15 Apr 2024 10:23:29
Morning Eds
With the way the last few weeks have gone obviously the reverting back to the slow and very laboured build up hasn't helped, but do you think it has exposed that maybe some of the players are good with patches of excellent form, rather than top class players or do you think maybe it's just a little stale and a new manager would give us a fresh start?
Thinking really of the likes of Konate, Endo, Szobo, Diaz, Jones, Elliot, Gakpo mostly.
I think personally it's time to move Sapah on this summer, he has been unbelievable but we can't afford to let him go for free and I don't think it's plausible to give him a massive extension.
{Ed001's Note - this is on tactics and that is the issue.}
15 Apr 2024 11:33:58
This is my two cents, for what it’s worth.
We have been poor for a while now. And those late winners were not really telling the full story if someone was just looking at the league table. Whilst many were screaming mentality monsters after those victories, many of us were saying it wasn’t sustainable, and here we are. Not even a knee jerk reaction as I said it before this game, but I hope and expect there to be a massive clear out this summer. I can easily make a justification for near enough half the players in this squad being moved on. In regards to Klopp, the man is a legend for everything he has done, there is no question about that. And I thank him for giving me the best memories supporting this club. But let’s be honest, he is not the best tactically and for me his tenure at Liverpool has run it’s course and it’s time for him to leave. He is making so many glaring tactical missteps it’s unreal and to compound matters he has no plan B when things are going bad. It’s either arrogance or incompetence, or even both. It’s worrying when the manager makes the same fixable mistakes over and over again, and saying that I can almost guarantee that Klopp will continue to set us up in a 433 with the same tactics until the season finishes, even if we continue to drop points.
Another observation is it appears there seems to be a lot going on with the players behind the scenes. I and many others have said before that there has been a visible shift in mentality and energy after Klopp announced he was leaving. I think a number of players have decided to leave this summer and the squad are aware of who those players are. I think Klopp has lost the fear factor with the players and dare I say, the respect of some. Then you have some players who have been protected by Klopp for far too long who are worried about their position in the squad, let alone the first team. Then you have others who have fought to gain the trust of Klopp like your Bradley’s who are thinking will the new manager fancy me. And you have your blatant Klopp signings in Gravenberch who know they were a Klopp signing and are thinking they could (and should IMO) be shipped out. One player who is probably jumping for joy is Elliott. The lad plays well and gets dropped for the likes of Gravenberch. Also, we was he benched for Jones and why were other subs brought on before him against Palace? Baffling to say the least. Anyways, I trust Edwards and Hughes to handle a summer clear out and I’m actually excited if and when it happen, especially if we get Amorim.
The saying life comes at you fast can never be more true than after todays results. From quadruple to Carabao Cup in the blink of an eye. If we don’t win another trophy, this has got to be one of the biggest capitulation I have seen in the league for some time. And despite Klopp making far too many tactical errors for my liking. I really wanted him to have a good send off for everything he has done for us, and that is looking unlikely now. Sad to see us finish the season like this.
15 Apr 2024 12:13:08
Seen a few talking about mentality, and I can see why as it is clear heads have dropped. I don't think that is on these players or their quality, however. We have a great squad, and if we don't win another trophy this will be our fourth consecutive year of performing below our potential, as far as I am concerned.
I think the players do look mentally fragile and rocked at this moment but I agree with Ed001, that all stems from the tactics. Stupid, overly complex and lazy tactics that they no longer have faith in. Titles are built on defence because it gives you a base to work from. Forwards are more likely to make the right decisions when they aren't being asked to bail out the rest of the team all the time. I'm not sure if any of our forwards look like long term starters for Liverpool right now, but I don't think the demands being placed on them every week are helping.
We haven't been in control of football matches all season. Constantly chasing and coming from behind takes its toll, mentally and physically. The manager doesn't appear bothered by this and hasn't been for the last four seasons, if we're being honest. I think a new manager that can bring some intensity, sharpness and attention to detail would make this group of players look brilliant again. We have been fortunate enough to have the best goalkeeper, centre back and right back of this generation, and haven't won either of the big trophies with them in the past four seasons.
In years to come, I feel Klopp's tenure will be viewed as follows. Years 1-5, some of the most flawless football management you will ever see. Years 6-9, a huge missed opportunity and failure to capitalise given the talent at our disposal.
The things that the manager is saying in post-match at this moment sound completely alien, he is a shadow of the manager he was a few years ago. He doesn't appear to be doing his homework on the opposition tactics at all and is placing the blame on his players, which is a first.
It is definitely time for a change. I hope that in years to come we can look back and say that one of the greatest things that Klopp ever did was leave at the right time, not dragging it out any further in the manner that Wenger did. Sad to see it end this way, but if nothing else, it is reassuring to confirm that his departure is what is best for the club.
15 Apr 2024 12:36:31
We have only really battered a couple of teams this year, we have labored through and now we are getting caught, we all look shot, staff and players, not sure why the kids aren't still playing as they really gave everything, Salah, Diaz defiantly need to move on, purely to give us funds, I am massively excited to have Amorim come in and do something different, Klopp has been slated for no plan B but Amorim changes play each game, the players need a new start too.
15 Apr 2024 12:38:26
Honestly lads, we've been rubbish a while now and defeats were coming - we seem to have abandoned the high energy pressing game again and gone back to a slow possession based system - why?
We look so much better with a high energy press, quick football and width - now we've went back to a slow possession game, passing for passing sake that opposition teams love defending against
Coupled with some poor performances and defensive lapse, we inevitably concede and then struggle to score - is this a tactical switch? If so, it is simply wrong and surely recent performances would show that?
Though we have been poor and whilst a lot of it seems a change in system/ tactics/ style of play etc; we have still created enough chances to win those games - our forwards could really do with finding their shooting boots again.
15 Apr 2024 12:40:49
Alonso - What you’ve said regarding behind the scenes is interesting in that there is little evidence for a lot of it, yet if it WERE true it would make a lot of sense.
A not-insignificant number of our players (Gravenberch, Robertson, Konate, Diaz, Gakpo etc. ) absolutely should be worried about their place in the squad, some for quality concerns and others for their poor availability. Klopp, for all his abilities, has proven to be a rather average judge of talent and our signings, at least in combination with Klopp’s poor deployment of them, are not offering the value they did in the early part of Klopp’s reign. As for Bradley, the new manager will not have a choice but to favour him - he’s a fantastic player and will be exceptional in any system.
I was devastated when Klopp announced he was leaving. Not anymore. He’s massively underachieved in the last two seasons and it’s entirely his fault. Hopefully the new manager will make us a bit less unserious tactically and we won’t have to start games 0-1 down next season.
15 Apr 2024 12:43:09
It’s the slow starts to the game that’s the most puzzling to me. How can all the coaches and sports science experts not sort this out. I honestly can’t remember a single game were the whistle blows and we go for it. Even this game against CP we start slow after the shock of a 0-3 lost at home. Klopps words were there will be a reaction. Well the only reaction was leaving a player standing in acres of space unmarked to tap a winning goal in.
15 Apr 2024 13:39:11
AW - great post and hard to argue with any of it.