah blah! I'm done on this now. Take it easy Bingo.







 

 

 
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